Can this chassis rot be welded/is it an MOT fail?

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Pretty standard chassis rot as is to e expected from a defender chassis:

548603_10151088244192374_175269274_n.jpg



pressbrake said:
Looks like a typical chassis I see every week!
The trouble is the double skin capillary action sucking the water up, just check for swelling on the chassis showing the corrosion has spread inside.
I loaded myself up with pain killers yesterday(im injured) to do the x member so I dont fancy doing one for a week or two:(
Click to expand...

Clives member (oh er :D) is by far the best out there, couldn't recommend it enough:

527413_10151088616862374_745273976_n.jpg

377566_10151088616467374_920673026_n.jpg
 
Liverpool.90 said:
Thanks for the replies. I have been drooling over Pressbrakes xmembers for a while. Now i know it can be done I just need to get this patched then MOT etc so i can drive down to Essex to have it fitted. If im having it done it may as well be by the man himself. Anyone know how much he is charging these days?
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Only he knows what he charges. Phone and ask him! He's not too scary to talk to.
 
Hozza said:
I have just had some repairs done to my chassis - the front has been repaired and a new rear 1/4 chassis fitted, I asked the bloke if it will need more work done in the future but he told me it will be good for another 20 years!? And a new chassis wasn't economically viable!?

From this:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-...bI/AAAAAAAAB5w/nJX4jxLWUpI/s800/IMG_0012.jpeg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-...BI/AAAAAAAAB54/5NhWOoagq1Q/s800/IMG_0013.jpeg

To this:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-xqi_gFqPKLU/UJjwc8qTcSI/AAAAAAAAB50/jJ62THJMVqo/s800/DSC_0055.JPG
Click to expand...

Thor1950 said:
Well lets see :scratching_chin: You replaced the back quarter and repaired the front half ............. what makes you think the middle isn't rotten or soon to be???????????

What year is it? and what is it
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Hozza said:
Because my man assures me it isn't and that's good enough for me.

A new chassis would have blown my budget taking into account everything else that needed doing. As long as I get another few years out of it.

92 Tdi
Click to expand...

Your man was a good sales man............. told you what you wanted to here, and is probably pre booking you for more welding next year. Think a bit, what makes you think that the center of the chassis is more solid than what you repaired already

1 question how much did you spend on the back and front end welding repairs????????????? lets be honest
 
Thor1950 said:
Your man was a good sales man............. told you what you wanted to here, and is probably pre booking you for more welding next year. Think a bit, what makes you think that the center of the chassis is more solid than what you repaired already

1 question how much did you spend on the back and front end welding repairs????????????? lets be honest
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Just looking at my invoice:
Front welding = removal of front panel, radiator, engine:
Material = £85
Labour = £450

Rear 1/4 Chassis = parts £260, labour £250

So about £1k, correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't a new chassis fitted be about £2.5K?
I just wanted to get out of a hole and get an MOT. I may need to return for a bit more in the future? But by that time I hope to have the money for a new chassis. Taking into account that at the same time I have also had all new clutch parts (cheaper as engine was out), new nearside suspension, new brake disks, calipers and pipes, new exhaust, new starter motor, power steering pipe, timing belt, radiator, the list goes on.. ;) That was enough of a hit for one year.
 
Hozza said:
Just looking at my invoice:
Front welding = removal of front panel, radiator, engine:
Material = £85
Labour = £450

Rear 1/4 Chassis = parts £260, labour £250

So about £1k, correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't a new chassis fitted be about £2.5K?
I just wanted to get out of a hole and get an MOT. I may need to return for a bit more in the future? But by that time I hope to have the money for a new chassis. Taking into account that at the same time I have also had all new clutch parts (cheaper as engine was out), new nearside suspension, new brake disks, calipers and pipes, new exhaust, new starter motor, power steering pipe, timing belt, radiator, the list goes on.. ;) That was enough of a hit for one year.
Click to expand...

new chassis from richards is 1100-1200 quid and could change your self. Will just about bet in 2 years you will spend the same amount again. With decreased resale value for haveing a heavily repaired/welded chassis think you are at a loss. IMO. If you had a galv chassis would be worth more money than what you have now. And if you were to keep it. It would last 20+ years. Will this last 20 yrs what you have now........... think not
 
Thor1950 said:
new chassis from richards is 1100-1200 quid and could change your self. Will just about bet in 2 years you will spend the same amount again. With decreased resale value for haveing a heavily repaired/welded chassis think you are at a loss. IMO. If you had a galv chassis would be worth more money than what you have now. And if you were to keep it. It would last 20+ years. Will this last 20 yrs what you have now........... think not
Click to expand...

