Freelander 2 (LR2) FL2 Rear Diff Seizure.

Arctic2 · Mar 11, 2021

Nodge68 said:
I hope nothing serious Steve. Get well soon.

I didn't notice the poorly bit Ali, so thanks for bringing it to my attention.

HI Ali & John.
Thank you for asking yes, quite unwell i caught some sort of infection after having a tooth pulled, it took me off my feet, lost use in my legs, could not lift my arms above my chest, all my fingers were cramped up so could not open my hands properly, tummy up sets, swollen feel and legs with bad rash for about 2 weeks, i am now just only getting about snice 5th Feb, still weak on my legs, and hands also can not get my arms above my head. Not Covid as have been tested twice and both came back negative, also had my first Astra Zenica jab last Friday so had a little bit of man flu.

Onwards and upwards hopefully.

Nodge68 · Mar 11, 2021

Arctic2 said:
HI Ali & John.
Thank you for asking yes, quite unwell i caught some sort of infection after having a tooth pulled, it took me off my feet, lost use in my legs, could not lift my arms above my chest, all my fingers were cramped up so could not open my hands properly, tummy up sets, swollen feel and legs with bad rash for about 2 weeks, i am now just only getting about snice 5th Feb, still weak on my legs, and hands also can not get my arms above my head. Not Covid as have been tested twice and both came back negative, also had my first Astra Zenica jab last Friday so had a little bit of man flu.

Onwards and upwards hopefully.

Sounds like you've been through the mill Steve. I hope you're well on your way to normality.
I've had the Pfizer vaccine, which didn't give me any symptoms, other than a stiff arm for a couple of days.

See you on here soon.

PRO · Mar 29, 2021

Been reading all this thread with great interest. My diff is also noisy, as seen and heard on MOT ramp today.
Mine is also juddering at low speed turnings. No obvious oil leaks but somebody has been there before that's for sure.
I have ordered a full kit kind of uprated Timken and SKF bearings with Haldex service as well. Next week I will have the diff out and hopefully it's salvageable.
What I will do is take out the haldex fuse in the summer or dry days to keep the diff/haldex low mileage. I don't need 4wd that much really and I prefer a warning than the hassle of maintaining this.
I know there are some software updates on the haldex unit/ecu and what not, but I guess my future chinese sdd will not have the files, perhaps a dealer visit will do.
Seems like Land Rover never got the 4wd right/lasting. At least FL1 was cheap.
I am also doubtful of the offroad capability of FL2 after seeing the rear driveshafts thickness, seem like they were designed to withstand a rainy day in asda parking.
Had a Shogun Sport 1 this winter, although is a rust bucket and weird car you can tell that thing is build to last and the 4wd system is very reliable.

Nodge68 · Mar 29, 2021

The AWD system is very good, but I still think the VCU based system of the FL1 was more than adequate, without all the expenses and complexity of the Haldex system.

I'll be doing a rear diff rebuild guide, when I actually have time to do it.

You'll need the special tools to complete the rebuild, unless you can make something up.

I believe the rear diff fails due to the pinion bearings being over tight from the factory. My replacement diff pinion was so stiff to turn, that I needed a ratchet to turn it, when it should turn with light hand pressure only.
If a diff is rebuilt properly, then it'll last a very long time, with nothing more than regular oil changes.

The spindly drive shafts are seriously strong. My diff seized solid, the drive shafts taking all that torque from the skidding tyres, yet they are fine, and still being used now.

My Chinese SDD did many updates of my FL2, and I think it added 3 flash indicators, which I don't remember it having before doing the updates.

PRO · Mar 29, 2021

may I know more about the special tools? or is there a torque map on doing this now I am going to panic cause I need all the prerequisites.

Jackpl · Jan 31, 2022

Nodge68 said:
I never considered you to be challenging me. I figured you were just interested.

Yes, the earlier (pre 2010/11) diffs had a smaller input bearing (the one that fails, closest to the Haldex) originally supplied by SKF and was 62mm OD, 30mm ID and 17.25mm wide. A sensible upgrade for this size is the Timken 30206, which has a load rating 25% higher than the OE SKF.
The post 2011 diffs had a larger 62mm OD, 30mm ID and 21.25mm width. SKF was again the OE supplier.

I don't believe it's an issue with the bearings that cause the failure, at least not the bearing loadings from driveline components.
Feeling the pre-load on these for myself, it's pretty obvious as to why they are failing at such low mileages. A bearing should never have a pre-load that is so high that the rolling elements actually cause damage to the cup or cone. This diff pinion can't be turned by hand, which is simply far to tight. I'd expect to feel some drag as the pinion is turned, but not so much it actually won't turn with one hand.
If this replacement diff has done 50k miles with a high pre-load, then the smaller Haldex end bearing won't last much longer.

I believe that the once I've rebuilt it to my own pre-load, then even the OE SKF bearing should have a much better life.

The other issue I believe these diffs suffer is bad lubrication to the bearing that fails. The oil feed to this bearing is pathetic, although looking at how the bearings are failing, its not a just lubrication issue, but a combination of high pre-load and poor lubrication.

Hello,
I’m half way on my 2010 FL2 diff, got it on the table, awaiting for that special tool to undo/redo that big pinion nut.
My diff was done at 150k kms in 2016 and got nice again now at 200k. After all I found the diff breather was blocked and diff oil was pressure forced into Haldex side so diff had almost no oil but Haldex had 1 litre .
I’m hoping I put it together with four new bearings and seals.
My question is about this famous 250Nm torque on nut and 1.1Nm preload torque.
What are yours or may be other recommendations if I could ask, please?
I’m retired aircraft engineer, used to service my cars for all my life, sometimes done a bigger task like this time.
Best greetings from a very hot Melbourne, Australia
John

Nodge68 · Jan 31, 2022

Jackpl said:
My question is about this famous 250Nm torque on nut and 1.1Nm preload torque.
What are yours or may be other recommendations if I could ask, please?

If you're an engineer, then you'll have a good idea how a tight a taper bearing pack should feel. I tightened the nut until the pinion pre-load felt about right. I didn't have and an accurate way to measure 1.1Nm, so did it all by feel. When I got the diff I rebuilt, the pinion was silly tight, something like 35FtLb IIRC, I definitely couldn't turn it by hand without leverage, so I wasn't going to assemble it anything like as tight.

The nut.
I had to apply much more than 250Nm to the nut, in order to start compressing the crush tube, so there's not much relevance to the torque figure quoted, unless it's a minimum torque.
The nut also has a locking compound factory applied, so they don't want it coming undone.

The old nut I removed was seriously tight, tight enough for me to require a 4ft tube to shift it, which might go some way to explain why the pre- load was high.

Freelander 2 (LR2) FL2 Rear Diff Seizure.

Arctic2

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Nodge68

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PRO

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Nodge68

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PRO

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