Sam's new engine build thread!! HELP! :D

[Mr Noisy]

thanks for those links jonny, dr evil (nice chap) sent me some manuals over the other day also which i have been refering to so far. i assume the f**king land rover oem manuals are correct?!?!?!?!

also regards that cam button, mixed reviews online, also states aftermarket cam, mine is a standard cam from real steel, does this still apply??

i have read a little about people drilling the oil pump cover to provide a spray onto the timing chain/dizzy drive, but have to say im a bit dubious about this on a non racing engine. PLUS my 125k original engine still has a perfect dizzy drive gear, unless it was recently replaced...

where do you recommend i drill these drain holes from the valley to timing area? and what size??

tonight am going to swap that cam spacer thingy around and look at the crank timing job, then will make a start stripping my current engine down in preparation for removing it from the car!

THANKYOU everyone!

 

[fett]

not heard about that oil pump drilling, as I have some oil pressure to spare on mine I might do that for a bit of fun lol

 

[jonnyt]

Cam button - the button was supplied by Rover for a long time for after sales fitment to these engines. In later engines a retainer plate was added so even Rover must have thought that physical restraint was a good idea. The standard and aftermarket cams for these engines have a small gradient on the lobes that is intended to push the cam towards the back of the engine when pressure is applied by the lifter. Different views as always - I've not read any bad reports about them, just that some people take the view that they are unnecessary on a standard engine.

Having stripped a dizzy gear while overtaking a tractor on a country road I may be a little sensitive about this issue though!

On drilling the oil pump - this is different to my suggestion (but it took me a long time to work that out on the internet as well). What some people do is drill the oil pump, thread it and take a pipe up the outside of the front cover and then drill and tap the bolt that holds the dizzy in and connect the pipe to that. This then sprays directly on to the gear. I've taken the view that this is overkill on mine.

However what I have done is drilled two holes behind the cam gear, through the web into the valley - these come into the valley at the bottom - just drill where you can and as low down as you can - its pretty clear where the holes go - just avoid the oil galleries. Diameter about 6mm from memory. This speeds up the oil draining back to the sump and gives it a route to splash onto the gear on its way. I took the view that the oil just drains back to the sump anyway from here so I couldn't see the harm in doing it - its not really a pressurised part of the system. The reason people do this is because the only lubrication in this area comes through the clearances between the woodruff key and the gear which is fairly limited.

Jon

 

[Mr Noisy]

Hi Jon

Right, awesome.

Like you say, the cam button can't be a bad thing because if it never gets used then it's no bad thing either. I'll have a look about on v8 tuner and see if there's anything else I need/want whilst I'm ordering

With this engine potentially making very good oil pressure I don't want the oil pump effort dragging the cam out of the block either.

Superb explanation on the dizzy oil pipe, sounds like a great idea but again overkill for me probably (mr 2000rpm most of the time man) but the valley drilling sounds alright.

If I'm feeling confident I'm not going to go through the galleries (I assume the lifter galleries are just a round hole drilled straight through the length of the block from cap to cap?) then I'll give it a go.

See what you mean, needs to be as low as possible.

Gonna check that woodruff whilst I have the cam spacer off cos apparently the fitment is very important. Does seem a very minimal way to oil the chain but obviously most manage alright!!

Cheers

 

[jonnyt]

Yes, there are some pretty tight tolerances set out in the manual for the key. I was right at the top end but accepted it because of the holes.

On the galleries, on one side (by no1 IIRC) there looks like a linking gallery of some sort that you need to avoid. The other side is clear though.

If you make the pressure release valve adjustable as I set out in an earlier post you'll be able to get the pressure pretty much as you want it.

Actually - I'll check that in my book as I'm talking about the early SD1 front cover and oil pump rather than the later cover you have - Have you got a crank driven oil pump?

 

[Mr Noisy]

Hi Jon

I measured my woodruff key and shaft overall, was 29.05mm whereas I think the limit is 30.1, so I've got plenty of room.

Got the drive gear and spacer sorted aswell

Will take a look at the new block tomorrow, hoping to get the old one out tonight.

I have the old style front cover, it's the land rover cover with the high water pump but it has a dizzy driven oil pump and multi v belts.

Here's some pics of progress and you can see the front cover also!

Cheers!

 

[Mr Noisy]

Daily update!

 

[jonnyt]

Sorry - was clearly being a little slow last night! So - drilling the pressure relief valve retaining nut to make the pressure adjustable is perfectly possible and a good idea.

