Series 3 Should I take out the rear bumper?

85Santana3 · Aug 25, 2019

Hello everybody
Last week some moron busy on her cell phone rammed the rear of my Landy and bent the left corner of bumper by about 40 degrees as you see in the photos. So the poor thing is in a body-shop waiting for repair. The mechanics said that they will pull the bumper and bent it out back to normal.
Is this the right way to do this (wouldn't this method twist the frame)? Shouldn't he take out the bumper?
What is involved in taking the bumper out?
I include photos to help make better decision.
thanks in advance.

steve2286w · Aug 25, 2019

whats the distortion like near the chassis rail ? what condition is existing rear chassis section in , if it was a car over here you would claim on her insurance and get a new rear quarter panel, wing, galvanised corner post and paint job, why are you not pursuing this line of action.
if you were paying out of your own pocket this would be the way to do it but its not going to look the same as before, if its hit right on the corner crumple zone, the chassis rail if good condition should be ok

85Santana3 · Aug 25, 2019

Thanks for the reply. How much work is involved in taking the bumper out? I was told they have to remove the top, the rear box and then get to the bumper which I found doubtful.

steve2286w · Aug 25, 2019

Well its not a bumper as such, its part of the chassis all welded in, so if it was to be replaced then roof off, sides off, tub off , you can get a replacement rear quarter chassis which includes some of the 2 chassis rails going forward, this would allow cutting out and welding of the top part of chassis rails putting new section in, should have a good look /pics of inside corner where is bent to look for and crumples as the forces would tend to concentrate there

tottot · Aug 25, 2019

If the chassis main rail is ok [ looks it is in pic ] then just a case of doing some cuts to remove bent metal and then welding in some new parts. You can see in Steves pic it is a simple structure. Replacing the damaged body work is much more work.

Rodeo Joe · Aug 26, 2019

You can replace the rear crossmember without taking the body off if you undo the bolts holding it down and loosen the rest.....theres just enough room to jack it up to get at what you need, having said that by the looks of yours the tub is stoved in so you might as well strip it all down.

Bobsticle · Aug 26, 2019

What was she driving, a digger?

Bobsticle · Aug 26, 2019

The chassis may be twisted and as your the no fault victim I would demand a full documented inspection and possibly a new chassis. Unfortunately they only come galvanised these days

.
They can’t write it off as your within your rights to keep your vehicle, repaired to its pre accident state.

rob1miles · Aug 26, 2019

Proceed carefully, As others have said, its not a bumper, its the rear cross member of the chassis. I don't think it will pull out without a lot of heat and that can leave the metal weaker as its now.heat treated. Not usually a problem on bodywork but this is the chassis so it needs to be right. This would normally be repaired by cutting the rear crossmember off and fitting a new one (they are readily available).. The problem is that when is this is fixed you MUST end up with a straight chassis or your vehicle will be worth very little. It could have been bent in the crash or get bent pulling the dmage out or by welding the new crossmember on wrong. You must get really accurate alignment measurments now before you decide what to do. If its bent now its a much more costly repair, if its not then these measurments will protect you if a repair is done badly. . The body repair is hard, it has to be annealed to be panel beaten, make sure they know how to work Birmabright alloy (not just say "yes" then screw it up).

85Santana3 · Aug 28, 2019

Bobsticle said:
What was she driving, a digger?

A goofy little hatchback of dubious pedigree! She did n't hit with the bumper even, it was the upper corner housing the front lights!! I could not believe it made that much damage.

Reading your comments I have to say insurance companies you deal with are much more generous than I am used to. For a 34 yr old truck getting a new chassis is out of question here.

Yesterday I went to see the work. The mechanics have already bent the back member to perfectly straight and were working on straightening the panels. Much better than I expected. I will post some photos when I get it.

Rodeo Joe · Aug 28, 2019

85Santana3 said:
A goofy little hatchback of dubious pedigree! She did n't hit with the bumper even, it was the upper corner housing the front lights!! I could not believe it made that much damage.

It's pretty easy to bend the rear crossmember if you catch it right at the end.... The damage probably looks a lot worse than it is but the bodywork will tell if you, ve got a good repair shop.

rob1miles · Aug 28, 2019

Sounds like they know what they are doing, those skills are getting lost here. but really make sure it is striaght before you accept it back.