I wouldn't really be prepared to do a chassis swap and I needed her back on the road asap to earn her keep :)

Resale value isn't important at the moment, and she will get a galv chassis, just not this year.

I have just raised your point about the centre chassis with my Landie man and he will be sticking it up on ramps tomorrow to take another look... I'll let you know ;)

I appreciate your advice - thanks
 
Thor1950 said:
new chassis from richards is 1100-1200 quid and could change your self. Will just about bet in 2 years you will spend the same amount again. With decreased resale value for haveing a heavily repaired/welded chassis think you are at a loss. IMO. If you had a galv chassis would be worth more money than what you have now. And if you were to keep it. It would last 20+ years. Will this last 20 yrs what you have now........... think not
Click to expand...

To say you could swap yourself is kinda like putting blinkers on, there would be plenty of extra costs plus a chassis swap is a good 100 hours to do properly, that's gonna cost or take a very long time in the garage and once you had done it you would fail the points system an end up on a Q plate which would drop the value even more!

A welded chassis, when done properly, won't drop value and may even increase it if the work is pucka...
 
Hozza said:
Just looking at my invoice:
Front welding = removal of front panel, radiator, engine:
Material = £85
Labour = £450

Rear 1/4 Chassis = parts £260, labour £250

So about £1k, correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't a new chassis fitted be about £2.5K?
I just wanted to get out of a hole and get an MOT. I may need to return for a bit more in the future? But by that time I hope to have the money for a new chassis. Taking into account that at the same time I have also had all new clutch parts (cheaper as engine was out), new nearside suspension, new brake disks, calipers and pipes, new exhaust, new starter motor, power steering pipe, timing belt, radiator, the list goes on.. ;) That was enough of a hit for one year.
Click to expand...
Im too cheap;)
 
Hozza said:
I wouldn't really be prepared to do a chassis swap and I needed her back on the road asap to earn her keep :)

Resale value isn't important at the moment, and she will get a galv chassis, just not this year.

I have just raised your point about the centre chassis with my Landie man and he will be sticking it up on ramps tomorrow to take another look... I'll let you know ;)

I appreciate your advice - thanks
Click to expand...
the centre section survives better cos its not double skinned
 
Jongould said:
To say you could swap yourself is kinda like putting blinkers on, there would be plenty of extra costs plus a chassis swap is a good 100 hours to do properly, that's gonna cost or take a very long time in the garage and once you had done it you would fail the points system an end up on a Q plate which would drop the value even more!

A welded chassis, when done properly, won't drop value and may even increase it if the work is pucka...
Click to expand...

You are so very wrong................... Chassis have a parts # from Land rover, no different from replacing a starter. Would that make it a Q plate also.

Check your facts first.

Blue haze had his chassis replaced after a accident had it replaced by insurance and was not put on a Q plate
 
Thor1950 said:
You are so very wrong................... Chassis have a parts # from Land rover, no different from replacing a starter. Would that make it a Q plate also.

Check your facts first.

Blue haze had his chassis replaced after a accident had it replaced by insurance and was not put on a Q plate
Click to expand...


But a landrover chassis isnt a galv chassis, a galv chassis comes from an aftermarket manafacturer and as such is not a direct replacement, this will then mean you need an IVA test and it would end up being a Q plate vehicle.

You could go 2 routes, you could either not tell the DVLA of the swap and then if they ever asked say it was done previous to you having the vehicle or you could get a genuine LR chassis and get it galv'd, this would be OK but quite costly.

You would need to get 8 points from the following:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]chassis or body shell (body and chassis as one unit - monocoque ie direct replacement from the manufacturer) (original or new) = 5 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]suspension = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]axles = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]transmission = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]steering assembly = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]engine = 1 point[/FONT]
​


If you had a totally standard vehicle you could get away with it but if you have a lift or different axles e.t.c. then you will fail the points system...
​


Again though, dont mention it and you would be OK. To say that a chassis swap is straight forward though is not being totally truthful, its not as easy as undo that and redo that...​
 
Jongould said:
But a landrover chassis isnt a galv chassis, a galv chassis comes from an aftermarket manafacturer and as such is not a direct replacement, this will then mean you need an IVA test and it would end up being a Q plate vehicle.

You could go 2 routes, you could either not tell the DVLA of the swap and then if they ever asked say it was done previous to you having the vehicle or you could get a genuine LR chassis and get it galv'd, this would be OK but quite costly.

You would need to get 8 points from the following:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]chassis or body shell (body and chassis as one unit - monocoque ie direct replacement from the manufacturer) (original or new) = 5 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]suspension = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]axles = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]transmission = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]steering assembly = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]engine = 1 point[/FONT]
​


If you had a totally standard vehicle you could get away with it but if you have a lift or different axles e.t.c. then you will fail the points system...
​


Again though, dont mention it and you would be OK. To say that a chassis swap is straight forward though is not being totally truthful, its not as easy as undo that and redo that...​
Click to expand...


