Would buying a 1996 90 TDI and attempting to modernise be a money pit?

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Marty1974 said:
Hi all, apologies for the vagueness of the question, basically I've wanted to own a Land Rover Defender for years now but I've never actually gone through with being one. I see nice examples and think yes they would suit me right down to the ground.

I'm thinking about buying a nice older example (around £6K) and I would like to eventually end up with something I could use around town with a modern look to it and a comfortable interior instead of a bench lay-out.

Would I be better of buying say a older model (well maintained with all evidence of work, mot's etc etc) with a view to re-vamping the interior and maybe adding a few modern touches to the exterior or should I just save up more and eventually fork out £20K+ for something with a slightly modern (more suited to urban life life)?
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You’d be better off with a Range Rover classic or Discovery 1. You could sink £25k into mods on a Defender and still not make it as nice on the road as a Disco 1.

Under the body the Disco is actually about 95% the same as a Defender. So has similar off road ability and will drive quite similar on the road. The big difference is how the body is constructed and how it is attached to the chassis. No amount of mods to a Defender will solve this fundamental design issue.
 
I drive a 2012MY 110 Utility (see photo to the left). Love it to death and have updated a lot of bits: Stage 1 remap, leather bucket seats, locking cubby box, SatNav, Cruise control, LED lights, short shift gear changer, clutch assist to name but a few, and for me it’s made the world of difference. However, to drive one about town can be a pig. They have the turning circle of a battleship and burn fuel to match.
Would I be with out it? .......No
Do I drive it around town? ......Yes (but only when necessary).

Take the advice given above and go drive one and only then make your decision!:)
 
Marty1974 said:
Hi, I'm not thinking 'pimp my rides' just basically moving away from a bench layout with comfy seats, new exterior lights, air con that's all, maybe new wheels down the line but primarily it would be the interior to make it a more usuable layout.
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Original Defender seats are actually very comfy. You can’t get rid of the bench layout as the seats are on top of a seat box that runs the width of the vehicle.

Nothing wrong with the lights, good bulbs will improve them. Air con on a Tdi will kill the performance, plus probably not actually work all that well.

Sounds like a Jeep Wrangler JK is what you are after (2007 thou 2018 model years).
 
Marty1974 said:
Thanks all for the pointers, didn't realise that about the 90's maybe the 110 would be better for myself with regards to more space. Does anyone have or know any good websites for Defender seats, upgrades I could look on to start thinking about prices please?
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A Defender 90 is not much longer than a Pug 106!!! Forward facing rear seats are impractical to access, end up too high and give no boot space. Even the factory offering on late models didn’t work well, but would be 100x better than a retro fit to an earlier one with the central bulkhead.

110 is a good vehicle for family use. Loads of room. The Santana PS-10 looks like a 110 (is actually based on a 109). Santana removed the seat box if you really wanted to go down this route.

Fitting other seats to a 90/110 never really works all that well IMO. At best you just make it impossible to get to the battery (its under the passenger seat). And at worst they end up making it difficult to get in and out of and make it hard to reach the seat belts.
 
Turktowner said:
I believe (and am willing to be corrected) that it's unlawful to put kids in sideways seats so you'd have to do something like it or not.
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I have a letter from the DVLA/VOSA (think it might be a sticky on here somewhere too).

Essentially children over the age of 3 years old can legally use side facing seats without a child seat, as child seats cannot be used with side facing seats. The clincher is if it has seat belts fitted or not. If there are belts, then they cannot legally use the seats. If there not belts they can.

Seems odd, but that is how the legislation is.

This means a Series or early 90 with the one piece bench side facing seats are fine and legal. But the individual side facing seats (4 of them) probably not, as they usually had lap belts.
 
I have a 110 TD5 SW and use it around town all day every day.
With a few modifications it can be fully useable and a great alternative to a dull modern vehicle.
I would advise a 110 if you plan to carry kids, you can remove the side facing rear seats and have a ton of luggage space, and still have five forward facing seats.
The 110 looks big because it’s tall, but it’s easy to drive.
 
The worst thing about the tdi 90s is a hyundai amica 1.0 litre auto can out drag them!
Around town they are great as damage isnt an issue like it is for a normal car incl discos and r/rs.
 
Let the cars overtake, don’t even try to keep up. That’s the thing about a Defender, it takes away the stress of driving. Let the tin boxes go at their speed and take life in the slow lane.

Not that a Defender is THAT slow, my TD5 certainly doesn’t hold up the traffic. Any version with a turbo should be able to maintain normal traffic speeds.
 
