At Last The Big TD5 job

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Now I know Im in trouble.
went out to turn the car arround on the drive, when I started it it fired in an instant, but knocked heavily for about 1.5 to 2 seconds then sounds good.
I took out the oil pressure switch and managed to add in a gauge which goes up to 2 bars,fired up the engine and the gauge went round past 2 bars to hit the stop, hard to estimate but probably 3 bar +.
Now I'm puzzled, if the pressure was low then it would knock but with over pressure why would it do that.
The oil pump has a relief valve so why do I see so much pressure, it shoiuld open and dump the excess
Could the oil way be blocked from the filter to the head, ......but that would push more oil to the crank.

Dam this bloody thing
 
I can't pretend to know much about it but according to Rave the relief valve doesn't open till the pressure reaches 4 Bar.
Oil pressure.jpeg
 
brianconwy said:
I can't pretend to know much about it but according to Rave the relief valve doesn't open till the pressure reaches 4 Bar.
View attachment 191325
Click to expand...

Cheers thanks for that.
I thought it would open at about 2.75 bar and normal running with hot oil would be at about 2 bar.
May be desperate but I noticed the number on the oil filter is different from the one shown on most web sites, nipped into town and bought another one.
 
I thought about this and one thing seems logical that the lubrication system must be draining down when the engine is not running, then it starts up and in the first seconds while the pump is filling the system bearings are fairly dry and the engine knocks.
Oil filters should have a none return valve in them to avoid this situation.
Mine had a new filter fitted when I filled it after the rebuild, so I went and bought another new filter, fitted it, primed everything by spinning it over with the injector harness disconnect, when the oil light went out I ran the engine, it sounded fine and I looked under the rocker cover and there was some oil.
I have been in the lake district since Thursday came home tonight and fired it up and it started instantly and did not knock, I am wondering (and hoping) that the oil filter may have been faulty, it was a branded filter but could have been a faulty one or even a fake but that seems unlikely.
Still let's hope I am moving forward now, next I plan a bit longer trip to get it good and hot and hope it settles down.
 
First, well done for getting this far - results sound good this far :) - I've been watching from the start ...

raywin said:
I am wondering (and hoping) that the oil filter may have been faulty, it was a branded filter but could have been a faulty one or even a fake but that seems unlikely.
Click to expand...

I have just had exactly the same problem on a tractor - non genuine, but good quality filter, and the engine knocks like a good un for a few seconds ... Like you, I was far from happy with this ..... So I went and spent a whole £6 on a genuine filter.... and the knock has gone o_O .... Unsurprisingly, genuine only from now on :rolleyes:
 
One thing I notice with my TD5 is that for a few days after changing a fuel filter it can be a bit clattery on start up. Even if it has been running perfectly well in the meantime. I've always though this might have resulted from some residual air in the fuel system which gradually works its way out.

I'm 99% sure it's going to be fine. After all, loads of people on here have had the heads off TD5s and nobody has said anything about oil starvation to the head being a common problem afterwards. So it would require some pretty determined efforts to achieve this, for example stuffing the oil passages with sealant when putting the top and bottom halves of the head together. And you've been so meticulous, covering up and stuffing all the holes so dirt doesn't get inside. It's just that there isn't much oozing out and what there is is hot and clean so it runs straight back into the sump without leaving a trace. The 5w30 I use doesn't seem to stick to things and runs off very readily. After 6000 miles or so you'll be able to see it, I'm sure.
 
Disco1BFG said:
First, well done for getting this far - results sound good this far :) - I've been watching from the start ...



I have just had exactly the same problem on a tractor - non genuine, but good quality filter, and the engine knocks like a good un for a few seconds ... Like you, I was far from happy with this ..... So I went and spent a whole £6 on a genuine filter.... and the knock has gone o_O .... Unsurprisingly, genuine only from now on :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Thanks it's been a lot of work, but I have time and was determined to enjoy the project, I found that's only possible if your efforts produce something positive.
I am 100% with you on the filter story, its still early but I think that was at the heart of the problem, it was mahle and looked genuine but I wonder if it was restricting flow and letting oil drain back, hope that's it.
 
