At Last The Big TD5 job

Lovely. Be good to see you.

raywin said:

I recon that's it someone bent it up and then just left it floating about, it's been on my hit list for a while now.
I am still waiting for all my parts to come, and hope to start rebuilding very soon and wrap things up by the end of next week, would be nice to give it a run over to your project when I am happy its OK.

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Its what I did to get my gearbox off to change the clutch. Not so easy to bend back to get the bolts through again though.

brianconwy said:

Its what I did to get my gearbox off to change the clutch. Not so easy to bend back to get the bolts through again though.
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I suppose that's why people bend them up and leave them there.

It's easier to get the bellhousing bolted onto the block and then take the top two bolts out and bend the tabs back down. Then squash 'em into place using a longer 10mm bolt to begin with and then the original ones.

Brown said:

I suppose that's why people bend them up and leave them there.

It's easier to get the bellhousing bolted onto the block and then take the top two bolts out and bend the tabs back down. Then squash 'em into place using a longer 10mm bolt to begin with and then the original ones.

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I managed to bend mine back and get the bolts through with a struggle but I now have taken the engine out and when I get another engine, I might try using longer bolts to start. But there again I didn't need to bend the tabs taking the engine out.

brianconwy said:

I managed to bend mine back and get the bolts through with a struggle but I now have taken the engine out and when I get another engine, I might try using longer bolts to start. But there again I didn't need to bend the tabs taking the engine out.

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Well, if I was taking the engine out I'd probably be taking all the hoses off anyway, so it would be a bit easier in that respect. The problem arises because whenever I've had the gearbox off I've tried to do with without having to drain and disassemble the cooling system.

I have the engine out and also two of the radiators. Not as much room in a disco as a defender. Especially at the back of the engine.

Bit of a pain with the Vac pump its from a discovery TD5 and the fittings are different, the oil/air return to the timing chain cover is different and wont fit started to try and take it out but its well sealed in, I had a vision of wrecking both units, so I used discretion and just cleaned out the old pump lubricated it and put it back in.



So I've been doing some cleaning up and getting stuff ready then my Christmas box arrived from Island 4x4


So im going from stripping down to building up now, had a good clean up and blow down with compressed air
Fitted the main bearing shells, and checked the were in flush



I lubricated them with Miller assembly oil its like snot, fit the thrust pads, Drop in the crank shaft and put the caps on, then I noticed I had put them on the wrong way round i.e. 6 to 1 instead of 1 to 6,
Stupid thing to do I took them off and changed them. it seems to turn nicely now
Pulled up the bearing cap bolts, I used the old ones thinking they would be fine, but when I pulled them up the last 90 degrees then I did not like the feel and I went in and ordered new bolts for main and big end caps will swap them over when they arrive.



Took out the piston rings cleaned and checked the grooves, scraped the carbon from the top of the pistion, checked the ring gap in the bore and its fine, so started to install pistons arrow to the front. I fitted the pistons with the top ring gap at 1 o'clock second ring at 5 o'clock and bottom ring at 1 o'clock to spread out the gaps and keep them away from the LH side. Dont know if tht is the best but could'nt find much info and I think they can migrate to the position that suits them anyway



Top half of the shells were a bit worn, not clear here but you can almst see the copper coming through on one of them


I cleaned up the head blew it with air then installed all the valves, bit of a pain getting the collets in place I stuck them with some molly grease, sory no picture, I meant to photograph evry little bit but quite honestly when you are up to the arm pits in muck and oil and impation to get done it sometimes gets left

Put the number one cylinder TDC and put on the timing chain set to the marks, then bolted on the timing chain cover sealing it with silicone.


I have an E15 socket but its onlt 3/8" square drive, I dont want it to bust when I am pulling up the head bolts so I oredred a Bacho one which is 1/2" drive, so back to a bit of cleaning up and prep work, hope to fit the head but I must admit I keep checking things over and over dont want to make a mistake.

