The reason i have a Range Rover

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I don't want to hijack the thread or anything but the only thing wrong with the Prius is the hype that surrounds it and the way its used as a stick to beat others with (that and its a bit tinny :) ). The battery pack (which is the biggest offender for manufacturing and disposal CO2 costs) is effectively a bundle of laptop (or mobile phones!) batteries stuck together so economies of scale are rapidly reducing (or massively increasing depending on your point of view!) the carbon cost of the battery. I'm personaly on my fifth laptop and god only knows how many mobiles I've been through so as an individual I've probably equalled that aspect of the CO2 cost of the Prius. And I know I'm not alone there, particularily on the mobile phone front.

As a car it is a very competent way of getting from A to B and brings ease of driving to a new level (some of them even parallel park themselves!). It is just simply not the planet saving device its claimed to be in some quarters for the points made by Wammers above. And it will never compare with a good diesel for hammering down a motorway. It would actually make a really good urban Taxi - even has a v.tight turning circle. To be fair to it though, remember it is effectively the Model T Ford of next gen autos. Most of the hybrid technology and energy recovery systems will transfer seemlessly to hydrogen or fuel cell cars.

For me, the biggest drawback of the Prius is that they didn't fit a plug on it. I really can't believe they didn't do it on the latest 3rd gen model. With the latest drive to roll out electric cars in most cities this will be a real drawback.
The weakest link in the hybrid drivetrain is the need to bring the petrol engine upto operating temp before it will cut in and out (thats why economy suffers so badly in cold weather - but you never hear that reported!). If you could plug it in at night you could very simply have the equivalent of Gavs Webasto pre heater (electrical of course) on a timer so that every morning you went out to a fully charged and warmed battery (much more power when warm) with a fully warmed engine. Fuel economy of over 100mpg would be immediately available on most of those school runs.
 
SpudH said:
I don't want to hijack the thread or anything but the only thing wrong with the Prius is the hype that surrounds it and the way its used as a stick to beat others with (that and its a bit tinny :) ). The battery pack (which is the biggest offender for manufacturing and disposal CO2 costs) is effectively a bundle of laptop (or mobile phones!) batteries stuck together so economies of scale are rapidly reducing (or massively increasing depending on your point of view!) the carbon cost of the battery. I'm personaly on my fifth laptop and god only knows how many mobiles I've been through so as an individual I've probably equalled that aspect of the CO2 cost of the Prius. And I know I'm not alone there, particularily on the mobile phone front.

As a car it is a very competent way of getting from A to B and brings ease of driving to a new level (some of them even parallel park themselves!). It is just simply not the planet saving device its claimed to be in some quarters for the points made by Wammers above. And it will never compare with a good diesel for hammering down a motorway. It would actually make a really good urban Taxi - even has a v.tight turning circle. To be fair to it though, remember it is effectively the Model T Ford of next gen autos. Most of the hybrid technology and energy recovery systems will transfer seemlessly to hydrogen or fuel cell cars.

For me, the biggest drawback of the Prius is that they didn't fit a plug on it. I really can't believe they didn't do it on the latest 3rd gen model. With the latest drive to roll out electric cars in most cities this will be a real drawback.
The weakest link in the hybrid drivetrain is the need to bring the petrol engine upto operating temp before it will cut in and out (thats why economy suffers so badly in cold weather - but you never hear that reported!). If you could plug it in at night you could very simply have the equivalent of Gavs Webasto pre heater (electrical of course) on a timer so that every morning you went out to a fully charged and warmed battery (much more power when warm) with a fully warmed engine. Fuel economy of over 100mpg would be immediately available on most of those school runs.
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Yep that about sums it up. Even stand alone electric cars have their uses, but they are never going to take a family of four or five with luggage on holiday. Plus they are not the world saving vehicles some claim they are. The cost in CO2 production to make them is far greater than a normal car, plus the lectricery to run them has to be generated, costing CO2 output. All in all a Fiesta sized conventional car possibly creates less CO2 in it's manufacture and life, than the same sized electric car does. And it would certainly be better than the Prius. I cannot see a Prius doing 100,000 miles without a CO2 gobbling battery change. Then there is the CO2 cost of re-cycling the dud battery. Also maybe it would be an idea to have ALL vehicles with 4X4 drive just in case it snows again, to prevent the problems a couple of inches of the stuff caused to standard vehicles. I am very glad i have a P38.
 
Could not agree with you more spudH.

I do love driving the prius, have been looking at different forums to do a hack for extra batteries or plug in, they are available but expensive, cheapest is £1500. Only a matter of time.

but i also love my Rangie, has been running good for a while, a few teething problems that have come up one by one.

