Grand Cherokee Owners - Fight back!!

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> "JohanB" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...


> > ...A brake job pays 2 hours an axle so if you have a car with oilchange
> > front rear brakes and lets say 4 tires you will get 2+2+1.7+0.3= 6 hours
> > and do it in 3 /3.5 hours you will make money and that doesnt mean
> > youre ripping off the customer because he will pay $199 an axle for a
> > brake job


Joe wrote:
>
> $400 for a brake job? Wow. If it wasn't for all that overhead, you could do
> one brake job and then knock off for the day. How do people afford that?


Depends on what's included with the brake job. Is it just new pads? Is
it new pads plus turning rotors? Is it 4 new rotors and 8 new pads? If
the latter, then $400 might be a reasonable price for a 4-wheel brake
job. I just recently did the brakes on my daughter's Mercury Mystique -
new rotors/new pads (front), new drums/new shoes (rear) - good quality
parts - nothing exotic, but not low end either, and the parts alone were
right at $300.

Bill Putney
(to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with "x")


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In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
>
>
> mic canic wrote:
>
> > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars first time

>
> Do you like to xplain your logic ????
>
> How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for free
> the second time.....
>
> Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your 8
> hours anyway
>
> Johan
>


Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
fix it right, so where's the incentive?
--
____________________
Remove "X" from email address to reply.
 
A clearer definition of flat rate:

If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an arbitrary
figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it comes
back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted warranty
time.

Guess what? you fix it for free!

So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you want
working on your car!

Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced technicians
or butchers on flat rate!

The End.

Refinish King


"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] says...
> >
> >
> > mic canic wrote:
> >
> > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars first

time
> >
> > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> >
> > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for free
> > the second time.....
> >
> > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your 8
> > hours anyway
> >
> > Johan
> >

>
> Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.




 
And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix it
for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the flat
rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are ahead of
the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer. But
doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged for a
reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2 hour job
last for days.
"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> A clearer definition of flat rate:
>
> If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

arbitrary
> figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it comes
> back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

warranty
> time.
>
> Guess what? you fix it for free!
>
> So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you

want
> working on your car!
>
> Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced technicians
> or butchers on flat rate!
>
> The End.
>
> Refinish King
>
>
> "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > [email protected] says...
> > >
> > >
> > > mic canic wrote:
> > >
> > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars first

> time
> > >
> > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > >
> > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for free
> > > the second time.....
> > >
> > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your 8
> > > hours anyway
> > >
> > > Johan
> > >

> >
> > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > --
> > ____________________
> > Remove "X" from email address to reply.

>
>
>



 
Flat rate books were written for a reason:

to give technicians an estimated time that it would require to do the job.

If a technician is proficient, and beats it. Should he be penalized?

The customer asks how much?

The customer is told 4 hours at $50.00.

If it takes 10 hours, the customer gets to slide, but if the job goes well.
The business owner gets dorked?

Where's the incentive to be in business?

You must be a trolling customer, who wants it all, a guarantee that he will
get it cheap, and none of the things that can go wrong on the job. Flat
rate, you win some and lose some!

Refinish King


"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix it
> for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the flat
> rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are ahead

of
> the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer. But
> doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged for a
> reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2 hour

job
> last for days.
> "Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> >
> > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

> arbitrary
> > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

comes
> > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

> warranty
> > time.
> >
> > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> >
> > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you

> want
> > working on your car!
> >
> > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

technicians
> > or butchers on flat rate!
> >
> > The End.
> >
> > Refinish King
> >
> >
> > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > [email protected] says...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > mic canic wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars

first
> > time
> > > >
> > > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > > >
> > > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for

free
> > > > the second time.....
> > > >
> > > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your

8
> > > > hours anyway
> > > >
> > > > Johan
> > > >
> > >
> > > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> > > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > > --
> > > ____________________
> > > Remove "X" from email address to reply.

> >
> >
> >

>
>




 
Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the flat
rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would fix a
car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle in
for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged me
the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate for
the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could have
done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate since I
am told up front what it is going to cost me.
"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:eek:[email protected]...
> Flat rate books were written for a reason:
>
> to give technicians an estimated time that it would require to do the job.
>
> If a technician is proficient, and beats it. Should he be penalized?
>
> The customer asks how much?
>
> The customer is told 4 hours at $50.00.
>
> If it takes 10 hours, the customer gets to slide, but if the job goes

well.
> The business owner gets dorked?
>
> Where's the incentive to be in business?
>
> You must be a trolling customer, who wants it all, a guarantee that he

will
> get it cheap, and none of the things that can go wrong on the job. Flat
> rate, you win some and lose some!
>
> Refinish King
>
>
> "Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix

it
> > for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the flat
> > rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are

ahead
> of
> > the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer.