Brown said:
One thing I notice with my TD5 is that for a few days after changing a fuel filter it can be a bit clattery on start up. Even if it has been running perfectly well in the meantime. I've always though this might have resulted from some residual air in the fuel system which gradually works its way out.

I'm 99% sure it's going to be fine. After all, loads of people on here have had the heads off TD5s and nobody has said anything about oil starvation to the head being a common problem afterwards. So it would require some pretty determined efforts to achieve this, for example stuffing the oil passages with sealant when putting the top and bottom halves of the head together. And you've been so meticulous, covering up and stuffing all the holes so dirt doesn't get inside. It's just that there isn't much oozing out and what there is is hot and clean so it runs straight back into the sump without leaving a trace. The 5w30 I use doesn't seem to stick to things and runs off very readily. After 6000 miles or so you'll be able to see it, I'm sure.
Click to expand...

Have to admit it was a lousy feeling and I was starting to imagine taking it back out, but deep down knew that I had blown out the oilways as I went along, but I did wonder about the none return valve in the head which holds back the oil, dont know how it could be damaged as I didn't touch it, but wondering if blowing oilways with air might have jammed it shut.
Dont want to count chickens here but will give it a 150 mile round trip soon and see how it feels.
 
raywin said:
New filter is Mann, next will be genuine LR.
Enjoyed it so much that if it runs ok then next spring I am going to sell the engine crane and engine stand.
Belive me it's a young man's game
Click to expand...

Good job you did.

pfft young mans game, i'd be aching at doing that in the drive with the rain and cold!! ;)
 
steve2286w said:
Curious you mention non return valve in filter, it mentions one in head at Btm of text could this be faultly


View attachment 191516
Click to expand...
Yes that's the one I was thinking of in my last post, as mr Brown mentions you dont hear of them failing, but I wondered if I might have jammed it shut blowing out the oilways with air, when I put in the new filter I saw slightly coloured oil pools at the injector side of the head, obviously not the pristine oil I poured over the rockers when I filled it up, so it must have been circulating.

windy81 said:
video of it running would be the cherry on the cake for me at least
Click to expand...

Bit less stress now so I will make a point of starting it up from cold with the video on, never uploaded any video before dont know if the file will be a bit big, could try my phone or go pro using a bit lower resolution.
 
raywin said:
Yes that's the one I was thinking of in my last post, as mr Brown mentions you dont hear of them failing, but I wondered if I might have jammed it shut blowing out the oilways with air, when I put in the new filter I saw slightly coloured oil pools at the injector side of the head, obviously not the pristine oil I poured over the rockers when I filled it up, so it must have been circulating.



Bit less stress now so I will make a point of starting it up from cold with the video on, never uploaded any video before dont know if the file will be a bit big, could try my phone or go pro using a bit lower resolution.
Click to expand...
erm, i think maybe uploading to youtube would be easiest then posting the link here. Someone correct me if I'm wrong ?
 
raywin said:
I am 100% with you on the filter story, its still early but I think that was at the heart of the problem, it was mahle and looked genuine but I wonder if it was restricting flow and letting oil drain back, hope that's it.
Click to expand...

Had to be a fake then - scary stuff - The one I fitted was a Donaldson - pretty well known in agricultural/industrial circles - I suppose I should ask them what they think - but I doubt I'll bother .....

The new genuine Massey Ferguson one has cured the problem......

I've been contemplating fitting an electric oil pump to our 300Tdi's for a while - which would work much like an aircraft engine oil system, and pre-oil the engine by putting full oil pressure through the system.... before starting - it could even be made so that the starter wouldn't work until the oil pressure was "up" ....
 
For the extra price of genuine oil filters and peace of mind, it’s definitely worth it, anyone here use genuine td5 fuel filters?
 
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