1) front seat heaters not working, light on switch coming on.Mate who i share lifts with complains on a cold morning, his vectra ones work!
2) Alarm fault on display, probably interior sensor, annoying misslock bleep when pressing button
3) put it back onto air, had coil conversion prior to purchase, got all parts, just need time. Wifes legs to short to climb up and going to ruin the seat sliding her arse off it.
4) HEVAC check book symbol comes on now and again.
5) N/S exhaust manifold to replace, new manifold preped and waiting for warmer weather. O/S replaced as was cracked, N/S chuffing very slightly.
6) Headlights to be removed and cleaned inside, need a new pair really.
7) steering damper leaking, needs replacing.
8) MAF sensor replaced with cheap one, they do give low readings, going to replace with genuine one.
9) door handles to fix, so they return flush.

think that will do for now, some thing to play with.
 
Wammers, the prius will do well in excess of 100,000 miles before needing the batteries changing.
Toyota gives an 8 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the full hybrid system,

No other manufacturer gives any warranty like that, that i know of, and to give a warranty like that they must be confident, the wifes has 50k and no problems, there are many prius taxi's arround the world that have covered 150k plus with no problems, remember this a toyota their engineering is second to none.
i did alot of home work, prior the purchase of ours, 4 years ago.
 
Oh and the main problem in giving the basic numpty on the road 4x4 is they think they can set off faster, so go faster, but forget they can't stop quicker.
 
To be fair most people who bought a Prius 4 years ago did a lot of research before buying. Most buyers were either a blind idealist or an informed enthusiast. It was too far a stretch from the norm back then for the average punter. They were actually really hard to sell second hand even as joe public wouldn't touch them.
I actually took the plunge after a taxi ride in Ljubiana, Slovenia 4 years ago. My wife was hankering after one (The blind Idealist :)) but I was a battery sceptic. The guy driving the taxi told me they were changing their fleet over they were so happy with them. Thier first one had over 75,000 km up already without missing a beat. He said their main type at that stage was skoda octavia diesels - no joke itself as a taxi! but as the vast majority of their work was city centre the Prius was beating it well on economy and they didn't need the boot volume like you would on an airport run.
This is confirmed now by the number of 150k+ ones in Autotrader
 
overlandrover said:
Wammers, the prius will do well in excess of 100,000 miles before needing the batteries changing.
Toyota gives an 8 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the full hybrid system,

No other manufacturer gives any warranty like that, that i know of, and to give a warranty like that they must be confident, the wifes has 50k and no problems, there are many prius taxi's arround the world that have covered 150k plus with no problems, remember this a toyota their engineering is second to none.
i did alot of home work, prior the purchase of ours, 4 years ago.
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Fair do's then if all that is correct. But they are still not the planet hugging be all and end all of CO2 control they are claimed to be. In fact they are no more CO2 efficient overall than a simular sized conventional car. Climate change is a natural cycle driven by that big yellow thing in the sky and CO2 is a product of that cycle and not the cause of it. More CO2 healthier plants, healthier plants more food for us. Simples.
 
Regardless of the Prius' eco credentials, what about the tonnes of CO2 used in the build process, apparently more than it will ever offset in its lifetime.
 
woogoo said:
Regardless of the Prius' eco credentials, what about the tonnes of CO2 used in the build process, apparently more than it will ever offset in its lifetime.
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Yes absolutely correct, according to the experts the manufacturing process alone produces more than the CO2 cost of a normal cars manufacture and life cycle. Also the CO2 cost of re-cycling is also much higher than a standard car. These hybrids whilst being a way forwards in fuel economy terms for the owner, seem to be a way backwards in terms of CO2 production, if that is what the government are really interested in, they are a none starter.
 
wammers said:
Yes absolutely correct, according to the experts the manufacturing process alone produces more than the CO2 cost of a normal cars manufacture and life cycle. Also the CO2 cost of re-cycling is also much higher than a standard car. These hybrids whilst being a way forwards in fuel economy terms for the owner, seem to be a way backwards in terms of CO2 production, if that is what the government are really interested in, they are a none starter.
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Image over substance again just like the so called energy saving light bulbs. They may save energy at the point of use but the energy cost of producing them and the cost of disposing of them if done properly more then outweighs the supposed savings.
The old fashioned Tungsten filament bulb is in fact 100% efficient in cold northern climates for 6 months of the year as the heat it produces contributes to warming the house, and it poses no problems with disposal or re-cycling:)
 
i don't buy things for there enviromental build credentials, i buy them for the days to day life comfort, fun and savings.

