300tdi auto non starter w/massive current drain

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oil will not short-it is an insulator-heavy duty high voltage transformers are filled with oil,to sink the heat and insulate the windings
 
Its been a couple of days since I tried and my head was pretty fried by that point but the engine WAS turning over,after a fashion....just like if the battery was flat....and it doesnt feel stiff enough on the spanner to warrant stopping the starter to that extent......
 
Oil WILL short in some circumstances,probably due to the crap and moisture it picks up....had a volvo 145 that got a short on the distributor casing from a rocker cover oil leak.

So,no,oil may not in theory conduct,but in the practice of a landy with a long term oil leak after a viciously blown head left to sit in a field ,maybe...

But thanks for the input,all appreciated...more please!!!
 
On a distributor carrying 20,000 volts minimum,any contamination,can cause an arc to strike-once struck it burns into the surface of the plastic,liberating carbon causing a permanent low resistive pathway-there is no way back.
In our case here,we are looking for a current path of several hundred amps at very low voltage,it is simply not possible with oil.
Have you tried disconnecting your alternator?If the diodes are blown they will discharge a battery very quickly-be careful if the discharge is very fast,batteries can explode under massive discharge
 
Coils are filled with oil mostly as a means to cool down the wires coiled up inside them. A car ignotion coil can become quite hot in operation.

My bet for this Dodgy Disco is the starter motor. Borrow one that works, and try it.

CharlesY
 
biolandy said:
On a distributor carrying 20,000 volts minimum,any contamination,can cause an arc to strike-once struck it burns into the surface of the plastic,liberating carbon causing a permanent low resistive pathway-there is no way back.
In our case here,we are looking for a current path of several hundred amps at very low voltage,it is simply not possible with oil.
Have you tried disconnecting your alternator?If the diodes are blown they will discharge a battery very quickly-be careful if the discharge is very fast,batteries can explode under massive discharge
Click to expand...

Well I stand corrected mate.I must say that I have experienced many shorting problems in other situations caused by moisture and various solids attracted to electrical parts like power amps in big sound system amps,this is what lead me on my path of error - again ,clutching at more straws.Its not so much the oil itself as the moisture and solids attracted and mixed that I assumed could be the problem in this case.The volvo thing just sprung to mind in desperation!

My elderly,somewhat senile but with a lifetime in the diesel trade father suggested the alternator as the first port of call....tried with it disconnected and replaced with one that (I assumed) worked....no joy.
 
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I have a spare starter off the in-pieces 96 that I shall try as soon as the rain allows.

Again,many thanks to all of you,anyone else,please feel free to weigh in,however minimal you think your opinion is its worth a lot to me right now.
 
biolandy said:
On a distributor carrying 20,000 volts minimum,any contamination,can cause an arc to strike-once struck it burns into the surface of the plastic,liberating carbon causing a permanent low resistive pathway-there is no way back.
In our case here,we are looking for a current path of several hundred amps at very low voltage,it is simply not possible with oil.
Have you tried disconnecting your alternator?If the diodes are blown they will discharge a battery very quickly-be careful if the discharge is very fast,batteries can explode under massive discharge
Click to expand...
Please correct me if im wrong bio but don't tdi5's suffer running problems when oil gets down the injector loom into the connector would this not be caused by the oil shorting the connectors in the plug??
 
oldskool said:
Please correct me if im wrong bio but don't tdi5's suffer running problems when oil gets down the injector loom into the connector would this not be caused by the oil shorting the connectors in the plug??
Click to expand...

Yes that is correct,but I think the oil is the start of the problem degrading the plastic insulation,then letting water in + other ****-Also these are signal lines,very low current,and easily corrupted-it is a whole different ball game when you are talking hundreds of amps trying to get thru-
 
biolandy said:
oil will not short-it is an insulator-heavy duty high voltage transformers are filled with oil,to sink the heat and insulate the windings
Click to expand...
The oil is for heat sink not to insulate the windings, the wire used in the windings is insulated as it is wound using a varnish/lacure.
 
oldskool said:
The oil is for heat sink not to insulate the windings, the wire used in the windings is insulated as it is wound using a varnish/lacure.
Click to expand...

The wire is insulated before winding-otherwise you would have one big winding only,and the coil would not exist-the oil is there as an insulator and a heat sink,which still maintains insulation at elevated temperatures-see this data on die-electric constants of common materials-the higher the number the better the conductor:

http://media.noria.com/sites/archive_images/Backup_200109_dielectric_Tab_1_2.gif


The end
 
Starter out,buzzed up proper on jump leads as does spare.

Didnt get chance to do much today due to livestock needs but a couple of hours laying on scalpings in the rain showed me that even with the starter out,with a meter across the battery terminals the reading drops from 12 sommat to 4 sommat (heater plugs) then up to 8 sommat...wheres all that power going?

Felt all round back of head and found no trapped wires and in the failing light could find no burnt insulation......

HELP....my heads going to implode.Anyone want to buy my landrover collection...theres a IIa as well........
 
If the glowplugs are dragging voltage down to 4 the battery is shot-battery should hold best part of 12 volts even with plugs energised-never below 11.Are you sure this is a good battery?From memory,I think glow plugs are about 5 amps each,so 20 amps for the plugs should leave you 500-600 amps for cranking depending on battery type-typically think they are ~560 amp cca min.Presumably the lead on the top of your glowplugs is not touching the metal work of the engine at all-no ones left a spanner on there or something.
 
Don't get despondent,this should be quite easy to sort out-From the battery live(red),it feeds the glowplugs,starter motor solenoid,and starter and live take off from the alternator.Now you know your starter is nice and lively,and assuming you have a good battery-pop it back on and try the jump lead(needs to be very heavy duty)direct onto the starter motor post from the battery live,will it spin the motor over or at least try and turn it over.-do not hold on for long or it will fry the jump lead(not rated for this sort of current)
Take the glowplugs out and check them all across the battery-should glow red quite quickly-Renew any horrors.
Check you are getting 12 volts on the glow plug rail,and check the lead that feeds them is not chaffed and touching metal anywhere.
You have already checked the alternator,otherwise just disconnect it for the moment-the only other thing you are left with is the starter solenoid.
 
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