Discovery 3 Engine re-build

tyregeezer · Oct 12, 2022

Excellent work mate must confess I have a chippy friend who will give me a list of wood then he can screw it together I'm no good at carpentry lol. Not going to buy anything else until workshop done. As for the mains there seems to be a lot of different opinions shop says if the shells are tight or at point of seizing the tabs wouldn't stand a chance, was also told the tabs are for centring the shell, goes back to what we said about good quality oil and servicing I reckon, I suppose the simplest answers might be the best? I think that there's lots of myths about a tdv6 still held up by bolts, gradually emptying the plastic tubs at the moment all the best

lynall · Oct 12, 2022

tyregeezer said:
Excellent work mate must confess I have a chippy friend who will give me a list of wood then he can screw it together I'm no good at carpentry lol. Not going to buy anything else until workshop done. As for the mains there seems to be a lot of different opinions shop says if the shells are tight or at point of seizing the tabs wouldn't stand a chance, was also told the tabs are for centring the shell, goes back to what we said about good quality oil and servicing I reckon, I suppose the simplest answers might be the best? I think that there's lots of myths about a tdv6 still held up by bolts, gradually emptying the plastic tubs at the moment all the best

People always blame the lack of tabs for the issues (mainly non mechs) but the td5 and many many other engines have no tabs, yet you dont hear of them having issues.

I think it is a combination of things
The french designed it!
Oil pressure is to low even when new
Oil quantity is to small for the engine size, needs to be an extra 2 litres
Injector cylinder balance going out of trim and loading one cylinder to much, with subsequent extra stress on that cylinders shell bearings
People believing the makers service intervals, which are to long, this comes back to oil qty and quality
Engine history ie overheat/ran low on oil/coolant/thrashed from cold etc

gstuart · Oct 12, 2022

lynall said:
People always blame the lack of tabs for the issues (mainly non mechs) but the td5 and many many other engines have no tabs, yet you dont hear of them having issues.

I think it is a combination of things
The french designed it!
Oil pressure is to low even when new
Oil quantity is to small for the engine size, needs to be an extra 2 litres
Injector cylinder balance going out of trim and loading one cylinder to much, with subsequent extra stress on that cylinders shell bearings
People believing the makers service intervals, which are to long, this comes back to oil qty and quality
Engine history ie overheat/ran low on oil/coolant/thrashed from cold etc

hi mate

funny enough don’t know if you’ve seen it but the German guy Christian on utube, very clever guy and his take on the crank issues etc was if the D3 doesn’t start straight away by doing excessive cranking oil pressures isn’t able to build up and therefore leading to the crank issues

must confess I’ve always wondered when these engines are chipped if that can also lead excessive stress

also heard bad things about that Russian 19.5 oil pump blowing seals , alas don’t know how true that is, plus of course some owners not upgrading there oil pump

Must confess even if I do 500 in a year I still change all the oils and filters , see JLR service schedule is 12 month or 15,000 mile intervals,

by the way @tyregeezer did u ever see this report where a guy had a failed D4 engine and had it fully inspected , then detailed report

https://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/23856/D4_russian_doc.pdf

shame there isn’t a 100% answer to why they fail and moreover disgraceful JLR uk don’t take responsibility

lynall · Oct 12, 2022

gstuart said:
hi mate

funny enough don’t know if you’ve seen it but the German guy Christian on utube, very clever guy and his take on the crank issues etc was if the D3 doesn’t start straight away by doing excessive cranking oil pressures isn’t able to build up and therefore leading to the crank issues

must confess I’ve always wondered when these engines are chipped if that can also lead excessive stress

also heard bad things about that Russian 19.5 oil pump blowing seals , alas don’t know how true that is, plus of course some owners not upgrading there oil pump

Must confess even if I do 500 in a year I still change all the oils and filters , see JLR service schedule is 12 month or 15,000 mile intervals,

by the way @tyregeezer did u ever see this report where a guy had a failed D4 engine and had it fully inspected , then detailed report

https://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/23856/D4_russian_doc.pdf

shame there isn’t a 100% answer to why they fail and moreover disgraceful JLR uk don’t take responsibility

Tbh if you ask any half sensible mech to watch that youtube fella, pretty quickly they will give you an opinion of his opinions!

