Bare Minimum..............

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marquis

marquis

New Member
Posts
60
Location
St Albans
I need to replace block for one with top hat liners, I'd like to buy a short engine but finances dictate, so I'm thinking would it be possible to just replace the block and gasketts and reuse everything else??
Just trying to work out the cheapest way of getting my motor back on the road.
If I had to change other stuff what is the bare minimum I could do. The engine was working fine before the overheating problem.....
Cheers for your thoughts, Soz If it is a silly question to some!
Its a 95 gems 4.0L SE
 
ACR do a bare top hat liner block for about a grand - I believe they were the first to do it and supply many of the other big boys who claim it's their work.

ACR - Land Rover Engines - Rover V8 Engines - Range Rover V8 Engines- Land Rover Cylinder Heads Electronic Automatic Gearbox Controller- top hat liners

IMHO P38s are getting old, if the prices are kept sensible like this, owners are far more likely to have the car repaired and the engineering companies will get business, when you get these silly £2-3K quotes for top-hat liner blocks the owners will just scrap the cars. This should be a case of engineering firms getting the price right and getting the work instead of missed opportunities where the (increasingly poor as the cars get older) customers just can't afford it. £3,4,5 grand engine repair costs are nothing when you've just paid £40 grand for a car, but when you've paid £3K for a car, it's the end of the story and companies who specialise in repairing Rover V8s lose another customer and another Rover V8 engined car (potential custom) disappears off the road. Fitting these liners is trivial in engineering terms -something that would have cost bugger-all 30 years ago (an extra £100 per block if Rover weren't being so stingy!) when there were dozens of firms vying for business - a tip for the machine shops out there, don't take the ****, advertise wisely, and you'll stay in business.
 
StuckAgainSteve said:
ACR do a bare top hat liner block for about a grand - I believe they were the first to do it and supply many of the other big boys who claim it's their work.

ACR - Land Rover Engines - Rover V8 Engines - Range Rover V8 Engines- Land Rover Cylinder Heads Electronic Automatic Gearbox Controller- top hat liners

IMHO P38s are getting old, if the prices are kept sensible like this, owners are far more likely to have the car repaired and the engineering companies will get business, when you get these silly £2-3K quotes for top-hat liner blocks the owners will just scrap the cars. This should be a case of engineering firms getting the price right and getting the work instead of missed opportunities where the (increasingly poor as the cars get older) customers just can't afford it. £3,4,5 grand engine repair costs are nothing when you've just paid £40 grand for a car, but when you've paid £3K for a car, it's the end of the story and companies who specialise in repairing Rover V8s lose another customer and another Rover V8 engined car (potential custom) disappears off the road. Fitting these liners is trivial in engineering terms -something that would have cost bugger-all 30 years ago (an extra £100 per block if Rover weren't being so stingy!) when there were dozens of firms vying for business - a tip for the machine shops out there, don't take the ****, advertise wisely, and you'll stay in business.
Click to expand...

+1 for that I had a devil of a job to find someone to put a new liner in at a decent price and even then it was still a few hundred quid and the bloke was complaining how tough things were I pointed out if he was cheaper he would have more work
 
marquis said:
I need to replace block for one with top hat liners, I'd like to buy a short engine but finances dictate, so I'm thinking would it be possible to just replace the block and gasketts and reuse everything else??
Just trying to work out the cheapest way of getting my motor back on the road.
If I had to change other stuff what is the bare minimum I could do. The engine was working fine before the overheating problem.....
Cheers for your thoughts, Soz If it is a silly question to some!
Its a 95 gems 4.0L SE
Click to expand...

If your overheating was due to a slipped liner why not try and find somewhere that would re-liner your block or at least do an exchange. I don't mean a big, well advertised firm but a little one or two man operation. Your local racing boys or classic restorers would probably know one. Mine is on a farm in the middle of nowhere without even a sign on the door! Inside is a workshop cleaner than my local hospital with every piece of machinery needed to rework engines. I only found it when a bloke pulled up outside it revving his Chevy small block with a straight through exhaust - a glorious noise.
 
To give you an idea I cooked my engine 4.6 a few months back after returning from working abroad and it got hot blew top hose off when I took the heads off found a small crack in Rh rear pot liner had a crack abot 20 mm so started looking around for someone to put new liner in long story and loads of bollox later found a little machine shop in Poyle near heathrow they replaced the cracked liner (it hadnt slipped) skimmed both heads 12 thou off one 15 thou off the other pressure tested the lot for 500 quid inc everything I looked at replacing the block but it had only done 25k so repair was viable my advice for what it is worth is to get the heads off and find out whats wrong and take it from there
 
Also I am one of those people that believes liners only slip because of over heating you need to work out why it overheated in the first place - mine was because of a weep in the heater matrix uncommon but there you go
 
Thanks for the advice lads & ladettes, A cracked liner! I haven't heard of that before, To my mind If I could get a block with top hats for about £1000, and reuse the crankshaft, pistons etc I should be getting a relatively cheap fix, considering this car is 18 years old, I dont want to spend too much money, and atm cant afford much anyways. Plus then in the future I have a decent block to build from.
Cheers:5bseeya:
 
Depends how many miles it has done and as you are going to have it in bits think about crank regrind or at least make sure it is not oval same with everything else my case I was starting with a new engine I put in 25k miles ago so new everything was worth saving but you will need all new bearings but it is doable and not too expensive good luck
 
sandyt said:
found a little machine shop in Poyle near heathrow they replaced the cracked liner (it hadnt slipped) skimmed both heads 12 thou off one 15 thou off the other pressure tested the lot for 500 quid inc everything
Click to expand...