But
> > doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged for

a
> > reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2 hour

> job
> > last for days.
> > "Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in

message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> > >
> > > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

> > arbitrary
> > > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

> comes
> > > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

> > warranty
> > > time.
> > >
> > > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> > >
> > > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician

you
> > want
> > > working on your car!
> > >
> > > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

> technicians
> > > or butchers on flat rate!
> > >
> > > The End.
> > >
> > > Refinish King
> > >
> > >
> > > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > > news:[email protected]...
> > > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > > [email protected] says...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > mic canic wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars

> first
> > > time
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > > > >
> > > > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for

> free
> > > > > the second time.....
> > > > >
> > > > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get

your
> 8
> > > > > hours anyway
> > > > >
> > > > > Johan
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > > > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for

to
> > > > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > > > --
> > > > ____________________
> > > > Remove "X" from email address to reply.
> > >
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>
>



 
Then you were a victim:

I ran an honest shop, and even cut time off of flat rate for seniors and
people of less privilege. So before you come out of the gate asking me who
the hell I think I am? I'm an honest shop operator, nothing like the ones
who took advantage of you.

I refuse to be compared to the grease monkey image you speak of, when I took
time to help the local action groups and churches with the poor that needed
their cars fixed, in order to find jobs, I treated customers fairly and paid
for training for my employees so they would "Do the job right the first
time" plus quicker!

Maybe you got screwed, but not by me!

So if you have a bone to pick, go to the source that stuck it to you, not
the one who gave you an accurate description.

With kind regards,

Refinish King


"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the

flat
> rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
> rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would fix

a
> car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
> even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle

in
> for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged me
> the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate for
> the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
> mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
> before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
> over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could

have
> done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate since

I
> am told up front what it is going to cost me.
> "Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:eek:[email protected]...
> > Flat rate books were written for a reason:
> >
> > to give technicians an estimated time that it would require to do the

job.
> >
> > If a technician is proficient, and beats it. Should he be penalized?
> >
> > The customer asks how much?
> >
> > The customer is told 4 hours at $50.00.
> >
> > If it takes 10 hours, the customer gets to slide, but if the job goes

> well.
> > The business owner gets dorked?
> >
> > Where's the incentive to be in business?
> >
> > You must be a trolling customer, who wants it all, a guarantee that he

> will
> > get it cheap, and none of the things that can go wrong on the job. Flat
> > rate, you win some and lose some!
> >
> > Refinish King
> >
> >
> > "Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix

> it
> > > for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the

flat
> > > rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are

> ahead
> > of
> > > the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer.

> But
> > > doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged

for
> a
> > > reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2

hour
> > job
> > > last for days.
> > > "Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in

> message
> > > news:[email protected]...
> > > > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> > > >
> > > > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an
> > > arbitrary
> > > > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

> > comes
> > > > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted
> > > warranty
> > > > time.
> > > >
> > > > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> > > >
> > > > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician

> you
> > > want
> > > > working on your car!
> > > >
> > > > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

> > technicians
> > > > or butchers on flat rate!
> > > >
> > > > The End.
> > > >
> > > > Refinish King
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > > > news:[email protected]...
> > > > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > > > [email protected] says...
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > mic canic wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars

> > first
> > > > time
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > > > > >
> > > > > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it

for
> > free
> > > > > > the second time.....
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get

> your
> > 8
> > > > > > hours anyway
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Johan
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the

same
> > > > > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid

for
> to
> > > > > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > > > > --
> > > > > ____________________
> > > > > Remove "X" from email address to reply.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >

> >
> >
> >

>
>




 
You didn't charge every customer the same rate? That's illegal, isn't it?

Refinish King wrote:

> Then you were a victim:
>
> I ran an honest shop, and even cut time off of flat rate for seniors and
> people of less privilege. So before you come out of the gate asking me who
> the hell I think I am? I'm an honest shop operator, nothing like the ones
> who took advantage of you.
>
> I refuse to be compared to the grease monkey image you speak of, when I took
> time to help the local action groups and churches with the poor that needed
> their cars fixed, in order to find jobs, I treated customers fairly and paid
> for training for my employees so they would "Do the job right the first
> time" plus quicker!
>
> Maybe you got screwed, but not by me!
>
> So if you have a bone to pick, go to the source that stuck it to you, not
> the one who gave you an accurate description.
>
> With kind regards,
>
> Refinish King
>
>
> "Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the