tyregeezer · Oct 12, 2022

All the tdv6s I have seen just simply not been serviced well no evidence any way I have always done my oil changes 6 monthly usually change oil pump at belt time, the more power extracted the more strain and the more fettling it needs not sure there will ever be a 100% answer I just like to keep it simple. The block I have just had crack tested and honed had no signs of damage anywhere no spun bearings apart from the snapped crank and a crack in the oil pump housing. but even though the Citroen etc were involved I love the tdv6 Yes have watched Christion on ubertuber I find him a bit excessive if you know what I mean but I do find vera arousing does this make me weird? @gstuart you have inspired me to tidy up while still waiting for missing bolts will post some pics of my little bombsite soon

lynall · Oct 13, 2022

tyregeezer said:
All the tdv6s I have seen just simply not been serviced well no evidence any way I have always done my oil changes 6 monthly usually change oil pump at belt time, the more power extracted the more strain and the more fettling it needs not sure there will ever be a 100% answer I just like to keep it simple. The block I have just had crack tested and honed had no signs of damage anywhere no spun bearings apart from the snapped crank and a crack in the oil pump housing. but even though the Citroen etc were involved I love the tdv6 Yes have watched Christion on ubertuber I find him a bit excessive if you know what I mean but I do find vera arousing does this make me weird? @gstuart you have inspired me to tidy up while still waiting for missing bolts will post some pics of my little bombsite soon

Did you have the machine shop check the crank bearing areas for alignment with each other? Sure I read that when crank fails it warps the block.

tyregeezer · Oct 13, 2022

Yes mate all the mains checked out for alignment no cracks somehow crank never impacted block not a scratch anywhere first sign of distortion is the main caps are no longer interference fit, seems ok

tyregeezer · Oct 13, 2022

PS not sure the machine shop believed me, the crank broke just in front of the second main it only moved enough to push on the oil pump and cause a crack in it, the second rod had a minor scratch where it touched the crank, no evidence of damage to the cylinders or pistons, rings and con rod will be replaced, the proof for me will be when i fit the crank I wondered if it broke on start-up I wouldn't have thought it was doing great rpm otherwise it would have been total destruction surely. I also think the tangs on shells can be taken out of the great crankshaft debate the oil pump issue has caused a percentage of failures and I suspect a number are due to servicing which I very rarely see evidence of, usually only see one or two service stamps from new

gstuart · Oct 14, 2022

tyregeezer said:
All the tdv6s I have seen just simply not been serviced well no evidence any way I have always done my oil changes 6 monthly usually change oil pump at belt time, the more power extracted the more strain and the more fettling it needs not sure there will ever be a 100% answer I just like to keep it simple. The block I have just had crack tested and honed had no signs of damage anywhere no spun bearings apart from the snapped crank and a crack in the oil pump housing. but even though the Citroen etc were involved I love the tdv6 Yes have watched Christion on ubertuber I find him a bit excessive if you know what I mean but I do find vera arousing does this make me weird? @gstuart you have inspired me to tidy up while still waiting for missing bolts will post some pics of my little bombsite soon

made me feel guilty now red the tidying up , lol, must confess u always end up with items that u haven’t got a space for them

must confess have seen some on the D3 forum who have changed there oil and disco hasn’t wanted for nothing yet some have still snapped a crank , there was one who had a D4 and snapped the crank twice , that was after being fitted with a brand new JLR engine by the dealers , luckily the member had a warranty as the engine cost over 10k , alas think that’s the only thing we can do is regularly change the oil and filter , oil being good quality and genuine filter , think the ones that snapped were using magnatec

good luck mate with the rebuild and have a great weekend

tyregeezer · Oct 15, 2022

Well, was waiting for head bolts to turn up, promised tomorrow needed a tidy anyway work tomorrow then going to lock myself in workshop until done hopefully fit next weekend. Cranks I still think the answer is probably in design/manufacture, but you never know how is has been treated in the past, but the example you mentioned surely points to manufacture, you can buy a 3.0l billet crank now off the shelf so to speak have a good weekend

tyregeezer · Oct 16, 2022

Well bolts didn't turn up so have replaced damaged bits of conduit put a few pics of my workshop, the drawer unit is an old school cupboard and has drawers but is gradually being taken over by parts I have my eye out for others as their perfect for parts storage made by triumph, hopefully everything will turn up tomorrow aiming to fit the motor at the weekend going to take this time to check brake pipes etc some are much more accessible while the motor and other parts are out of the way