Sorry to say you are so wrong.. When you order a chassis they will even stamp the numbers for you if you have the right papers

you can get chassis from LR and send it out for dipping............ With your thought you change to electric fan, or larger alternator, larger tyres, and on and on would all go on Q plate with your thinking
 
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Thor1950 said:
Sorry to say you are so wrong.. When you order a chassis they will even stamp the numbers for you if you have the right papers

you can get chassis from LR and send it out for dipping............ With your thought you change to electric fan, or larger alternator, larger tyres, and on and on would all go on Q plate with your thinking
Click to expand...


If you could get LR to supply papers for the chassis then yeah, OK, it could be a direct replacement, if its not a direct one then it would need to have an IVA

As for that second statement, when have I said anything indicating that? Were talking chassis swaps here not general components, how did you get from that to me saying 'if you replace anything it goes to a Q plate'?? A chassis is a major structural change to a vehicle and the DVLA/VOSA would want to see documentation that it had been done with the correct parts and not a second hand/modified/aftermarket chassis...
 
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Jongould said:
If you could get LR to supply papers for the chassis then yeah, OK, it could be a direct replacement, if its not a direct one then it would need to have an IVA

As for that second statement, when have I said anything indicating that? Were talking chassis swaps here not general components, how did you get from that to me saying 'if you replace anything it goes to a Q plate'?? A chassis is a major structural change to a vehicle and the DVLA/VOSA would want to see documentation that it had been done with the correct parts and not a second hand/modified/aftermarket chassis...
Click to expand...

A chassis is a general component.....

And I'm sure Richards and the like are ok'd to use as replacement parts as the old chassis aren't made anymore
 
Dr_evil said:
A chassis is a general component.....

And I'm sure Richards and the like are ok'd to use as replacement parts as the old chassis aren't made anymore
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I will stand corrected that a galv chassis can be used as a direct replacement providing it is built to the original specifications and that it wont need a points check, I got that wrong and will hold my hands up there, still it needs to be an approved chassis and not any old thing, it has to be built to original specs and approved by the original manufacturer. heres a bit of info about it all:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]For rebuilt vehicles, the rules state that in order to retain the original registration mark (direct quotes from VOSA website are in italics):[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]Cars and car-derived vans (this includes Land Rovers) must use:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]The original unmodified chassis or unaltered bodyshell (i.e. body and chassis as one unit - monocoque); or a new chassis or monocoque bodyshell of the same specification as the original supported by evidence from the dealer or manufacturer (e.g. receipt).[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]And two other major components from the original vehicle - ie suspension (front & back); steering assembly; axles (both); transmission or engine.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]If a second-hand chassis or monocoque bodyshell is used a car must pass an Individual Vehicle Approval (IVA) and light goods vans must have a enhanced single vehicle approval (ESVA) or single vehicle approval (SVA) test after which a "Q" prefix registration number will be allocated.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]For radically altered vehicles a points system is used. Vehicle must score eight or more points to retain the original identity and avoid the need for an SVA test. The following values are allocated to the major components used:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]chassis or body shell (body and chassis as one unit - monocoque ie direct replacement from the manufacturer) (original or new) = 5 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]suspension = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]axles = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]transmission = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]steering assembly = 2 points[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]engine = 1 point[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]VOSA (the vehicle licencing authority) generally allow 'like for like' replacements. So for example, a new set of leaf springs on a Series vehicle would keep the two points for suspension, provided they used the standard original mounting points. Likewise, a reconditioned 2.25 petrol engine replacing a worn out original would retain the 1 point for engine, but a TDi conversion in a Series vehicle would not.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Monaco]For the Land Rover rebuilder the key issue here is likely to be the chassis. Enquiries to VOSA have confirmed that 'unmodified' and 'of the same specification as the original' mean exactly that. So: shortened or lengthened Discovery/Range Rover chassis are out. So are custom-built new coil spring chassis for Series vehicles. You can argue that even bobtail Rangies and Discoveries are technically illegal, as the chassis has to be shortened at the rear. Modifying Series chassis to take power steering boxes? Very, very dubious. It seems harsh that the reuse of good second hand chassis is in effect prohibited, but as I said earlier, the rules weren't written with Land Rovers in mind. For most cars the bodyshell is, in effect, the car. On a Land Rover the chassis is just another replaceable bit, although a large one. The legislation doesn't reflect this. The only Land Rovers on modified or second-hand chassis which you can be reasonably certain are legal, are those built before the SVA rules were introduced in 1998, or vehicles which have undergone an SVA test.[/FONT]​
 
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