Looks like some good progress is being made. Well done.

 

[Mr Noisy]

Hi Jonny

thats's great news, well tonight is basically jetwash everything to make it workable then start stripping the old motor for the parts the new one needs. this includes stripping/inspecting the oil pump because i know it's not in the best of health!

and thanks matey, tbh im just putting the hours in to get it done! left the garage at 2am last night and back here now top start another day

cheers!

 

[jonnyt]

Tell me if I'm just making this more complicated for you.

Of course, I'd neglected to realise that you are using the old oil pump from the original engine. Have a look at these threads. It's quite a lot of work but as I think is mentioned in one of those threads the oil pump is the most important part of the engine so should be in as good a condition as possible. Low pressure will cause serious damage.

Kenne Bell oil pressure booster plate

RV8 oil pump clearances

The link in the first I think to the blue printing of an oil pump is a good place to start as it gives all the tolerances that you should be aiming for / looking for when you strip it down.

 

[wolf]

wolf you have to becarefull you dont bore wash it too if its too rich lol- you cant beat just right

noisy you should paint the rocker covers while its out at least

Re: too rich - I know - I am working on that issue right now with Mr. GEMS expert Mark Adams

 

[wolf]

Hi fett

Yes I'm planning tonight to wire brush the block etc to tidy it up as best as, then strip the bits off it to get it back to bare block. May take a peek inside that valley

Then next job is to pull my old engine. Big question: anything to do before I remove it?? Was thinking do I need to crack the crank pulley bolt with the starter motor??

Then once that's out it'll go on the stand, and I will proceed to repaint the sump, paint the rockers and paint the efi plenum.

Am thinking red sump and rockers and black plenum, with the detail sanded back to brigh ally. Did consider blue rockers. Any other takers/ideas?

Considered a thin coat of bright silver for the block but have read its a bad idea...

Anyway so then once the bits are painted/drying, I will strip the old engine back to bare block, clean up all the ancillaries etc the put the new block back on the stand and proceed to fit all the bits to it.

Will end up with new block fitted with all the old cleaned/painted parts etc ready to bolt back into the car.

As above, any pointers for before I pull the old engine?

Any ideas for colours?

Cheers

I went for the polished aluminum look with the idea being (probably silly on my part) - reflect heat away from engine don't absorb it in with black (original colour on mine and a right pain to get rid of). It is a painstaking process though and if time is short - paint them blue.

 

[wolf]

Like this!

Beautiful work! I like the shape of those rocker covers better than mine (later 4.00 liter) as that rounded top line would make them a lot easier to polish (mine were a bastard as I didn't want to ruin the straight line).

 

[jonnyt]

I just went for the polished look because it looks pretty - nothing more than that! Yes - that was the only saving grace on these that everything is nicely rounded anyway so no need to be too careful to ensure the lines are maintained.

 

[Mr Noisy]

Hi guys

Thanks for the help guys, I give those links a read later Jonny.

Don't worry about complicating, it's all valuable experience!

Can't get hold of v8 tuner regards a cam button

Will definitely spend some good time on my old oil pump, I know it needs work and know it needs to be tip top. No point building a new(ish) motor just to starve it of oil!

As usual will get pics up along the way and beg for more help

 

[jonnyt]

Keep trying V8 Tuner. I think it is a man and wife team who also run a garage so he can be a bit tricky to get hold of. Really nice and knowledgeable guy though when you do get through and very helpful. Unfortunately he's of the kitcar mould rather than the landrover mould!

Jim Robinson @ JRV8 is also worth a try if you can't get hold of v8tuner.

 

[Mr Noisy]

Nice one

 

[Mr Noisy]

Spoke to v8 tuner, ordered cam button kit, new timing cover gasket, new engine mounts (lets just say we didn't need to undo the bolts to get the engine out last night!!!), new oil pump gears and high pressure oil valve and spring. Wasnt sure if these were necessary bearing in mind your oil pressure adjustment mod, but also didn't know if my valve and spring would be serviceable so for 8 quid thought I better get these just in case.

Monster fingers crossed it all arrives tomorrow or Saturday so I can start some proper assembly this weekend!!

 

[jonnyt]

Not sure if they will have been sent out by now or whether you might just catch him, but you might as well change the front cover crank seal while you are at it for the couple of quid that it will cost and a new O ring for the dizzy.

 

[Mr Noisy]

Well, the new engine came with the sd1 front cover and it's got a new front crank seal already, I'm assuming it's the same so was going to remove it! Same for the dizzy!!