Fools rush in...19J

FlyingPete · Mar 10, 2015

Indeed- it's best to treat the engine and associated systems as one indivisible power unit. That way the engine has no idea it's not in the original 90 anymore and so won't get confused and be unpredictable

tottot · Mar 10, 2015

nobber said:
I don't think Id mess with the boost or fuelling, 19Js are good little engines until you start messing with them.
You will need a 19j rad, a 19j expansion tank and most importantly 19j top and bottom hoses, as said before they suffer from heat stress, don't go messing with the cooling system.
When I first put one into my 90

The problem is he is not fitting it into a 90 and to get a rad from a 90 into a series will require much modification to grill.
. Use expansion tank from a 200/300 it's larger.
Had twin electric fans on my 19j and they ran plenty.
19j rads about double the price of series or 200 ones.

Turboman · Mar 10, 2015

tottot said:
nobber said:

. Use expansion tank from a 200/300 it's larger.
Had twin electric fans on my 19j and they ran plenty.

Click to expand...

On a technical level you are absolutely right, but I could never bring myself to ditch that nice brass expansion tank and fit a plastic one!

I had twin electrics too, they often cut in as well, but not always when I thought they should have!

They are now in a feed bag under my bench, viscous fan and cowl back on the 90. Temp gauge is steady as a rock, there used to be little movements with the electric fans.

moorlander · Mar 10, 2015

Hi folks
Thanks so much for all the input for a newbie.

I has just fitted a new series 3 rad so I am reluctant to scrap it. So I have bought a 19 row oil cooler, and I'll fit an oil temperature gauge too, to keep an eye on it.
By the way can i get away with the (new) series 3 exhaust or is it scrap?
Thanks again guys.

Turboman · Mar 10, 2015

moorlander said:
Hi folks
Thanks so much for all the input for a newbie.

I has just fitted a new series 3 rad so I am reluctant to scrap it. So I have bought a 19 row oil cooler, and I'll fit an oil temperature gauge too, to keep an eye on it.
By the way can i get away with the (new) series 3 exhaust or is it scrap?
Thanks again guys.

Fitting the oil temp gauge is a very good idea, I think you will be surprised by the readings. The heat that isn't lost through intercooler can only go into the oil and water.

With the exhaust, fit a 19j downpipe from the turbo elbow, and then see whether you can mate it up with the series exhaust. Exhausts come in a wide variety of patterns, I seem to remember. Just trial, error, and lots of clamps and gun gum, I would think

tottot · Mar 10, 2015

Series exhaust has a smaller diameter than a 19j one and will limit top end power but as you are not expecting to work it hard should not be a problem. Second Turboman about 19j downpipe.

Turboman · Mar 10, 2015

tottot said:
Series exhaust has a smaller diameter than a 19j one and will limit top end power but as you are not expecting to work it hard should not be a problem. Second Turboman about 19j downpipe.

A distant memory from a long time ago, a six cylinder series exhaust is a larger diameter pipe.

But OPs is presumably from a four pot!

moorlander · Mar 11, 2015

Thanks again guys. what's OP's??

moorlander · Mar 11, 2015

BTW if I add the oil cooler do I need to still mess with the expansion tank?

nobber · Mar 11, 2015

tottot said:
nobber said:

I don't think Id mess with the boost or fuelling, 19Js are good little engines until you start messing with them.
You will need a 19j rad, a 19j expansion tank and most importantly 19j top and bottom hoses, as said before they suffer from heat stress, don't go messing with the cooling system.
When I first put one into my 90

The problem is he is not fitting it into a 90 and to get a rad from a 90 into a series will require much modification to grill.
. Use expansion tank from a 200/300 it's larger.
Had twin electric fans on my 19j and they ran plenty.
19j rads about double the price of series or 200 ones.

Click to expand...

Does the series rad have a bleed off pipe from the top of the rad to the expansion tank as well as top and bottom hoses?
That's why mine kept over heating when going up hills, it airlocked the top hose and couldn't bleed itself.

nobber · Mar 11, 2015

moorlander said:
BTW if I add the oil cooler do I need to still mess with the expansion tank?

