Discovery TD5 engine starts shaking occasionally when started

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helmuth van es said:
Well it took a while because of vacations here in France but he replaced the injection loop, gasket and no oil in the ECU red plug visible and a filter. Still the same problem. He now suspects it may be an injector, is that at all possible ? FYI he can communicate with the car through his diagnostic devices, three different ones but not with the engine... Any thoughts ? thanks !
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My only thought is that you still need to do live data readings via a Nanocom, a Foxwell, or another diagnostic that CAN communicate with the engine's ECM.
 
Stanleysteamer said:
My only thought is that you still need to do live data readings via a Nanocom, a Foxwell, or another diagnostic that CAN communicate with the engine's ECM.
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Thanks again ! much appreciated, I went to our very competent mechanic, and with Famous Four conclude what you conclude. The problem is that we need to get the right diagnostic, per your advise. He tried three of the diagnostic tools he has: he can see the ABS, the brakes etc all good, but no readings on the engine. Now this is not unusual as you know better then me but we need the right diagnostic in the area of Albi, Castres, Cordes, Gaillac in France.
Anybody reading this that has one that we can use, rent or what have you ?
 
helmuth van es said:
Thanks again ! much appreciated, I went to our very competent mechanic, and with Famous Four conclude what you conclude. The problem is that we need to get the right diagnostic, per your advise. He tried three of the diagnostic tools he has: he can see the ABS, the brakes etc all good, but no readings on the engine. Now this is not unusual as you know better then me but we need the right diagnostic in the area of Albi, Castres, Cordes, Gaillac in France.
Anybody reading this that has one that we can use, rent or what have you ?
Click to expand...
Well I have a Foxwell but sadly we are off back to the UK tomorrow or else I'd have met up with you somewhere and we could have had a bash at it. Thinking about it, my next door neighbour, who is a Land Rover nut has a Nanocom and although he doesn't know you I could ask him if he wants to help.
I'll email him and see if he is happy to take your email address which you could private message to me and then you could both take it from there? OK?
 
Stanleysteamer said:
Well I have a Foxwell but sadly we are off back to the UK tomorrow or else I'd have met up with you somewhere and we could have had a bash at it. Thinking about it, my next door neighbour, who is a Land Rover nut has a Nanocom and although he doesn't know you I could ask him if he wants to help.
I'll email him and see if he is happy to take your email address which you could private message to me and then you could both take it from there? OK?
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Hi Stanley, well that would be great as long as he or she is not too far away but very much appreciate it !
 
Stanleysteamer said:
Well I have a Foxwell but sadly we are off back to the UK tomorrow or else I'd have met up with you somewhere and we could have had a bash at it. Thinking about it, my next door neighbour, who is a Land Rover nut has a Nanocom and although he doesn't know you I could ask him if he wants to help.
I'll email him and see if he is happy to take your email address which you could private message to me and then you could both take it from there? OK?
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Stanley That would be great as long as he or she is not too far, much appreciated, how do I private message you ? thanks
 
helmuth van es said:
Stanley That would be great as long as he or she is not too far, much appreciated, how do I private message you ? thanks
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Top right hand corner of each page next to the bell is an envelope. Click on that and you should be able to work it out. Email sent a second ago.
He is in Labrespy, Mazamet. If you google Labrespy you'll find it straight away as there is only one in the world.
 
tottot said:
You may just need a set of new engine/gearbox mounts.
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Last spring my Ninety had symptoms of engine shaking on start up. It was still running fine just a bit of extra vibration, however on startup the engine could be seen shaking quite a lot. Being a 200tdi no electronic stuff to check
Although no mounts were broken a new set sorted the problem. Worth a look?
 
Stanleysteamer said:
Top right hand corner of each page next to the bell is an envelope. Click on that and you should be able to work it out. Email sent a second ago.
He is in Labrespy, Mazamet. If you google Labrespy you'll find it straight away as there is only one in the world.
Click to expand...
It is a bit far, almost 2 hour drive :) but let's see I messaged you
 
sierrafery said:
Hi, that's not something to be diagnosed without watching live data while it happens or it can become very expensive to replace parts based on guesses .... though next time when it happens unplug the throttle pedal's connector and if it goes back to normal idle then replace it, i've never unplugged one with engine running so i dont know exactly if it will idle or stop completely, if it stops this test is irrelevant, also check the ECU red plug, if it's oil replace the injector loom... for any other issue a capable diagnostic tool is needed handled by somebody who knows Td5s... i doubt that a timing issue would be intermittent, ... can't help you more sorry
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Hi I ran the nanocom kindly lent by Alain and got one error message initially : 3,7 airflow circuit logged high. It appeared to be an old error we think. Then trying to start it, it did not, we did get an error 28,1 injector 1 peak charge short. But we then checked the fuel filter, which was not replaced even though I thought the mechanic did, I went with a friend who has a TD5 Defender. We led it bled and then started and it started and I let it run for a couple of minutes. in the end it started to misbehave a little and initially there was black smoke coming from the muffler. So we thought it was a filter with water accumulating and perhaps dirt. He said the filter was not very dirty at all.... Today the mechanic replaced the filter, purged according to protocol, it runs for 10 seconds he says and then it stops. I will go with the nanocom tomorrow and see what error message it gives if at all, I am very surprised but now I am worried it is an injector after all. Any expert feedback on the error messages ? thanks !
 
What about what i said about the ECU red plug cos you quoted me but didnt mention anything about that especially that you've got an injector related code?... Can be also leaking injector copper washers so start with that, you can lift them out with an allen key or other improvisation to hook them that special tool is not compulsory http://www.discovery2.co.uk/Injector Seals.html

btw, remove the air bleed valve(buy a new WJN500110 to replace it) in the rear wheel side port of the fuel filter head first and if it's full of gunk like in the pic the washers are confirmed as leaking
 

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Thanks, no oil in the red ECU plug but loom was replaced, no effect. Apparently no or very little gunk fuel filter. The photos you sent of the air bleed valve, this could cause air in the fuel or gunk? I will do a nanocom test tomorrow again and see what it says now. Others suggest the o ring and washer too of an injector.
 
See the injector balances at idle with diagnostic tool... a bad injector will have higher value at the beginning while the others will try to compensate and all the values will start rising... if they are all moving within +/- 4 it's OK
 
What are the chances it is the injector 1 itself that is faulty and not the washer or O-rings ?
sierrafery said:
See the injector balances at idle with diagnostic tool... a bad injector will have higher value at the beginning while the others will try to compensate and all the values will start rising... if they are all moving within +/- 4 it's OK
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Thanks ! I understand but what does that mean, ah you are saying it could be a faulty injector 1 and the 4 remaining ones compensate. But it does not start anymore now, only once with new fuel filter and ran for 10 secs and then it did not start anymore. When we bled the old fuel filter it ran for a few minutes until I turned it off. Could that mean it is not then injector(s) but for example the fuel pressure regulator ?
 
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