Going well , I got the kings bearings and was happy with them, it’s the little things that can cause an issue , have you got some blue sealant in the bottom block holes, I lost time and patience fitting the head bolts cos I had’nt cleaned the holes proper and tested bolts all the way to bottom and then learned the Same lesson again on the sump!
I dint have a compressed air supply but improvise the bike floor pump with a bit brake pipe in end for blowing out the holes

steve2286w said:

Going well , I got the kings bearings and was happy with them, it’s the little things that can cause an issue , have you got some blue sealant in the bottom block holes, I lost time and patience fitting the head bolts cos I had’nt cleaned the holes proper and tested bolts all the way to bottom and then learned the Same lesson again on the sump!
I dint have a compressed air supply but improvise the bike floor pump with a bit brake pipe in end for blowing out the holes

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When you mention the bottom block holes do you mean the ones the long head bolts go into ? I am going to clean them out and air blast them just before I fit the head, also been tapping out some of the threads in the block and running a die nut down some of the bolts like the ones holding the timing chain cover.
Decided to try and get the new engine wireing loom in today while the weather is decent, its no joke I tell you.
I will also do the power steering hose which runs along the front cross member if I get time. it all saves time when I cone to install the engine.

Just hanging on for the new big end and main bearing cap bolts, so I decided to change the engine wire loom, and power steering hose.
I was a bit confused by the differences in the new loom but discovered that it's a air conditioning loom so has a couple of extra relays and two extra plugs, so I installed it today ignoring the extras, it's a pig of a job even with the engine out had to take off the transmission cover cubby box and the plate under the box, even then it's not easy, hope this loom is sound.
The tube nuts on the steering hose were a bit old and reluctant to come out, but did it (bit messy) so hope to get moving tomorrow.

Looking good Ray.

Remarkably clean engine there, mine has always been a mucky bugger - but as I found out on the last rebuild, 5 conrods with worn small end bushings really does not help at all

Regarding the lack of wear on the shells, I can't help but notice that your engine has an AMC head, did you fit that? Perhaps previous owner renewed the bearings when the head was replaced (assuming you didn't)...

Also, regrading the cam, try and use a high zinc content oil, the TD5 head is very similar to VW PD type engines and they require their own higher zinc content oil formulations - most oils changed to be low zinc at the time they went low ash, this was to prevent damage to catalytic converters. Unfortunately it doesn't help the cam/rocker rollers in the TD5.

Bennehboy said:

Looking good Ray.

Remarkably clean engine there, mine has always been a mucky bugger - but as I found out on the last rebuild, 5 conrods with worn small end bushings really does not help at all

Regarding the lack of wear on the shells, I can't help but notice that your engine has an AMC head, did you fit that? Perhaps previous owner renewed the bearings when the head was replaced (assuming you didn't)...

Also, regrading the cam, try and use a high zinc content oil, the TD5 head is very similar to VW PD type engines and they require their own higher zinc content oil formulations - most oils changed to be low zinc at the time they went low ash, this was to prevent damage to catalytic converters. Unfortunately it doesn't help the cam/rocker rollers in the TD5.

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Hi Ben
Thanks, just to let you know I used your rebuild as a guide to some parts of the work. The new head was fitted just before I bought it by the previous owner, it may have been the straw that broke the camel's back and made him sell it as he did not work on it himself. I also wondered about the shells being changed when the head was done, someone told me if original the shells say land rover on the back will check that out.
I have been using halfords 5 w40 oil since I bought it, which oil do you use?
The engine was really scabby when I took it out, and I have loads of time so decided to clean it up a bit, but within reason, expect will soon get mucky again.
One bad spot is the front LH side around the alternator and vacuum pump, not 100% sure where it gets out but I ordered some silicone hoses to replace the vac pump to timing cover pipe see if that helps.
Just waiting for island to deliver new bolts and I can crack on.

I had the same oil issue around my vac pump outlet, but it was actually oil escaping the front crank seal and being blown around the side.

Regarding oil, I tend to wait for Halfords to have a half price offer on Castrol Magentic 5w30 fully synth, I then add a ZDDP additive to the oil when I do a change.

Failing that, just any decent quality 5w30 fully synth, 5w40 should be just fine in UK climate too but might lower mileage a smidge due to increased viscosity (ha, like we'd ever notice).