>
> flat
>
>>rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
>>rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would fix

>
> a
>
>>car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
>>even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle

>
> in
>
>>for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged me
>>the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate for
>>the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
>>mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
>>before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
>>over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could

>
> have
>
>>done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate since

>
> I
>
>>am told up front what it is going to cost me.
>>"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:eek:[email protected]...
>>
>>>Flat rate books were written for a reason:
>>>
>>>to give technicians an estimated time that it would require to do the

>
> job.
>
>>>If a technician is proficient, and beats it. Should he be penalized?
>>>
>>>The customer asks how much?
>>>
>>>The customer is told 4 hours at $50.00.
>>>
>>>If it takes 10 hours, the customer gets to slide, but if the job goes

>>
>>well.
>>
>>>The business owner gets dorked?
>>>
>>>Where's the incentive to be in business?
>>>
>>>You must be a trolling customer, who wants it all, a guarantee that he

>>
>>will
>>
>>>get it cheap, and none of the things that can go wrong on the job. Flat
>>>rate, you win some and lose some!
>>>
>>>Refinish King
>>>
>>>
>>>"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>>>And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix

>>
>>it
>>
>>>>for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the

>
> flat
>
>>>>rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are

>>
>>ahead
>>
>>>of
>>>
>>>>the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer.

>>
>>But
>>
>>>>doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged

>
> for
>
>>a
>>
>>>>reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2

>
> hour
>
>>>job
>>>
>>>>last for days.
>>>>"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in

>>
>>message
>>
>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>
>>>>>A clearer definition of flat rate:
>>>>>
>>>>>If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an
>>>>
>>>>arbitrary
>>>>
>>>>>figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it
>>>
>>>comes
>>>
>>>>>back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted
>>>>
>>>>warranty
>>>>
>>>>>time.
>>>>>
>>>>>Guess what? you fix it for free!
>>>>>
>>>>>So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician

>>
>>you
>>
>>>>want
>>>>
>>>>>working on your car!
>>>>>
>>>>>Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced
>>>
>>>technicians
>>>
>>>>>or butchers on flat rate!
>>>>>
>>>>>The End.
>>>>>
>>>>>Refinish King
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article <[email protected]>,
>>>>>>[email protected] says...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>mic canic wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars
>>>
>>>first
>>>
>>>>>time
>>>>>
>>>>>>>Do you like to xplain your logic ????
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it

>
> for
>
>>>free
>>>
>>>>>>>the second time.....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get

>>
>>your
>>
>>>8
>>>
>>>>>>>hours anyway
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Johan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the

>
> same
>
>>>>>>even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid

>
> for
>
>>to
>>
>>>>>>fix it right, so where's the incentive?
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>____________________
>>>>>>Remove "X" from email address to reply.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>

>>

>
>
>


 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> A clearer definition of flat rate:
>
> If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an arbitrary
> figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it comes
> back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted warranty
> time.
>
> Guess what? you fix it for free!
>
> So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you want
> working on your car!
>
> Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced technicians
> or butchers on flat rate!
>
> The End.
>
> Refinish King


Jeeps don't start to fall apart until the day after the warranty
expires.

--
____________________
Remove "X" from email address to reply.
 
In article <[email protected]>, dbs58
@nospam.hotmail.com says...
>
> Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the flat
> rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
> rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would fix a
> car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
> even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle in
> for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged me
> the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate for
> the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
> mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
> before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
> over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could have
> done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate since I
> am told up front what it is going to cost me.
>



I don't know what magical book they showed you but all the flat rate
manuals I have read are HEAVILY in the customer's favor. .2 hours to
change brake pads, christ it takes that long to get it on the lift.
--
____________________
Remove "X" from email address to reply.
 
What ever the book said:

times my labor rate!

To charge different customers, a different labor rate is illegal.

Unless you set up an account with a large fleet or a used car dealer.

How can you charge one customer four hours to do a heater core, and another
four hours to do brakes?

Are you on crack?