gstuart · Oct 16, 2022

Awesome work there mate and indeed great idea as well keeping the parts safe and clean

funny enough just bought a drawer holder that has 4 x trays as it’s been driving me nuts with all the small parts I have, ie, electrical connectors , etc etc , has 2 x each of the trays , plus have a roll of sticky labels for identification

at some stage after building another bench I’ll then be able to attempt getting the multitude of bits placed in there rightful place , just know it will take many months

keep up the grand work there my friend , once again shame ur not closer as would have been delighted to come along and helped u where I could

tyregeezer · Oct 19, 2022

Hi blocks back going to clean and paint should have done this first but wasn't 100% sure it was usable due to the crank breaking will tape up bores and oil up first, going to experiment with electrolysis rust removal on another block before glaze busting/honing see it on ubertuber. missing head bolts still not arrived so held up at moment. I have some boxes similar for bits and bobs problem I have is with bigger parts. so many projects online at the moment been looking at a 2011 range rover I must stop you'd be welcome mate mostly on my own, company always welcome as no one wants a job lol

lynall · Oct 19, 2022

gstuart said:
Awesome work there mate and indeed great idea as well keeping the parts safe and clean

funny enough just bought a drawer holder that has 4 x trays as it’s been driving me nuts with all the small parts I have, ie, electrical connectors , etc etc , has 2 x each of the trays , plus have a roll of sticky labels for identification

at some stage after building another bench I’ll then be able to attempt getting the multitude of bits placed in there rightful place , just know it will take many months

keep up the grand work there my friend , once again shame ur not closer as would have been delighted to come along and helped u where I could

View attachment 276231 View attachment 276232 View attachment 276233

The metal trays are the ones to get, much tougher than the plastic ones, toolstation/screwfix etc

lynall · Oct 19, 2022

tyregeezer said:
Hi blocks back going to clean and paint should have done this first but wasn't 100% sure it was usable due to the crank breaking will tape up bores and oil up first, going to experiment with electrolysis rust removal on another block before glaze busting/honing see it on ubertuber. missing head bolts still not arrived so held up at moment. I have some boxes similar for bits and bobs problem I have is with bigger parts. so many projects online at the moment been looking at a 2011 range rover I must stop you'd be welcome mate mostly on my own, company always welcome as no one wants a job lol

The high toad tax is going to scare a lot of people off.

gstuart · Oct 20, 2022

lynall said:
The metal trays are the ones to get, much tougher than the plastic ones, toolstation/screwfix etc

hi mate

must confess did look at some but were a lot more expensive , see there’s also some tray systems that u can build up but silly money

going to buy some more of the blue drawers where they slot together , as when I’ve built another bench will screw some ply on the back in order I can fit some metal racking for all the small parts as there the items that seems to be taking up most of the room , so if I can get it all organised will be half the battle

more than likely will do next year as wish ti concentrate on my lean to roof first

many thks as always

tyregeezer · Oct 20, 2022

Yes, but it's a vicious circle i have to buy more projects to pay high tax lol. Have seen some metal shelving but just don't have the space at the moment, bolts still haven't come going to order elsewhere looks like the motors not going in this weekend

lynall · Oct 20, 2022

gstuart said:
hi mate

must confess did look at some but were a lot more expensive , see there’s also some tray systems that u can build up but silly money

going to buy some more of the blue drawers where they slot together , as when I’ve built another bench will screw some ply on the back in order I can fit some metal racking for all the small parts as there the items that seems to be taking up most of the room , so if I can get it all organised will be half the battle

more than likely will do next year as wish ti concentrate on my lean to roof first

many thks as always

I only get the cheap metal ones from Toolstation etc
They are pretty good, and you can treat them like crap.

The pack out stuff milwaukee/dewalt is great but mad money for diyers.

lynall · Oct 20, 2022

tyregeezer said:
Yes, but it's a vicious circle i have to buy more projects to pay high tax lol. Have seen some metal shelving but just don't have the space at the moment, bolts still haven't come going to order elsewhere looks like the motors not going in this weekend

Bolts might be delayed as nil stock, might be worth checking they have stock first?
Island4x4/maltings4x4 are not bad, or good old ebay.

tyregeezer · Oct 20, 2022

yes, have now ordered elsewhere delivered three weeks ago missing a set of head bolts were cheaper than my normal sources going round in circles have opened an ebay case today

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