Jeep thing or sheep thing?

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 05:39:16 GMT, "David Allen"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Be careful using that priest analogy. The guilty priests are typically
>homosexuals who joined the priesthood to escape their homosexuality. Brings
>us back to that topic

No, you are wrong. This is an attempt to discredit a normal, healthy
relationship between man and boy. Gays would never molest a child,
only heterosexuals do that.

Wait, did I just copy the radical gay agenda? Sorry.

And to be clear, I strongly believe the overwhelming majority of gays
are sickened by the molestation of any child by any person.

On 17 Jul 2003 17:00:11 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

>>What was that book called? Ah yes, "Heather Has Two Mommies" for elementary
>>aged students. Everyone with an agenda wants to spread their views among
>>the young. It's an attempt to infuse "values" into the masses using public
>>education.
>>
>
>Yes, heaven forbid we teach children tolerance and compassion. Why, they
>might grow up to be adults who don't hate gays, or blacks, or women, or
>Hispanics! Where would we be then?

You do not need to pressure school age children to "accept their
homosexuality" to teach compassion. Gay groups are teaching far more
than that. They are trying to encourage children as young as 5 or 6
to experiment with same-sex sex. Children by law can not engage in
sex until they are at least 16 in this country, so some gays are
trying to convert them before they have an opportunity to engage in
normal, healthy relationships. Not all gays are like this, but the
militant ones are and must be stopped.

>>There are those who have a hatred for homosexuals, but for the most part
>>conservatives object to militant gays defining the agenda of public schools
>>and redefining marriage and family. There's no doubt this is happening.
>>
>There's no doubt you're a bigot and a liar.

He is not lying. Groups have gone on TV and proclaimed their views
and their desires more than once. An interesting expose is found in
Sean Hannity's book. He includes the opinion of Alan Colmes, a
dedicated liberal, who also takes issue with the practices of some gay
and lesbian groups.

It comes down to this - people like you who want to attack normal
sexual relationships because of something your father did to you, need
psychological help.

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 23:02:06 GMT, DTJ <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 21:57:52 -0400, Bill Putney <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>
>>Laura's Rancid Bush wrote:
>>>
>>> I never knew this NG was so bigoted and ignorant. If this said ignorance is very
>>> widespread, readers would be wise to consider the value of automotive opinions rendered
>>> here. This NG does seem to be a good recruiting place for the christian reich
>>
>>And of course, everyone knows that if you hate Christians, that's not
>>bigoted. I'll have to remember that one.
>
>The pastor of my church recently went out of his way to explain to the
>congregation what we should do if a gay attended our church. He spoke
>for almost an hour, but his message was simple.
>
>We should welcome them with open arms.

That's a good policy for the Catholic church, since most of their
priests are gay.
>
>>You know - if the ratio of God-haters to God-lovers were 99 to 1, I'd be
>>honored to be included in the 1 per cent, and I'd galdly die for the
>>privilege.
>
>So would I, and we might one day get close to that percentage if the
>liberals in this country get their way.

That's right, "the liberals" are out to destroy religion. If those
liberal jerks who wrote the Constitution had just left out that part
about "separation of church and state" we could have a nice cosy
Christian country.

Bob

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 23:03:07 GMT, DTJ <[email protected]> wrote:

>>Geez, now where have I heard that kind of zealotry before ? Oh, I know
>>it was the Islamic terrorist who've decided that dying for _their_ God
>>is a way to get to heaven.
>>
>>Bob
>
>I will pray for you Bob.

Thanks Dude ! BTW - God is dropping by my vacation home next
Tuesday around 6 for dinner - I'll put in a good word for
you too!

Bob

On 17 Jul 2003 17:06:02 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

>>>> I believe God does not approve of homosexuality.
>>>
>>>I think God would be highly offended that you presume to know His mind.
>>
>>I believe God would appreciate my reading the bible. Something you
>>obviously don't do, nor have any direct knowledge of.
>
>But the Bible can be interpreted in many ways. Do you think people who grow 2
>crops in the same field are going to hell? That you should stone adulters?
>That the earth was created in 6 days?

What I believe is none of your business. Feel free to interpret the
Bible any way you want, I am not your judge.

>>>>Still, I have had friends and aquamarines who are/were gay. I have

should have been aquaintances...

