The Lakes on my owne

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fenby1976 said:
Ratty, are you an undercover member of the health and safety police or something? Am I in big trouble? I promise I'll be good from now on - no more fun for me! I've seen the error of my ways now: I'll buy one of those pannic buttons to go around my neck and just stay at home with some breathing apparatus next to me. I'll put on some safety gogles, ear defenders, dust mask and a crash helmet, wrap myself in cotton wool and just wait to die of old age;)
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ha..........ha.........haha........................ha...........

Nope. my laugh doesn't wanna start.

Which bit of post 56 did you find it hardest to understand. When you go out without back-up and something goes wrong are you gonna get yourself out the **** or call somebody else to do it for you? When you have used your 'phone a friend' lifeline and your mates tell you to **** off who do you do call next? AA, RAC, Greenflag, Brittania Rescue, Police, Coastguard, Firebrigade, Ambulance service, Lifeboat, Search and rescue, mountain rescue? Go on. Who are YOU gonna call? YOU are gonna call somebody else to get YOU out the **** that YOU knowingly put yourself in.

Then. And only then. Will you understand what I am talking about.

There is a big difference between a genuine accident and a **** with a 'It'll never happen to me' accident.

When you hear of these accidents in remote places did you ever stop to think 'How the fook are they gonna get that/them outta there?' No I doubt it.

If you wanna come on here being the big I am with your 'I've never been stuck attitude' thats fine. But make sure you leave your phone at home when you go. If you take it with you it makes you the Hypocrit that I KNOW you are cos it means you intend to call someone when YOU have messed up.
 
Check my previous posts Ratty! I don't know what gave you the impression that I have a 'It'll never happen to me attitude'. - going solo greenlaning is just a risk I'm prepared to take. I really have got away with it up until now though. I know things will go wrong one day, (they nearly did yesterday - broken rear halfshaft - managed to get home in front wheel drive) but I do have a back up plan for breakdowns/bogdowns: Walk or cycle to the nearest farm (I usually do a mountainbiking/greenlaning weekend); Negotiate a price to tow me out to the road with my emergency cash; Wait for the RAC to turn up. As a further back up, I always take camping equipment with me.

The risk of an accident is no greater than when we are out mountain biking in the middle of nowhere and certainly far less than trailriding on enduro bikes, which I used to do.

How safe do/would you feel cycling through a city compared to greenlaning, Ratty?
 
we arnt saying that we wont and dont get stuck just that wen we do ther is wors things that can happen. if i loos my vehical forever then that is my folt and i will deal with it. i understand your consurn that i may go out all starey eyed and get stuck and cry about it but thats not true. yes if i loos my landy the missis will go ape but agane thats my problem and not yours.

been looking at the old coach road. dose anyone have any info on the talk of a big pit being dug across it in the hope too catch unwarey 4x4s?
 
fenby1976 said:
Check my previous posts Ratty! I don't know what gave you the impression that I have a 'It'll never happen to me attitude'. - going solo greenlaning is just a risk I'm prepared to take. I really have got away with it up until now though. I know things will go wrong one day, (they nearly did yesterday - broken rear halfshaft - managed to get home in front wheel drive) but I do have a back up plan for breakdowns/bogdowns: Walk or cycle to the nearest farm (I usually do a mountainbiking/greenlaning weekend); Negotiate a price to tow me out to the road with my emergency cash; Wait for the RAC to turn up. As a further back up, I always take camping equipment with me.

The risk of an accident is no greater than when we are out mountain biking in the middle of nowhere and certainly far less than trailriding on enduro bikes, which I used to do.

How safe do/would you feel cycling through a city compared to greenlaning, Ratty?
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There ya go again. Get farmer to sort out YOUR MISTAKE. Get RAC to sort out YOUR MISTAKE.

Nice to know YOU take responsibility for YOUR MISTAKE.

Do you understand the difference between I (singular) and we (plural)? If more than 1 person goes out in more than 1 vehicle your chance of survival are 10 times better if a problem were to occur.

If you crashed, got bogged, got injured etc and were unable to walk, talk, get out your vehicle etc What would you do? If there is a second vehicle with you he might not be able to get you or your vehicle out but he can alert somebody that you need help.

I have no problem with cycling through a city because if I was run over, mugged, shot etc. It is easy to get help to where I am be me dead or alive.

The same CANNOT be said for offroading. If you are out on your own and are knocked unconcious YOU CANNOT call 999 and there is nobody else with you to do it either. YOU CANNOT cycle to the nice farmers house. YOU CANNOT set up your tent.

You cannot go around thinking that there is an air ambulance in the area so I'll be ok cos it might just be busy. If you had problems getting your landrover to where you are then the emergency services are gonna have problems getting you out, helicopter or not.

If you went out as part of a group and something happened (say you hit a rock and were knocked out) Yes the emergency services are still gonna have to sort you out but you went prepared and did what you could to help yourself.

On your own you ask for anything you get. Why should other people go out of THEIR way to help someone that couldn't be bothered to help themselves?
 
sorry to butt in,but it has to be said, anyone who goes out on their own is asking for trouble,not only put your life at risk but also the poor buggers that have to get you out the ****...!
 
If I messed up and crashed or got badly stuck on a greenlane I would certainly accept responsibility for the situation, and I would ask somebody to help sort out my mess, but I would compensate them for any trouble they went to, and if they don't want to help then that's fine - they don't have to. I don't mind helping out people who get vehicles stuck on our property. What goes around, comes around.