Bobsticle · Aug 28, 2019

85Santana3 said:
A goofy little hatchback of dubious pedigree! She did n't hit with the bumper even, it was the upper corner housing the front lights!! I could not believe it made that much damage.

Reading your comments I have to say insurance companies you deal with are much more generous than I am used to. For a 34 yr old truck getting a new chassis is out of question here.

Yesterday I went to see the work. The mechanics have already bent the back member to perfectly straight and were working on straightening the panels. Much better than I expected. I will post some photos when I get it.

Generosity no. Legal obligation yes.
They are getting away with writing off other people’s vehicles in the UK as well. It seems most victims think they are allowed to deem your no fault repairs as uneconomical to fix and offer you a cash settlement. This is nonsense and a cost cutting exercise. I would think twice on a complicated modern vehicle as they often drive differently even when repaired well.
On such a Land Rover however I would go for a 100% repair as it’s parts are relatively simple. A twisted chassis needs making good not bodging and they are legally responsible to pay for such work as required.

tottot · Aug 29, 2019

I have a mate in the automotive repair trade. He says the insurance company's will write off any ordinary car over three years old as a matter of course these days. Recons there is an unwritten agreement with car makers to do so and push up new sales.
Good you have found folk with the skills to repair, as rob1miles says getting harder to find.

85Santana3 · Aug 30, 2019

Problem is evaluating the trucks correctly which never gets done by the insurance industry.
We buy these old trucks and spend tons of money and time rebuilding and often even improving them and it still is labeled a 30 some year old truck, while in reality they are each a custom made machine irrelevant of the year or model.
Another problem is that a Land Rover is not a car for everybody so there is not a waiting list when one goes up for sale. In addition to willingness to constantly thinker and fiddle a Landy owners must have a tendency to resist growing up. We want to keep on playing which is admirable but under appreciated in general.

I am sure if we do a survey of how much we have spent on our machines and how much we can get for them today we see that even knowing that the money won't come back or even knowing that more advanced technology has been developed we like these cars for what they are. It is a personal thing. Sadly our personal characteristic have no room in checklist of insurance companies. To hell with them, everybody is entitled to at least one bad habit, so cheers to all of you.

85Santana3 · Sep 3, 2019

Since I promised photos after repair.

They did not do a bad job.
For those interested they pulled out the crossmemebr with pulley and chain tied to a metal column. It was interesting to watch.
Now I have to find a way to make this repair section look old. I figure if I throw a hand full of small rocks to the repaired part and rub some sand to it, it will look like rest of the paint. I have to wait till it dries and cures completely.

tottot · Sep 3, 2019

Looks a pretty good job on the bodywork, dare say some filler involved but should be good for ages. Black out covers the crossmember so can not see. A pic of its inside would be interesting.

rob1miles · Sep 3, 2019

I think they have doen a remarkable job, I'm not sure many here could do that as well. Don't age it! I made that mistake once; I carefully matched the faded white on a car to respray one wing, later I cut back the whole car and the old paint came up like new and the new paint looked old, it was a right mess. The repair will soon age and match on its own.

steve2286w · Sep 3, 2019

looks very good was there any wrinkles left over on chassis when straightened , you’ve saved the insurance co a fair bit!

85Santana3 · Sep 4, 2019

steve2286w said:
you’ve saved the insurance co a fair bit!

Call me heartless but I wasn't very worried about them

OK, rob1miles I will not age the paint thanks for the advice.

tottot said:
A pic of its inside would be interesting.

I included a photo bellow and one drawing.

As the drawing shows crossmemebr in section B is open in front which makes it weak at that point. Maybe the engineers who designed it intentionally created a bending mechanism in case of accident. Otherwise it is the most ridiculous cost cutting measure imaginable.

steve2286w said:
was there any wrinkles left over on chassis when straightened

Fortunately no. Before the mechanics start to work on the car I explained in details that this truck is more dear to me than my wife and made them take a solemn oat that chassis would not be bent (true story). Since I am not married I did not lie.

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