Good to know for when it happens to mine!
 
Once it is all in bits you can mic up the crank to see if it is within tolerances.
If if is OK then no need for a regrind. I would replace all the shells and O-ring seals though as a matter of course. Check everything carefully for damage particularly rods and pistons. Assuming the new liners will bring the bores back to std old pistons are OK with new piston rings.
 
A short egine will include the crank, pistons and timing gear? if you can afford it.

From previous post it seems you don't have the skills/knowledge to rebuild an engine on your own. Please correct me if I am wrong. You need someone to take over your project perhaps? Maybe someone on this forum could help?
 
think i'd go for the block and pistons. at least they'll be matched! and not a bad price really.

then stick an upgraded camshaft and rebuild it from there.

tempted to tell SWMBO that i want to build an engine now LOL
 
if you wanted to which you dont, youd need to send your old pistons with block so bores could be sized to them ,standard isnt one size ,pistons arew matched to bores or if you have pistons bores are matched to them
 
I folks, I following all thread regarding overheating and liners and so on. So far my car has 86,000 KM (53,000 Miles) and does not suffer from overheating. I heavily used the car on the High-way during the summer and nothing and I mot doing any off-road. Still the engine is leaking oil and this is taking care of while we speak.

I have to admit that this "overheating" and "liners" thingy is scarring me a little, so what is your experience from preventing both problems? Regularly Changing Oil, Cooling Fluid and so on but what else? (Sorry for this noob question)
 
SpacePig said:
I folks, I following all thread regarding overheating and liners and so on. So far my car has 86,000 KM (53,000 Miles) and does not suffer from overheating. I heavily used the car on the High-way during the summer and nothing and I mot doing any off-road. Still the engine is leaking oil and this is taking care of while we speak.

I have to admit that this "overheating" and "liners" thingy is scarring me a little, so what is your experience from preventing both problems? Regularly Changing Oil, Cooling Fluid and so on but what else? (Sorry for this noob question)
Click to expand...

The general consensus is slipped liners are caused by overheating so make sure your coolant system is tip top and any coolant loss issues are dealt with ASAP. These old girls aren't getting any younger so hoses and seals etc can and will have deteriorated over time and a small leak can turn into something far worse if not seen to. It also helps to keep a 4 leaf clover and leprechaun on you at all times just for luck.
 
martyc said:
The general consensus is slipped liners are caused by overheating so make sure your coolant system is tip top and any coolant loss issues are dealt with ASAP. These old girls aren't getting any younger so hoses and seals etc can and will have deteriorated over time and a small leak can turn into something far worse if not seen to. It also helps to keep a 4 leaf clover and leprechaun on you at all times just for luck.
Click to expand...

Thanks! I will take care of this little by little. We replaced the Water pump and viscous fan before the summer and will check the quality of the rad and other hoses.

Is there a good way to clean a rad by the way?
 
StuckAgainSteve said:
ACR do a bare top hat liner block for about a grand - I believe they were the first to do it and supply many of the other big boys who claim it's their work.

ACR - Land Rover Engines - Rover V8 Engines - Range Rover V8 Engines- Land Rover Cylinder Heads Electronic Automatic Gearbox Controller- top hat liners

took my block in to chesman motorsport in coventry first week of this year and got it back at end of the week, payed £800 in cash

ops it jumped the v8 block quew on the floor, some where acr blocks and rpi and them others lol so cash does make a difference

i did alot of digging about before i payed some one to do the work and it seams they do 90 % of the top hat lined blocks for everyone else

so there you go,,,,, they all take them to chesman motorsports then add there bit or in some cases alot on ! oh and the utter crap and bull**** that some of these experts tryed to tell me, made me think thank **** i do know what iam on about when it comes to rebuilds
Click to expand...
 
martyc said:
The general consensus is slipped liners are caused by overheating so make sure your coolant system is tip top and any coolant loss issues are dealt with ASAP. These old girls aren't getting any younger so hoses and seals etc can and will have deteriorated over time and a small leak can turn into something far worse if not seen to. It also helps to keep a 4 leaf clover and leprechaun on you at all times just for luck.
Click to expand...

heres one then,,,, got my rangy off a family friend whos always looked after it well landrover have !

came to me with a gen landrover brandnew replacement engine at 3500miles, new rad, thermostat, heater, o rings, new hoses.

no warning at all last xmas eve in very cold weather 11pm taking my daughter home 3 miles from home Overheated and slipped liner on number 6 , when i removed the liner there was a 3" crack in the block behind it !!! WHY ??? the only thing i think is that the block is of poor quality casting
 
mark 4x4 said:
heres one then,,,, got my rangy off a family friend whos always looked after it well landrover have !

came to me with a gen landrover brandnew replacement engine at 3500miles, new rad, thermostat, heater, o rings, new hoses.

no warning at all last xmas eve in very cold weather 11pm taking my daughter home 3 miles from home Overheated and slipped liner on number 6 , when i removed the liner there was a 3" crack in the block behind it !!! WHY ??? the only thing i think is that the block is of poor quality casting
Click to expand...
a there is 200 thou less aliminum in the bore wall than 3.5 as block was originally ,liner has 3-4 thou interferrence fit and often crack adjacent to stud hole ,some blocks were bored less cenral to ali bore than others ,cracking like that started with 3.9s ,some of the worst cracked from new some only when cooling system aged and became less efficient some through neglect
 
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