I have been regularly going out mountain biking on my own in remote locations in the U.K. for about 15 years now, I have cycled solo for 8000 miles through Latin America along the Andes. On the most extreme stretch I had to be self sufficient in food and water for 4 days cycling accross a high desert (around 5000m) in Southern Bolivia with no roads and soft sand with temperatures at night dropping to -20 C. There were also huge riots and the government was overthrown while I was in the country. That stuff was quite risky. I've met plenty of other people on my travels who do things like this and I think most of us will go to our graves, be it prematurely or not, glad we took a few unnecessary risks and had a few adventures.

You paint a picture of greenlaning as some massive wilderness experience, but most tracks go through agricultural land where farmers drive their quads on a regular basis without a convoy of support vehicles. Try to get things into perspective Ratty.

I think perhaps part of the problem here is that a section of the off road fraternity like to think of greenlaning as a dangerous and macho activity - Do you think there may be some truth in this? The most dangerous parts of a greenlaning trip are the tarmac sections.

I suspect we are going to have to agree to disagree on this one Ratty!
 
here ratty :confused: :confused: who do you take out with you ( your back up team )when you go and do all this rescue work :confused: :confused: heavens forbid you dont risk it all by going alone do ya ??:D :D :D :D



and while were on how do the drivers of snow ploughs get to work???:D :D :D
 
nuggets said:
here ratty :confused: :confused: who do you take out with you ( your back up team )when you go and do all this rescue work :confused: :confused: heavens forbid you dont risk it all by going alone do ya ??:D :D :D :D
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Each and every job is properly risk assessed and the appropriate equipment and back-up are either dispatched or put on standby. If I am in a dangerous or inaccessable location I will ALWAYS have a back-up vehicle at scene all the time.

and while were on how do the drivers of snow ploughs get to work???:D :D :D
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Depends on how old they are. If they are old enough they will use their bus pass if they aint they might walk or drive.;)
 
Go on ratty, liberate yourself from the shackles of modern society. You should make a symbolic gesture something like this: Make a neat pile of your lifetime's collection of health and safety/ risk assesment manuals on the front lawn, pour a gallon of petrol onto them and fling a match onto it.:D.
 
fenby1976 said:
Go on ratty, liberate yourself from the shackles of modern society. You should make a symbolic gesture something like this: Make a neat pile of your lifetime's collection of health and safety/ risk assesment manuals on the front lawn, pour a gallon of petrol onto them and fling a match onto it.:D.
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Maybe I should...............




Nah..............





Then I wouldn't be able to turn up with that blissfull 'I told you so smirk' on my face. Oh but then you're probably one of those that'd try to sue their rescuer afterwards cos their vehicle was scratched extracting it from the foot of the cliffs or out of the dock. Stuff the fact that you rolled it 3 times and then stuck it through the roof of some remote house on the side of a mountain and the poor sods who own it have to move out and live in a B&B for 2 years while there house is knocked down and rebuilt. You will compensate anyone who you put out you said. How would you compensate someone like that? When I was chatting to the guy that did just that he just shrugged his shoulders and looked at me and said 'Thats what insurance is for innit'.
 
You'd be just as likely to have an accident like that Ratty, even when your out playing the self righteous greenlane rescue hero with your back up crew.
 
fenby1976 said:
You'd be just as likely to have an accident like that Ratty, even when your out playing the self righteous greenlane rescue hero with your back up crew.
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Thats the difference between you and me. I admit the possibility is there.

I never said I was a greenlane rescue hero neither.

FACT: If I refuse to come out and rescue somebody who has got in trouble and they are injured or die, they (or their family) will kick up a big fuss and sue the nuts off of me.

FACT: If I had gone out to a rescue and had an accident like that the owner of the house would sue the nuts off of me.

FACT: If you died or were injured and I got sued your family wold get lots of money.

FACT: If I was killed or injured, my family would get 'I am sorry for your loss but fook off. He knew the risks'.

You know the risks too but you choose to ignore them. As for the health and safety manuals. If I or the other emergency services did everything exactly by the book we would have a reason not to do virtually every job we are sent out to do. This would result in us getting sued for virtually every job we do. Unfortunately this means my life is worthless in money terms cos your family can sue for literally more than my life is worth if I didn't go out.
 
fenby1976 said:
You'd be just as likely to have an accident like that Ratty, even when your out playing the self righteous greenlane rescue hero with your back up crew.
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Fenby I'm not going to labour the H&S point of view. Because at the end of the day If you want to take the risks you take then that is your personal choice and no one should take that away from you. I've done plenty of solo walks and climbs myself.

But what I will say is that Greenlaning is under huge threats from Ramblers Farmers and NIMBY's who don't want us driving through "Their" countryside. And every time some one gets stuck and has to be rescued by a local farmer, or a group of ramblers comes across an abandoned vehicle. It's another nail in the coffin of greenlaning.

And it's for this reason that you should never go alone. When you are out driving a greenlane you become an ambassador for all offroaders, whether you want to be or not and we are all judged by the actions of an individual. So when you get stuck (That's when not if) you make us all look like the fooking idiot that you have become by been stuck, and having no one else with you.

I'm sure this chap didn't think. Oh I'll just go and see how many friends I really have, by getting my self stuck on Strat Florida. When he left his house yeserday.. http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f37/will-he-home-time-tea-61556.html
 
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