My house is full of ''energy saving light bulbs'', the prius is the size of a mondeo if not bigger, brother inlaw is 6'4'' and i am six foot, when i am driving the prius and he is sat behind me he has 5'' of leg room left, yeah he has two legs.

it does 60mpg regularyn petrol, more in the summer and is £15 per year road tax.

My p38 is on lpg

i have what i have for the fun of it and in the process, i pay less to the rip off electric companies, less road tax to the Goverment and less fuel tax, err to the Goverment again.

the old saying 'More is less' more fun for me and less to the ****ing money grabbing, lying, cheating devious double standard, back stabbing anuses at the dream factory they call Goverment.

Oh i work for the crown so get my wages from them in a round about way, thats me take take take!!!!
 
overlandrover said:
i don't buy things for there enviromental build credentials, i buy them for the days to day life comfort, fun and savings.

My house is full of ''energy saving light bulbs'', the prius is the size of a mondeo if not bigger, brother inlaw is 6'4'' and i am six foot, when i am driving the prius and he is sat behind me he has 5'' of leg room left, yeah he has two legs.

it does 60mpg regularyn petrol, more in the summer and is £15 per year road tax.

My p38 is on lpg

i have what i have for the fun of it and in the process, i pay less to the rip off electric companies, less road tax to the Goverment and less fuel tax, err to the Goverment again.

the old saying 'More is less' more fun for me and less to the ****ing money grabbing, lying, cheating devious double standard, back stabbing anuses at the dream factory they call Goverment.

Oh i work for the crown so get my wages from them in a round about way, thats me take take take!!!!
Click to expand...

Thats why I too have a house full of ECO bulbs and a bloody great wood burner and my own trees to feed it.
When I can find a source of used veggie oil I'll be making my own diesel as well:D
 
overlandrover said:
i don't buy things for there enviromental build credentials, i buy them for the days to day life comfort, fun and savings.

My house is full of ''energy saving light bulbs'', the prius is the size of a mondeo if not bigger, brother inlaw is 6'4'' and i am six foot, when i am driving the prius and he is sat behind me he has 5'' of leg room left, yeah he has two legs.

it does 60mpg regularyn petrol, more in the summer and is £15 per year road tax.

My p38 is on lpg

i have what i have for the fun of it and in the process, i pay less to the rip off electric companies, less road tax to the Goverment and less fuel tax, err to the Goverment again.

the old saying 'More is less' more fun for me and less to the ****ing money grabbing, lying, cheating devious double standard, back stabbing anuses at the dream factory they call Goverment.

Oh i work for the crown so get my wages from them in a round about way, thats me take take take!!!!
Click to expand...

Way to go mate good luck to you.
 
in my view climate change is just another way for the goverment to make more money from us. pre 2001 gas guzzlers pay the same road tax as the same age ford escort but if u have a late L322 you pay huge amounts of tax even though it probably produces less co2 than the P38 equivalent.... rip off i think....

as for recycling... i understand and agree with the concept but my local recycler wont take the stuff unless its all cleaned (my hot water and soap!) doesnt pay me for it and then sells it on.. he drives a brand new L322 supercharged vogue!!!!!!!!!!!! wheres my cut? after all he is making his fortune from me and im not getting my share. i have to pay the manufacturers for the pakaging so why dont he have to pay me for it?

oh yeah i drive a range rover coz i love my car ( i know i mad ) its on lpg so i can afford to run it,no other reason. I personally think climate change is over inflated look back through history the earth is always changing ice age etc.

thats it ive had my rant im now going for a drive cheers all
 
Did you here the comments on Radio 4's PM last night when one listener suggested all 2-wheel drive owners should be fined for using a 2-wheel drive car in the snow, and that 4x4s were the only way to go? He got absolutely lambasted by everyone! Even in this weather when possibly it would be fair to say 4x4s have their place, the general public are consumed with hatred for them.

Of course I don't drive a 4x4, I drive a Range Rover.
 
I like to think i drive the cars that the rich and famous drive, well the Range Rover would have been a few years ago, how posh am i. ha ha.

Got a point about the two wheel drive cars, while they are stuck in the snow with their engines running and then revving the engines and wheel spinning, they surely must be polluting more than my RR driving straight home in 20 mins as to their two hour drive!!

Actually if i sugest to the goverment a winter tax on two wheel drive cars they would probably do it, but call it ''Carbon offsetting''.

:p
 
[Spot on,I was told I was an idiot to buy such a big engined car by some of my work mates.But most of those tossers will be buying me drinks for months to come for pulling their go carts from the car park.Who's laughin now.:D
 
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