Refinish King


"Jim85CJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> You didn't charge every customer the same rate? That's illegal, isn't it?
>
> Refinish King wrote:
>
> > Then you were a victim:
> >
> > I ran an honest shop, and even cut time off of flat rate for seniors and
> > people of less privilege. So before you come out of the gate asking me

who
> > the hell I think I am? I'm an honest shop operator, nothing like the

ones
> > who took advantage of you.
> >
> > I refuse to be compared to the grease monkey image you speak of, when I

took
> > time to help the local action groups and churches with the poor that

needed
> > their cars fixed, in order to find jobs, I treated customers fairly and

paid
> > for training for my employees so they would "Do the job right the first
> > time" plus quicker!
> >
> > Maybe you got screwed, but not by me!
> >
> > So if you have a bone to pick, go to the source that stuck it to you,

not
> > the one who gave you an accurate description.
> >
> > With kind regards,
> >
> > Refinish King
> >
> >
> > "Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> >>Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the

> >
> > flat
> >
> >>rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
> >>rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would

fix
> >
> > a
> >
> >>car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
> >>even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle

> >
> > in
> >
> >>for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged

me
> >>the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate

for
> >>the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
> >>mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
> >>before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
> >>over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could

> >
> > have
> >
> >>done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate

since
> >
> > I
> >
> >>am told up front what it is going to cost me.
> >>"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in

message
> >>news:eek:[email protected]...
> >>
> >>>Flat rate books were written for a reason:
> >>>
> >>>to give technicians an estimated time that it would require to do the

> >
> > job.
> >
> >>>If a technician is proficient, and beats it. Should he be penalized?
> >>>
> >>>The customer asks how much?
> >>>
> >>>The customer is told 4 hours at $50.00.
> >>>
> >>>If it takes 10 hours, the customer gets to slide, but if the job goes
> >>
> >>well.
> >>
> >>>The business owner gets dorked?
> >>>
> >>>Where's the incentive to be in business?
> >>>
> >>>You must be a trolling customer, who wants it all, a guarantee that he
> >>
> >>will
> >>
> >>>get it cheap, and none of the things that can go wrong on the job. Flat
> >>>rate, you win some and lose some!
> >>>
> >>>Refinish King
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>
> >>>>And using the same thought, if it is an hourly rate you will still fix
> >>
> >>it
> >>
> >>>>for free since you screwed it up the first time. But then with the

> >
> > flat
> >
> >>>>rate, if you charge for 4 hours and only take 2 hours, then you are
> >>
> >>ahead
> >>
> >>>of
> >>>
> >>>>the game. Unless, if doing it hourly, you lie and say it took longer.
> >>
> >>But
> >>
> >>>>doing this you will run out of customers fast. Flat rate are charged

> >
> > for
> >
> >>a
> >>
> >>>>reason. Very few people want to pay by the hour. You could make a 2

> >
> > hour
> >
> >>>job
> >>>
> >>>>last for days.
> >>>>"Refinish King" <[email protected]> wrote in
> >>
> >>message
> >>
> >>>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>>
> >>>>>A clearer definition of flat rate:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an
> >>>>
> >>>>arbitrary
> >>>>
> >>>>>figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it
> >>>
> >>>comes
> >>>
> >>>>>back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted
> >>>>
> >>>>warranty
> >>>>
> >>>>>time.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Guess what? you fix it for free!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician
> >>
> >>you
> >>
> >>>>want
> >>>>
> >>>>>working on your car!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced
> >>>
> >>>technicians
> >>>
> >>>>>or butchers on flat rate!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>The End.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Refinish King
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >>>>>news:[email protected]...
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>In article <[email protected]>,
> >>>>>>[email protected] says...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>mic canic wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars
> >>>
> >>>first
> >>>
> >>>>>time
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it

> >
> > for
> >
> >>>free
> >>>
> >>>>>>>the second time.....
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get
> >>
> >>your
> >>
> >>>8
> >>>
> >>>>>>>hours anyway
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Johan
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the

> >
> > same
> >
> >>>>>>even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid

> >
> > for
> >
> >>to
> >>
> >>>>>>fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> >>>>>>--
> >>>>>>____________________
> >>>>>>Remove "X" from email address to reply.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>

> >
> >
> >

>




 
LOL

If they last till the warranty expires you mean?

Refinish King

PS
I managed a Dodge/Chrysler/jeep body shop and helped the inept service
manager in service. So I know first hand of the Dakota 4Wd differential
failures that Mopar wouldn't cover, and all of their wonderful business
philosophies.

Sincerely,

Refinish King


"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] says...
> > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> >
> > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

arbitrary
> > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

comes
> > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

warranty
> > time.
> >
> > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> >
> > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you

want
> > working on your car!
> >
> > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

technicians
> > or butchers on flat rate!
> >
> > The End.
> >
> > Refinish King

>
> Jeeps don't start to fall apart until the day after the warranty
> expires.
>
> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.




 
Not to mention the sintered wheel nuts and studs:

Which they recommend we don't lubricate, and Anti-Seize has been proven time
and time again to not attract dust!

