First ever tinker around...broke it already ;-)

jstoddar · May 30, 2011

Hi All,

As you will tell am new to this maintenance business but eager to learn and already enjoying tinkering with my new toy.

However in my enthusiasm I have already done something to stop it starting

Previous owner had an amplifier fitted, there was a +ve feed straight of the battery and a whole pile of wires behind the seats and running under gear leavers, behind fusebox and into stereo, thought removing them would be easy and a good starter for ten.

In the process I removed both battery connections and cleaned them up, was very pleased with my efforts until I discovered my 90 wont start.

From digging through the forums it seems there should be an earth strap from battery -ve to a fixed point elsewhere, don't remember seeing it but guess I have removed it, can someone give me an "idiots" guide to checking/finding/replacing it?

Thanks

Tommy O' · May 30, 2011

try one of your jump leads[black or red] dieect from the negetive side of the battery direct to a strong bolt on the engine head or one of the lift hooks and see what happens . If it starts earth fault. Good luck

Station House · May 31, 2011

Would be surprised if you'd accidentally removed the battery earth

Fairly thick black cable runs from -ve post on battery, through side of battery tray and is fixed to the chassis

Get underneath and follow the cable to make sure it's there, but would be very surprised if you'd removed.

Assuming that isn't it:

1) Are the headlamps working and bright? - if yes battery is connected

2) What happens when you turn ignition key - is there a click and nothing else, does the engine turn but not start, does the engine turn very very slowly as if it's struggling?

Oh - and what year/engine? If it has an immobiliser wondering if somehow that's become upset

jstoddar · May 31, 2011

Station House said:
Would be surprised if you'd accidentally removed the battery earth

Fairly thick black cable runs from -ve post on battery, through side of battery tray and is fixed to the chassis

Get underneath and follow the cable to make sure it's there, but would be very surprised if you'd removed.

Black cable still there (See pic) did not realise -ve feed and earth were the same thing

, will get under later to check connection.

Station House said:
1) Are the headlamps working and bright? - if yes battery is connected

2) What happens when you turn ignition key - is there a click and nothing else, does the engine turn but not start, does the engine turn very very slowly as if it's struggling?
t

Headlamps good so not battery, just a loud click from the fusebox, did have it out to remove speaker cables could there be a loose connection?

Station House said:
Oh - and what year/engine? If it has an immobiliser wondering if somehow that's become upset

86 Defender but has 200tdi engine in place of original 2.5.

Station House · May 31, 2011

OK, mines a 300 TDI but think wiring broadly similar.

Not impossible to have knocked a wire off the back of the ignition switch if you had the fuse box out - 4 screws removes the instrument cluster and you'll be able to see down to the back of the ignition switch to check all wiring is secure - that said nto sure you'd get a 'click' if the wires were off

Starter motor is wired directly from the battery (not through fuse box behind gear lever) with a separate feed coming from the ignition switch to the starter solonoid.

Again not impossible that somehow the spade connector off the back of the starter motor has pulled free, so have a look there as well.

Some have a fuse box in the engine compartment (black, square to the left of the heater box) - usually 3 or 4 large (maxi) blade fuses in there. Some are linked to the glow plugs, one might be starter related - never worked out which are which, but no harm in removing them one at a time and checking with a multi meter - they can get hairline cracks and the terminals can get coroded.

Freak unconnected things seem to happen when you start dismantling Landys!

If the earths and all the above OK, could just be a freak coincidence with the starter solonoid failing - worth trying the old trusted approach - give the starter a good whack with a hammer (seriously) - can jolt the solonoid into back working

Oh, and really really check the battery -ve terimanl is clean, well greased and tight - they need to be really secure to get enough current to turn the engine

jstoddar · May 31, 2011

Thanks, will try all of the above when I get home tonight. Bought Landrover to tow a horsebox, already getting it it the ear from the Mrs for putting it out of commision!

:5bboxing_smiley:

Vissie · May 31, 2011

Your now a proper LR owner!!!! Big Gtz

It wasnt broken like a proper LR, so you tinkered with it til it was

jstoddar · Jun 2, 2011

Vissie said:
Your now a proper LR owner!!!! Big Gtz

It wasnt broken like a proper LR, so you tinkered with it til it was

Thanks Vissie

Ok, have managed to find the time to have another look around.

Earth to transmission seems fine, did not take it of as I am not a child with 4' arms

Took fusebox off again, all connections seem to be ok.

Guess my last resort before I give up on any part time mechanic notions and go back to my desk job is to try giving the starter a smack.

Unfortunately I dont know one end of an engine from another, Haynes says "on the left side of engine best seen from above", might as well say "metal bit with wires and pipes coming out" :wtf:

Have attached a picture of left side of the engine, which bit do I hit with Landrover Special Tool No1? :dnfnoob:

Woody3 · Jun 2, 2011

Wrong side of the engine fella.

Left hand side meaning left hand side if you are sat behind the steering wheel

Station House · Jun 2, 2011

It's a bugger to see from on top

Crawl underneath from the passenger side - between the wheel and the step - look up and you'll see it - usually round and black!

If you can see the exhaust down pipe you're in the right area

bustersbus · Jun 2, 2011

Dunno if ye can make owt oot o' these photies....

Bubble Blower · Jun 2, 2011

If your getting a clicking its normally starter solenoid (little pack above the motor in the pic above)

easy fix, new started (new one about £90)

you can also bridge connectors on a starter motor to get it going. but not the best thing to do for a noobie

jstoddar · Jun 2, 2011

Thanks All,

Will have another crawl around tomorrow and see if I can find it, great fun this

Clanforbes · Jun 3, 2011

jstoddar said:
Thanks All,

Will have another crawl around tomorrow and see if I can find it, great fun this

JS - this is why so many of us suggest putting your approx location in your profile. I for one would come over if you were reasonably close, but "Central Scotland" is a biggish area. Narrow it down somewhat with something like North Glasgow or whatever.

You will be much more liable to get help then and as a newbie to mechanics that could only be a good thing.

Pearce_Oldskool · Jun 3, 2011

Just had the same problem with my 90 after a rewiring the engine bay, traced it to the White/red cable coming from the bulkhead connection block to the solenoid, this is the signal cable from the ignition switch, mine had hard copper cores which had cracked internally when moving it all about.
Solution: run a bullet connection from this connection and join it straight to the solenoid,
A long shot but worth checking out before you dismantle it! Good luck!

Clanforbes · Jun 4, 2011

Hi again JS. I see you are in the Polmont area. You are not a million miles from me and as my planned fishing trip has been put off, I'm at a bit of a loose end. If you still haven't found the problem and can get back to me before about 1100hrs this morning (Saturday 4th June) I'll take a wander down your way and see if I can help.......

Assuming, you don't get any offers from anyone nearer you. I will PM you my mobile number 'coz I'm gonna make a start on my camper conversion and will probably be away from the computator thingie.

Ron.

jstoddar · Jun 7, 2011

All,

Just a quick update and thanks for all your advice and help, have followed all your advice to no avail.

Managed to get in touch with the previous owner (only bought Landy last month) he told me starter had been replaced just before he sold it to me, phoned garage and mechanic says

"Is it the cream one that keeps blowing starter motors?" :doh:

So once I find a few strong men for a bump start of to the garage we go for a proper investigation before a new starter is fitted, good start to my Landy ownership dream!

First ever tinker around...broke it already ;-)

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