It depends on what you are going to do, You will basically be redesigning the cooling system to suit whatever radiator you find.
The 19j expansion tank fits the 19j bottom hose and has an inlet for the radiator bleed pipe.
Also , what side is the bottom outlet on a series rad? If its the same side I would use the 19j expansion tank to make it all easier.
If you like I can get some photos of a 19j cooling system.

top drive · Mar 11, 2015

"I decided to rebuild it put in, new pistons hot spots, bottom end shells etc"

to the OP.

What was the rough cost of parts and where did you go for them for this.

my next project involves stripping my old 19j , inspecting and id like to rebuild it for a future project/an engine to use when i rebuild my 200tdi. if its not completely banjo'd that is - its a late block and was running reasonably well when i took it apart although i suspect a cracked piston or 2.

Its more for the act of rebuilding the engine than to end up with a top dog engine.

nobber · Mar 11, 2015

top drive said:
"I decided to rebuild it put in, new pistons hot spots, bottom end shells etc"

to the OP.

What was the rough cost of parts and where did you go for them for this.

my next project involves stripping my old 19j , inspecting and id like to rebuild it for a future project/an engine to use when i rebuild my 200tdi. if its not completely banjo'd that is - its a late block and was running reasonably well when i took it apart although i suspect a cracked piston or 2.

Its more for the act of rebuilding the engine than to end up with a top dog engine.

Try Turner Engineering.

top drive · Mar 11, 2015

cheers nobber will have a look. dont really want to go loading it with blue boxes..... although the boxes might be more effective than the parts

tottot · Mar 11, 2015

OP's "original parts." On older vehicles like series land-rover the expansion tank is built into the top of the rad and there will be a little air in it, any excess coolant gets blown out into a catch bottle[no pressure in bottle] on the side.When rad cools down a vacuum develops in the rad and coolant is drawn back in from from the bottle.
On newer vehicles the expansion tank is separate and it is the air space in the tank that allows for expansion.There is no pressure release cap like on a series,this keeps the rad full of coolant.
As an exception to the rule the 19J's small expansion tank does have a pressure release cap if I remember right.

top drive · Mar 11, 2015

19j just has a breather hole in the neck of the filler vented to atmosphere with no diaphragm - not in the cap

I can take photos of the set up tonight to clarify but its something ive been working on recently setting up the cooling on my 200tdi conversion.

Paul D · Mar 11, 2015

moorlander said:
Thanks again guys. what's OP's??

OP = Original Poster .. whoever posted the original query ..

Turboman · Mar 11, 2015

moorlander said:
Thanks again guys. what's OP's??

I meant exactly what Paul said^^^^^^^^^^^.

Original Poster, the person who started the thread.

Turboman · Mar 11, 2015

moorlander said:
BTW if I add the oil cooler do I need to still mess with the expansion tank?

It is not essential to replace the expansion tank, and I am not sure if it is a good idea. A 19j brass tank has a pressure release cap, just a normal radiator cap, it vents at 7 psi from memory. Also from memory, Tdi tank doesn't have this.

I am still not sure if using the series rad is going to be easier than patching in the right rad, and moving the grille. I don't have a series atm, but I would have thought it is just a matter of getting an old 90 front panel and grille, and cutting a few holes in the wings to mount the panel, they are only held onto a 90 with clips that the bolts go into.
If you use series rad, you will, as Nobber has posted, have to design and build a cooling system from scratch. If you can somehow shoehorn 19j rad, all the hoses and oil cooler pipes should fit.

Whether you decide to fit standard or air cooled oil cooler, it would be worth changing the little thermostat in the oil filter housing, unless you did this as part of the rebuild.

Just a thought, try and research how people fit Tdi into series, that is quite common, and they have to find room for a rad with an intercooler.

nobber · Mar 11, 2015

The thing about replacing the expansion tank is the bottom hose, on my 2.3 (which I am assuming is the same as a series, but could be wrong) the spigot on the bottom of the tank that the bottom hose is connected to was a different size and the 19j bottom hose wouldn't fit, I had to make an adaptor which was OK (ish) until I got the correct tank.

Buts that assuming you use a 19j bottom hose.

Fools rush in...19J

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Old, nackered 'n broke, but the Landy is fine . :)

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