4.6 Running lean pinking

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That's kind of the impossible the sodding sensor is behind the crank pully but I will give it a look any idea what the differences are and just another stab in the dark could the chain be warn so much the timings out it doesn't rattle or sound worn

This is getting a long old fault for a bloody fault code I must be mr unlucky here :scratching_chin:
 
Cheers Wammers,did look,but couldn't find my pics - only Gems and Thor flywheels.At least he knows now what he should see through the hole,or better still what a scope trace should look like...
 
eightinavee said:
Cheers Wammers,did look,but couldn't find my pics - only Gems and Thor flywheels.At least he knows now what he should see through the hole,or better still what a scope trace should look like...
Click to expand...

If it was ok then suddenly started to do this, can only think it's some electrical problem. Think he needs to run some live data. Maybe the ECU has gone tits up. I am not au fait with the V8 fuel injection system to any great degree. So my assistance is limited.
 
I have removed the sensor and tried to inspect inside but its hopeless the crank pulley is right in the way tiny mirrors tried can't get the angle and endoscope won't met the angle, i am hoping to run data today a friend will be popping over, but i don't know what i will be looking for pattern wise, but i will run some data of and try and post it here
 
Just been reading this any chance it could be ???
To be honest if you didn't know it had a fault joe public wouldn't realise and since this engine doesn't have the usual ticking tappets its done 160k there is every chance the cam has been replaced and or drive train ? live data then strip down unless i get no data from the cam sensor then its electrical

Code 0340 - Land Rover Forums - Land Rover Enthusiast Forum
 
remedave said:
Just been reading this any chance it could be ???
To be honest if you didn't know it had a fault joe public wouldn't realise and since this engine doesn't have the usual ticking tappets its done 160k there is every chance the cam has been replaced and or drive train ? live data then strip down unless i get no data from the cam sensor then its electrical

Code 0340 - Land Rover Forums - Land Rover Enthusiast Forum
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Possible i suppose it would certainly not be well if that was so.
 
Saga so far,

i have tried to run live data to no avail none of the equipment i have access to or friends have access to has been able to do this

BUT

i have probed the cam sensor blue wire with a digi multi meter and it is operating (the sensor) its showing pulses and an average of 7-8 volts on tick over so it it picking something up

so that would say that its doing something, i would need some loving 4.6 thor driver too probe there wire and tell me what they get ???

as for has it suddenly started doing this ? well the answer is i don't know its the wife's car when we bought it i knew it wasn't running quite right, so when i got it back i put on the diag and got the code 0340 and too lean bank 1 and 2, (the engine management light does not illuminate with these error codes) and here we are ever since. (now i know why the car was so cheap!)

i have stopped her from using the car for fear of further damage, the car seams to be running rougher every time i start it and sometimes it will crank for a while before firing up

I have thought that maybe it is the ECM but i am unsure and since i have already hurled parts at it i don't want to buy a ECM as this will need coding with equipment i just don't have.

I loath to say it but looks like i will be stripping the front out to look at the timing chain and sprocket

i will up date as and when. anyone want a cheap p38 !!! lol
 
Isnt there a garage near you that will scope it - 10 mins work and no taking it apart.Its a lot of work to get the front cover off,dropping sump etc all the front end drive stuff...
Very much doubt the ecu,you can never say never,but they ARE reliable and the two I have seen with the wrong sprockets were really trying to do their best with the duff info from the cam sensor.
 
eightinavee said:
Isnt there a garage near you that will scope it - 10 mins work and no taking it apart.Its a lot of work to get the front cover off,dropping sump etc all the front end drive stuff...
Very much doubt the ecu,you can never say never,but they ARE reliable and the two I have seen with the wrong sprockets were really trying to do their best with the duff info from the cam sensor.
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I wish there was a garage near me I live 40 miles from one, as for stripping the front out that's not really a great problem, but I have spoken to the previous owner of 2 years he had done 40k in it in his ownership he said it started to miss and sound a bit different near Christmas and as the receipts show he also has plugs fitted at a service in January, he hasn't had any hardcore engine work appart from servicing so I doubt the cam sprocket has been changed irs pointing more towards the Ecu
 
what test equipment will be as in-depth as t4 ? i am willing to buy the gear but the price is a bit ridiculous is there another similar product that can do the same ? or has anyone got a t4 they want to sell ?
 
remedave said:
what test equipment will be as in-depth as t4 ? i am willing to buy the gear but the price is a bit ridiculous is there another similar product that can do the same ? or has anyone got a t4 they want to sell ?
Click to expand...