Refinish King

"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, dbs58
> @nospam.hotmail.com says...
> >
> > Who the hell are you calling a trolling customer? I am totally for the

flat
> > rate. I was trying to explain WHY they use the flat rate over an hourly
> > rate. Too many customers were screwed by dishonest mechanics who would

fix a
> > car in 2 hours and said it took 4 hours. The flat rate stopped this. And
> > even the flat rate is over estimated but it works. When I took a vehicle

in
> > for work, I was charged the flat rate for each item done. They charged

me
> > the flat rate for the catalytic converter. Then added in the flat rate

for
> > the brakes. Total time was about 6 hours but they were done in 2. So the
> > mechanic made out. I have no problem with that. They did a good job. But
> > before the flat rate, when I had work done, they would end up keeping it
> > over night and charge me for 10 hours labor for something that I could

have
> > done myself in 3 hours. So no, I have nothing against the flat rate

since I
> > am told up front what it is going to cost me.
> >

>
>
> I don't know what magical book they showed you but all the flat rate
> manuals I have read are HEAVILY in the customer's favor. .2 hours to
> change brake pads, christ it takes that long to get it on the lift.
> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.




 
when was the last time you went into a dealer aftermarket maybe but dealers
is a whole different thing

Refinish King wrote:

> A clearer definition of flat rate:
>
> If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an arbitrary
> figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it comes
> back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted warranty
> time.
>
> Guess what? you fix it for free!
>
> So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you want
> working on your car!
>
> Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced technicians
> or butchers on flat rate!
>
> The End.
>
> Refinish King
>
> "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > [email protected] says...
> > >
> > >
> > > mic canic wrote:
> > >
> > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars first

> time
> > >
> > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > >
> > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for free
> > > the second time.....
> > >
> > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your 8
> > > hours anyway
> > >
> > > Johan
> > >

> >
> > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > --
> > ____________________
> > Remove "X" from email address to reply.


 
I worked at a dealer:

I averaged $1800.00 a week on warrantee work only!

Refinish King


"mic canic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> when was the last time you went into a dealer aftermarket maybe but

dealers
> is a whole different thing
>
> Refinish King wrote:
>
> > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> >
> > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

arbitrary
> > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

comes
> > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

warranty
> > time.
> >
> > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> >
> > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you

want
> > working on your car!
> >
> > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

technicians
> > or butchers on flat rate!
> >
> > The End.
> >
> > Refinish King
> >
> > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > [email protected] says...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > mic canic wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars

first
> > time
> > > >
> > > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > > >
> > > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for

free
> > > > the second time.....
> > > >
> > > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your

8
> > > > hours anyway
> > > >
> > > > Johan
> > > >
> > >
> > > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> > > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > > --
> > > ____________________
> > > Remove "X" from email address to reply.

>




 
you won't now
the germs make you take pictures of the failed parts esp. body work

Refinish King wrote:

> I worked at a dealer:
>
> I averaged $1800.00 a week on warrantee work only!
>
> Refinish King
>
> "mic canic" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > when was the last time you went into a dealer aftermarket maybe but

> dealers
> > is a whole different thing
> >
> > Refinish King wrote:
> >
> > > A clearer definition of flat rate:
> > >
> > > If the rate manual gives four hours to do a particular job, for an

> arbitrary
> > > figure. You take eight hours. You get paid for four hours, and if it

> comes
> > > back for defective workmanship, not a part failure in the allotted

> warranty
> > > time.
> > >
> > > Guess what? you fix it for free!
> > >
> > > So in essence, a flat rate technician is most likely the technician you

> want
> > > working on your car!
> > >
> > > Employers are very leery about putting shoddy or inexperienced

> technicians
> > > or butchers on flat rate!
> > >
> > > The End.
> > >
> > > Refinish King
> > >
> > > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > > news:[email protected]...
> > > > In article <[email protected]>,
> > > > [email protected] says...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > mic canic wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > end the flat rate pay system and everyone will have fixed cars

> first
> > > time
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you like to xplain your logic ????
> > > > >
> > > > > How about fix it right the first time or you will be doing it for

> free
> > > > > the second time.....
> > > > >
> > > > > Thats better then sit on your lazy ass, F*ck up again, and get your

> 8
> > > > > hours anyway
> > > > >
> > > > > Johan
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Do you know what flat rate means? It means you'll get paid the same
> > > > even if you work on it for twice as long as you're getting paid for to
> > > > fix it right, so where's the incentive?
> > > > --
> > > > ____________________
> > > > Remove "X" from email address to reply.

> >


 
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