>>>>worked with gays. I, and nobody I know, would have any issue with any
>>>>gay having the same kinds of family pictures on their desk that I do.
>>>>This means, of course, that playboy type pictures are not acceptable.
>>>>
>>>>Just as I should not be spending time in the work place talking about
>>>>my female lover, gays should not be doing the same. If I walk up and
>>>>ask who the picture is of, an appropriate response would be my
>>>>"partner", "friend", or other description that the person wishes to
>>>>use. If they start describing their sexual preferences, that would be
>>>>wrong. It is OK for me to say "girlfriend", but not "lover", I can
>>>>use the word "wife", a gay can say "partner" or similar. I would not
>>>>introduce my wife as my "anal partner", and a gay should not use the
>>>>term "butt buddy" at work.
>>>
>>>Do you seriously believe gays use the bigoted terms you do?
>>
>>No. However, not being gay I don't know what they would use to
>>describe their partners other than partner. I had to come up with
>>some example, and chose to use extreme ones.
>
>Which shows your true bigotry. Not very Christian.

It is not bigotry to attempt to use a term to describe how a person
MIGHT choose to talk. I never said they do say things, I made up some
examples.

>>>>Where most of us draw the line is with teaching our children that
>>>>being gay is acceptable, normal, or anything else.
>>>
>>>From a scientific and psycological perspective, all the data says it is as
>>>normal as heterosexual behavior.
>>
>>Incorrect. There is no data from any reputable study that even
>>remotely could be interpreted as you suggest.
>
>Read what the American Psychological Association says.

Before or after gay and lesbian groups threatened them if they did not
revise the DSM?

>>>> Children should
>>>>not be taught things like this.
>>>
>>>Or evolution?
>>
>>Evolution theory, and it is just that - a theory,
>
>Wrong. Evolution is as much a fact as gravity.

Gravity and evolution are both theories. Personally I support both
theories, but there is no such thing as scientific fact when it comes
to issues like those. Pick up a high school science book if you want
to understand what theory means as opposed to hypothesis.

>What about that 2 adults of the same sex can love and care about each other
>and be committed to each other?

Why? They have no need to consider how other people love each other
until they are old enough to understand that love in regards to sexual
attraction. Right now they have enough to learn about caring for
their siblings and parents and friends of both sexes.

>>I'll bet you are part of that group that tried to teach 12 to 14 year
>>old girls in NY that fisting is a normal way to show love for your
>>female friends. Good thing the parents of those girls stood up to
>>idiots like you.
>
>I bet you tie up little girls and torture them.

Never. That would not be Christian. However, it is Christian for me
to kill you if I find you harming a child in any way.

On 17 Jul 2003 17:06:30 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

>>>>>And the poster claiming university professors support child abuse wasn't
>>>being
>>>>>inflammatory?
>>>>
>>>>I didn't see the comment, however what you stated it said is correct.
>>>>Recently a professor wrote a book claiming that sexual abuse of
>>>>children does no harm.
>>>Prove it, fool.
>>
>>Well loyd, if you had enough intelligence to pay attention to the
>>national media, you could remember this story. EVERY channel,
>>including cnn, msnbc and Fox had this on for weeks earlier this year.
>
>If you think that constitutes "proof" you're dumber than you look.

Wait. Misunderstanding. BIG MISUNDERSTANDING.

I took it that you were challenging whether someone actually wrote the
book. They did indeed. It was all over the national media.

As to whether the content of the book is correct, I have not read it,
and have no idea what exactly it said, but I doubt that I would agree
with it based on what I heard it said.

The issue is that someone said "And the poster claiming university
professors support child abuse wasn't being inflammatory?", and I was
pointing out that indeed some professors actually do support child
abuse.

Sorry for the confusion.

On 17 Jul 2003 17:08:32 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:

>What's "crap" is ONLY teaching abstinence, so teens who engage in sex anyway
>have no idea of how to protect themselves.

Agreed. I have no issue with teaching children about abstinence and
about how to protect themselves if they don't listen to that message.
The problem is a lot of schools refuse to teach abstinence, and others
refuse to teach about protecting the child.

>You should know most child molestors are heterosexuals.

This is not a fact. Most reported child molesters may be
heterosexuals. However, due to the stigma attached to being molested
by a homosexual, one can not know how many unreported cases there are.
It is unreasonable to assume that one group is more or less likely to
molest children.

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 11:30:19 -0700, "Hillary Clinton"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>: You can't be a Christian and hate others. You can't be a Christian and
>be a
>: bigot.
>
>
>Pat Robberson, Jerry Fartwell, Jimmy Swaggert and a whole host of others
>prove that's not true
>

Just because someone calls themselves a Christian does not make it so.