Definitely drive one first! A Defender is nothing like a modern car, or even an older car. They are slower, noisier, use more fuel... but great fun and totally unique if you still like them after driving one.

An older Landy is still an older Landy, regardless of how much you tart it up to look like a newer one. They are a big theft risk, and the more they are customised, the greater the risk of theft in the eyes of insurers. My 90 has a retrofitted 200Tdi which has loaded the insurance. You can fit new seats, extra sound insulation, roof lining, blingy wheels, nice paint job, extra rear seats, but it is still an older vehicle. And you’ll be paying for the privilege with an insurance company. Whatever you do do, also invest in some decent security measures for it.

My wife won’t get in my 90 and isn’t keen on me taking our daughter out in it. It’s still a slow noisy vehicle, even with Exmoor Trim seats.

Drive a few, have a look at the 110 for a family vehicle and see how you get on. Let us know the result. But if you want a modern car exper, the Defender isn’t the way to go. If you want a modern feel to a Defender, you’d be better saving for one of the last produced.

PS if you’re looking at one for town driving, be aware of impending fees for Diesel engines...
 
Just a word on financial matters. I bought a 1997 110 300tdi CSW for £7000. So far I have spent another £9000 :eek: and none of that was on modifications, bodywork or the interior. It was all unseen work on chassis, gearbox, transfer box, prop shafts, drive shafts, radiator, PAS box, braking system etc etc. All of that just to get it to drive like a 22 year-old land rover.

I live in a rural area but commute each day to the city. I am happy driving in both but I have been driving 109 and 110s for 20 years. The one thing you need to experience with a 110 is the turning circle. You really need to think ahead, especially in car parks, so you don't get yourself stuck.
 
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Lief Zpring said:
Just a word on financial matters. I bought a 1997 110 300tdi CSW for £7000. So far I have spent another £9000 :eek: and none of that was on modifications, bodywork or the interior. It was all unseen work on chassis, gearbox, transfer box, prop shafts, drive shafts, radiator, PAS box, braking system etc etc. All of that just to get it to drive like a 22 year-old land rover.

I live in a rural area but commute each day to the city. I am happy driving in both but I have been driving 109 and 110s for 20 years. The one thing you need to experience with a 110 is the turning circle. You really need to think ahead, especially in car parks, so you don't get yourself stuck.
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9 grand seems rather excessive. Even putting a galvy chassis under it should only cost a fraction of that.
 
lightning said:
Far from my missus refusing to go in my 110, she’s demanded her own Landy!

“I want heated seats and a heated screen” she said
So last week l sold her VW Polo
And collected a 2005 90XS SW.

She’s over the moon.
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My Mrs has just bought a Ninety....

more fool her:p

neilly said:
I did assume he paid someone to do the work for that amount, but maybe wrong.

Cheers
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+1, labour @ £45ph is about 200 hours per £1000 plus parts etc, every bolt & washer has a cost:(

then add VATo_O

Rich.
 
neilly said:
I did assume he paid someone to do the work for that amount, but maybe wrong.

Cheers
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I did have someone do it. It was booked in for a glav chassis swap but a few weeks before it suffered catastrophic transmission failure :mad: and needed recon g/box and t/box. Recon PAS box and new brake calipers, disks & pads, new pipes all round and vacuum pump. There was also welding needed under the tub, new sill and patches to a couple of lower door frames. Now start adding all that up :eek::eek:.

But as we all know, Land Rovers aren't just about prices. I bought this one to last. It has good body panels and a solid 300tdi engine (everthing else in new;)). I hope to still be driving it in 20 years time.
 
Most old Defenders will be money pits at some stage. "Upgrading" all depends on what you want it for, if you use it every day like I do then it makes sense to upgrade lights, seats, heating, insulation/sound proofing, performance etc.

If it is just a weekend drive or you intend selling it at some stage leave it original.
 
If you’re thinking of buying an older model then drive one of the last defenders and see if you like it.
That was land rovers attempt at modernising the defender and with the money and resources they have available I think that without enormous expense and work you’d struggle to get it any better.
The defender quite honestly is rubbish as a car but is brilliant as a simple off-road workhorse and multipurpose vehicle. But to use as a road car with all the options available for £6000 I wouldn’t touch a defender.
I bought my 3 litre twin turbo diesel BMW for less than 6 grand and it’s by far a million times better than any defender to use solely as a road car. I also have a discovery 2 for mixed work and again that’s far better than a defender and already had all the luxury work done for a lot less than £6000.
 
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