BBS Faultmate MSV2 is better than T4 it is said, but BBS Nanocom Evolution should do all you need to do.
 
wammers said:
BBS Faultmate MSV2 is better than T4 it is said, but BBS Nanocom Evolution should do all you need to do.
Click to expand...
That depends on how you look at it... But none of them will give anything other than the fault code.There is no live data for the cam sensor - or crank sensor.The only rotational help you will get is rpm and misfire detection,as live data,but not in this case cos the ecu isn't happy with the cam sensor.(Plus closed or open loop modes)
Its this simple - scope it where the cam sensor wires go into the ecu - if there is a decent Hall effect wave form from 0 - battery voltage in the pattern of the gaps in the sprocket,then that's all you can ask.If the ecu will not then use it there is something wrong with the ecu.
Drive it gently the 40 miles and get some real answers.
 
eightinavee said:
That depends on how you look at it... But none of them will give anything other than the fault code.There is no live data for the cam sensor - or crank sensor.The only rotational help you will get is rpm and misfire detection,as live data,but not in this case cos the ecu isn't happy with the cam sensor.(Plus closed or open loop modes)
Its this simple - scope it where the cam sensor wires go into the ecu - if there is a decent Hall effect wave form from 0 - battery voltage in the pattern of the gaps in the sprocket,then that's all you can ask.If the ecu will not then use it there is something wrong with the ecu.
Drive it gently the 40 miles and get some real answers.
Click to expand...

Hi I did drive it gently for about 60 miles into town the other day it made little difference however I would swear sometimes especially in traffic etc it was fine then others ie cruising around 50 you could feel it as it altered itself pulling then not pulling I wouldn't move the accelerator

My multimeter does a bar graph unfortunately the ending is too fast for it and it just resembles a kind of heart beat form so as far as oscilloscope no good

It's probable Ecu or mechanical it's just a case of we're to go now, could there be a chance the timing is out (high miles160k) through worn chain or excessive end float so the Ecu is discounting the cam sensor input ? Or is it more lightly a Ecu internal error ? Even if I had t4 would I be able to work out what exactly was the fault or am I better lump changing
 
Sorry,but I'm fed up with saying the same thing - T4 /Faultmate is going to tell you no more than the fault code,simple as that.A scope will tell you what the ecu is seeing,if the proper signal is there then its an ecu fault.The ecu will cope with a slack chain,they aren't exactly tight when new.
Fit another engine - not much help if its the ecu.
Fit another ecu - not much help if the ecu isn't getting a plausible signal.
Just book the bloody thing into a scope equipped garage,get an ACCURATE diagnosis and act upon the results.
 
eightinavee said:
Sorry,but I'm fed up with saying the same thing - T4 /Faultmate is going to tell you no more than the fault code,simple as that.A scope will tell you what the ecu is seeing,if the proper signal is there then its an ecu fault.The ecu will cope with a slack chain,they aren't exactly tight when new.
Fit another engine - not much help if its the ecu.
Fit another ecu - not much help if the ecu isn't getting a plausible signal.
Just book the bloody thing into a scope equipped garage,get an ACCURATE diagnosis and act upon the results.
Click to expand...

OK OK , i will get it scoped it just hurts to pass it on, i am leaning more and more to the engine ECM as it is getting a signal but clearly not acting upon it.
 
I have had numerous people say its the fly wheel i phoned up a few garages they said they would change the fly wheel as the teeth are missing.

Since i have changed the crank sensor and checked the wiring and the fact it runs i doubt its that, so that rules them 2 garages out.

i have one independent LR garage who wants to remove the front end to check the cam gear and chain as he says it must have jumped some teeth or be very slack as the ECM doesn't fail.

I have another independent who reckons its a ECM adaptive fault and that it won't rest?? and will probably need a new ECM

for the record this is my fly wheel i have looked at it and no teeth so i doubt its that.
 

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