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 21:57:52 -0400, Bill Putney <[email protected]>
: wrote:
:
: >Laura's Rancid Bush wrote:
: >>
: >> I never knew this NG was so bigoted and ignorant. If this said
ignorance is very
: >> widespread, readers would be wise to consider the value of automotive
opinions rendered
: >> here. This NG does seem to be a good recruiting place for the
christian reich
: >
: >And of course, everyone knows that if you hate Christians, that's not
: >bigoted. I'll have to remember that one.
:
: The pastor of my church recently went out of his way to explain to the
: congregation what we should do if a gay attended our church. He spoke
: for almost an hour, but his message was simple.
:
: We should welcome them with open arms.
:
: >You know - if the ratio of God-haters to God-lovers were 99 to 1, I'd be
: >honored to be included in the 1 per cent, and I'd galdly die for the
: >privilege.
:
: So would I, and we might one day get close to that percentage if the
: liberals in this country get their way.

oh spare me that clap trap. You mean the LIBERALS who were the founding
fathers" You guys all parrot the same crap. Take your theocratic wet dreams
and go start another Jones-like christian colony on some forgotten island

"'nuther Bob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 23:02:06 GMT, DTJ <[email protected]> wrote:
:
: >On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 21:57:52 -0400, Bill Putney <[email protected]>
: >wrote:
: >
: >>Laura's Rancid Bush wrote:
: >>>
: >>> I never knew this NG was so bigoted and ignorant. If this said
ignorance is very
: >>> widespread, readers would be wise to consider the value of automotive
opinions rendered
: >>> here. This NG does seem to be a good recruiting place for the
christian reich
: >>
: >>And of course, everyone knows that if you hate Christians, that's not
: >>bigoted. I'll have to remember that one.
: >
: >The pastor of my church recently went out of his way to explain to the
: >congregation what we should do if a gay attended our church. He spoke
: >for almost an hour, but his message was simple.
: >
: >We should welcome them with open arms.
:
: That's a good policy for the Catholic church, since most of their
: priests are gay.
: >
: >>You know - if the ratio of God-haters to God-lovers were 99 to 1, I'd
be
: >>honored to be included in the 1 per cent, and I'd galdly die for the
: >>privilege.
: >
: >So would I, and we might one day get close to that percentage if the
: >liberals in this country get their way.
:
: That's right, "the liberals" are out to destroy religion. If those
: liberal jerks who wrote the Constitution had just left out that part
: about "separation of church and state" we could have a nice cosy
: Christian country.
:
: Bob

Adolph tried that already

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 23:02:06 GMT, DTJ <[email protected]> wrote:


>
>So would I, and we might one day get close to that percentage if the
>liberals in this country get their way.


And as a Christian who is also proudly a liberal democrat, I pray for
understanding for those close-minded Conservatives leading us today.

See, anyone can take a label and use it as a slur.

Jon

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On 17 Jul 2003 17:00:11 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:
:
: >>What was that book called? Ah yes, "Heather Has Two Mommies" for
elementary
: >>aged students. Everyone with an agenda wants to spread their views
among
: >>the young. It's an attempt to infuse "values" into the masses using
public
: >>education.
: >>
: >
: >Yes, heaven forbid we teach children tolerance and compassion. Why,
they
: >might grow up to be adults who don't hate gays, or blacks, or women, or
: >Hispanics! Where would we be then?
:
: You do not need to pressure school age children to "accept their
: homosexuality" to teach compassion. Gay groups are teaching far more
: than that. They are trying to encourage children as young as 5 or 6
: to experiment with same-sex sex.

Of course you are brimming with James Dobson citations to make this asinine
point?



Children by law can not engage in
: sex until they are at least 16 in this country,

Where the hell are you, anyway?


so some gays are
: trying to convert them before they have an opportunity to engage in
: normal, healthy relationships.

Normal, healthy? And you are using heterosexuality as a role model; when
60-70% of these "healthy marriages" end in divorce or brutality. Oh please!
I admit there is a hell of an allure to a fat mortgage payment, a five
bedroom tract home, and supporting a wife's shopping habits. Geeze! What a
conversion tool!



Not all gays are like this, but the
: militant ones are and must be stopped.


Oh and how are you going to do that?