Bennehboy said:

I had the same oil issue around my vac pump outlet, but it was actually oil escaping the front crank seal and being blown around the side.

Regarding oil, I tend to wait for Halfords to have a half price offer on Castrol Magentic 5w30 fully synth, I then add a ZDDP additive to the oil when I do a change.

Failing that, just any decent quality 5w30 fully synth, 5w40 should be just fine in UK climate too but might lower mileage a smidge due to increased viscosity (ha, like we'd ever notice).

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Well sitting around waiting for a delivery so I popped out and took a look, and it looks like the shells were original, so either they were replaced with original parts or they are genuine 120K miles.

I looked for some additive for the oil but I think its no longer sold in the UK.

raywin said:

Well sitting around waiting for a delivery so I popped out and took a look, and it looks like the shells were original, so either they were replaced with original parts or they are genuine 120K miles.

I looked for some additive for the oil but I think its no longer sold in the UK.]

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Probably just been treated very well then, mine's been ragged within an inch of its life.

I usually buy the ZDDP stuff on fleabay - only place I can find it.

Those bearings look ok.

Hate to think what my 185k bearings look like lol.

I'd blow out and brake clean all the bolts holes for peace of mind..

I usually wash out a fresh build 3-4 times, ya don't want grease and/or crap going in there while building.

I use diluted simple green and big-small bottle brushes.

Henry_b said:

Those bearings look ok.

Hate to think what my 185k bearings look like lol.

I'd blow out and brake clean all the bolts holes for peace of mind..

I usually wash out a fresh build 3-4 times, ya don't want grease and/or crap going in there while building.

I use diluted simple green and big-small bottle brushes.

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Hope to be on it this afternoon , I want to blow out the bearing cap bolt holes and the head bolt holes.
Must confess I keep looking around hoping I haven't missed anything before I put the head on.

Bennehboy said:

Probably just been treated very well then, mine's been ragged within an inch of its life.

I usually buy the ZDDP stuff on fleabay - only place I can find it.

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Just found some and ordered it, I may use some 5 w30 semi synthetic I have with addative run it for a month then change it out.

Well parcel man came, while I was waiting ran a die nut down the bolts for the bottom end stiffener ( one that has the oil pump on it)
I did the main bearing caps one at a time ( they were already tighthtened with the old bolts) and then did the big ends, I notice that the main bearing caps can move slightly along the axis of the crank shaft so I spent some time centering them before tightening, torqued them all then angle tightened, crank turns nice and freely.
Done my best here.



Put back the stiffener with a new gasket on the oil pump end and torqued up the bolts, I put a bit of loctite on the threads just in case.



When I stripped the engine the oil pump bolt did not have and locking compound on it so I was lucky to get to 120K miles with no unhappy ending.
I ordered a genuine bolt and fitted it today but I did not like the feel of it, it was not stiff enough, I am worried it may not hold for another 120 K so I'm considering taking it back out and putting some locktite on the threads then re fitting it.
Anyone experienced this?

It is supposed to be torqued to 25nm so it will depend on the torque wrench used how tight that will feel. A short 1/4" will feel tighter than using a longer 1/2" wrench. I am sure it will be fine. When I get an engine for our disco I am going to use brake cleaner to clean the threads, add some extra loctite 242 to supplement the original and then torque it up to that value + a couple of nm extra in case the torque wrench is at the other end of its tolerance.

brianconwy said:

It is supposed to be torqued to 25nm so it will depend on the torque wrench used how tight that will feel. A short 1/4" will feel tighter than using a longer 1/2" wrench. I am sure it will be fine. When I get an engine for our disco I am going to use brake cleaner to clean the threads, add some extra loctite 242 to supplement the original and then torque it up to that value + a couple of nm extra in case the torque wrench is at the other end of its tolerance.

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I used my 3/8" torque wrench but as I screwed the bolt in it never felt any tighter, usually you can feel as the locking compound goes into the threads.
Would just be my luck if it ran 120k with no compound and then let go when it gets the new bolt in.