:
: >>There are those who have a hatred for homosexuals, but for the most
part
: >>conservatives object to militant gays defining the agenda of public
schools
: >>and redefining marriage and family. There's no doubt this is
happening.
: >>
: >There's no doubt you're a bigot and a liar.
:
: He is not lying. Groups have gone on TV and proclaimed their views
: and their desires more than once. An interesting expose is found in
: Sean Hannity's book. He includes the opinion of Alan Colmes, a
: dedicated liberal, who also takes issue with the practices of some gay
: and lesbian groups.

Ah ha! You just shot your credibility into the trash can. Alan Colmes a
liberal? you're so far to the reich you make Hitler blush!

:
: It comes down to this - people like you who want to attack normal
: sexual relationships because of something your father did to you, need
: psychological help.

Most of the people who need "help" are straight

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On 17 Jul 2003 17:06:02 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:
: : >>>
: >>>Or evolution?
: >>
: >>Evolution theory, and it is just that - a theory,
: >
: >Wrong. Evolution is as much a fact as gravity.

Again, you telegraph your stupidity. Do you know the difference between a
"theory" (colloquial) and a "Scientific Theory?" Hell no! For anyone to
say evolution is a "theory" is the same as saying the earth is flat and man
lived with dinosaurs. Of course we know that is true because we all watched
the Flintstones.... No wonder the United States has lost its scientific
preeminence. There are too many knuckle walking Luddite christians roaming
outside of their cages.

:

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 05:39:16 GMT, "David Allen"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Be careful using that priest analogy. The guilty priests are typically
> >homosexuals who joined the priesthood to escape their homosexuality.
Brings
> >us back to that topic
>
> No, you are wrong. This is an attempt to discredit a normal, healthy
> relationship between man and boy. Gays would never molest a child,
> only heterosexuals do that.
>
> Wait, did I just copy the radical gay agenda? Sorry.
>
> And to be clear, I strongly believe the overwhelming majority of gays
> are sickened by the molestation of any child by any person.


Thanks. I'd hate to be misunderstood.

Let me dare say the majority of gays also don't subscribe to the radical
"homosexual agenda". Which includes "helping" to out youngsters who haven't
discovered their homosexuality yet. To portray and promote the homosexual
lifestyle as equal to the heterosexual lifestyle. To change the culture of
marriage and family to the culture of anything goes. To make tolerance of
the homosexual lifestyle a civil rights issue. The list goes on.

The problem is that the reality of the homosexual lifestyle isn't anything
like the heterosexual family lifestyle. There isn't much of anything
"family" about it. So much of it is a life of promiscuity and transient
relationships. Some have stable relationships and these days even adopt
children to have a semblence of a family. But mostly, it just isn't a
culture that works and never has been.

I think for the vast majority of homosexuals, it's a tremendous curse to
have to live with. In fact, I think of all the people on the Earth, God
will probably be most merciful to homosexuals.

That's how I see it.

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On 17 Jul 2003 17:08:32 GMT, [email protected] (Lloyd Parker) wrote:
:
: >What's "crap" is ONLY teaching abstinence, so teens who engage in sex
anyway
: >have no idea of how to protect themselves.
:
: Agreed. I have no issue with teaching children about abstinence and
: about how to protect themselves if they don't listen to that message.
: The problem is a lot of schools refuse to teach abstinence, and others
: refuse to teach about protecting the child.

Yeah, schools not teaching anything but abstinence because some christian
militant threatens to sue to school board...

:
: >You should know most child molestors are heterosexuals.
:
: This is not a fact. Most reported child molesters may be
: heterosexuals. However, due to the stigma attached to being molested
: by a homosexual, one can not know how many unreported cases there are.
: It is unreasonable to assume that one group is more or less likely to
: molest children.

Yes it IS a fact. Most child molesters ARE straight!
http://danenet.wicip.org/dcccrsa/saissues/childinf.html

"DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 11:30:19 -0700, "Hillary Clinton"
: <[email protected]> wrote:
: >: You can't be a Christian and hate others. You can't be a Christian
and
: >be a
: >: bigot.
: >
: >
: >Pat Robberson, Jerry Fartwell, Jimmy Swaggert and a whole host of others
: >prove that's not true
: >
:
: Just because someone calls themselves a Christian does not make it so.

I could substitute a lot of words in place of "christian" in that sentence.
Well golly gee, G. W. Chimpy Bush thinks these guys are just scooby-doo
fantastic christians (along with Bob Jones). I am always amused how some
more "centrist" christians (those who boarded up their dungeons) go out of
the way to say people like the ones above aren't part of the flock. That's
like Clarence "Oreo®" Thomas say Jesse Jackson isn't Black.....

"David Allen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
:
: "DTJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
: news:[email protected]...
: > On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 05:39:16 GMT, "David Allen"
: > <[email protected]> wrote:
: >

: >
: > Wait, did I just copy the radical gay agenda? Sorry.


Here's the radical heterosexual agenda
http://www.htmlshop.com/java/population.asp Pretty disgusting!



:
: The problem is that the reality of the homosexual lifestyle isn't
anything
: like the heterosexual family lifestyle. There isn't much of anything
: "family" about it. So much of it is a life of promiscuity and transient
: relationships. Some have stable relationships and these days even adopt
: children to have a semblence of a family. But mostly, it just isn't a
: culture that works and never has been.

Oh gee let's see. That wouldn't be due to the fact that straight society
forces a lot of these conditions onto gays, does it? Promiscuity? The
straight culture has taken AIDS, which should have died out since everyone
"knows" gays only comprise 5% (HA!) of the population, but no, the
straights have made it a pandemic. Promiscuity? Like about 75-80% of those
nice straight men getting a quickie from a $10 whore on the way home from
work. Nice role model! (Oh and about 50% of straight women are humping the
meter reader while their brain-dead husbands are at work).

:
: I think for the vast majority of homosexuals, it's a tremendous curse to
: have to live with. In fact, I think of all the people on the Earth, God
: will probably be most merciful to homosexuals.
:
: That's how I see it.


Fortunately your view doesn't extend past the end of your pointed head.

On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, David Allen wrote:

> Let me dare say the majority of gays also don't subscribe to the radical
> "homosexual agenda". Which includes "helping" to out youngsters who
> haven't discovered their homosexuality yet. To portray and promote the
> homosexual lifestyle as equal to the heterosexual lifestyle. To change
> the culture of marriage and family to the culture of anything goes. To
> make tolerance of the homosexual lifestyle a civil rights issue. The
> list goes on.

Yes, massuh, the m'jo'ty knows they' place, massuh...they knows not t' ask
f' no civil rights, massuh, they knows they's infe'ior to you, massuh...

You realize, of course, that many of your same arguments were used against
blacks and other nonwhites, right?

They make tolerance a civil rights issue because their civil rights aren't
yet equal, and lip-service "tolerance" is meaningless without the
substance to back it up.

And there is no such thing as "the homosexual lifestyle" any more than
there is such a thing as "the heterosexual lifestyle".

> The problem is that the reality of the homosexual lifestyle isn't anything
> like the heterosexual family lifestyle.

You know this...how, exactly? How many homosexuals do you know, that you
know of? Three? Five? Twenty? I doubt it. How many of them have you
interviewed about their day-to-day life?

....or are you relying on the lurid fiction of the likes of Dobson?

> So much of it is a life of promiscuity and transient relationships.

Which differs from that which results in the ~50% heterosexual divorce
rate...how, exactly?

> Some have stable relationships and these days even adopt
> children to have a semblence of a family.

Not a family, just a "semblance" of a family? They're pretending, you
suppose?

> But mostly, it just isn't a culture that works and never has been.

I repeat my question: How do you know?

> I think for the vast majority of homosexuals, it's a tremendous curse to
> have to live with.

Oh? Have you asked them?

> That's how I see it.

It's amazing you see much of anything with all those blind spots.

> God will probably be most merciful to homosexuals.

....a fantasy of yours, which you seem to use as justification for treating
them like dirt down here on earth.

Shame on you.

DS

David Allen wrote:
>
> "Lloyd Parker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > Just abnormal, immoral, and pejorative terms.
> >
> Now there's the pot calling the kettle black.
>

Now David - we all know you meant to say "Now there's the pot calling
the kettle Afro-American". 8^)

Bill Putney
(to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with "x")


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DTJ wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 21:57:52 -0400, Bill Putney <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Laura's Rancid Bush wrote:
>>
>>>I never knew this NG was so bigoted and ignorant. If this said ignorance is very
>>>widespread, readers would be wise to consider the value of automotive opinions rendered
>>>here. This NG does seem to be a good recruiting place for the christian reich
>>
>>And of course, everyone knows that if you hate Christians, that's not
>>bigoted. I'll have to remember that one.
>
>
> The pastor of my church recently went out of his way to explain to the
> congregation what we should do if a gay attended our church. He spoke
> for almost an hour, but his message was simple.
>
> We should welcome them with open arms.


That is a wise pastor. A church should welcome all sinners, regardless
of the sin.


Matt