Air to Springs

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Springelec

Member
Posts
40
I'm new to this forum but, I've read loads of past discussion about air to spring conversion for a P38. At the risk of attracting the wrath of purists, I have suffered five EAS failures in only three years and 10K road miles. I'm not an 'off-roader' and EAS has become very weary and expensive. My P38 is currently on its bump stops (again) and can't be used until it's fixed (again) for ££££. It already has had all the air bags replaced but despite this R&M, it's failed again. At my wits end, I'm seriously investigating air to spring conversion because my other cars have been various Volvo estates and they never dropped their spring - damper suspension, not once in thirty years of ownership and over 350K miles between them. So EAS has got to go before I really lose patience and the dump the entire car, which is a Yr2000, 4.6L. Can anyone advise the best kit to buy for a road going, standard height conversion. I heard the Britpart and similar UK kits are sourced from the far east. Is there any merit importing a British Atlantic or Strutmaster from the States or is a UK kit, e.g., Terrafirma OK ??. Given a choice between reliability and comfort, reliability is always my first choice. Thanks
 
Firstly welcome :).

If you have replaced all the bags then its worth the last bit to sort it, you will then be good for a good while.

There is a great guide for diagnosing EAS problems on here.
It is 1 of the features that when you remove you will regret. Its not a to complicated system but needs upkeep.

A schraeder valve emegency kit is helpfull and available for not many beer tokens.

Do you have any, or acess to diagnostics?

When the system is maintained its reliable and more comfortable than springs.

Dont do it:).

J
 
I'm new to this forum but, I've read loads of past discussion about air to spring conversion for a P38. At the risk of attracting the wrath of purists, I have suffered five EAS failures in only three years and 10K road miles. I'm not an 'off-roader' and EAS has become very weary and expensive. My P38 is currently on its bump stops (again) and can't be used until it's fixed (again) for ££££. It already has had all the air bags replaced but despite this R&M, it's failed again. At my wits end, I'm seriously investigating air to spring conversion because my other cars have been various Volvo estates and they never dropped their spring - damper suspension, not once in thirty years of ownership and over 350K miles between them. So EAS has got to go before I really lose patience and the dump the entire car, which is a Yr2000, 4.6L. Can anyone advise the best kit to buy for a road going, standard height conversion. I heard the Britpart and similar UK kits are sourced from the far east. Is there any merit importing a British Atlantic or Strutmaster from the States or is a UK kit, e.g., Terrafirma OK ??. Given a choice between reliability and comfort, reliability is always my first choice. Thanks
Once properly sorted, the EAS is pretty reliable I have had little cause for concern in the last 14 years or so. Have you got any diagnostics? If so, what fault codes do you have? If no diagnostics, I suspect you are paying someone to fix the problem and they have not found the cause of the problem
It always pays to carry diagnostics in a P38 or any other JLR product. Reliability and Range Rover are terms that are mutually exclusive.
 
Reliability and Range Rover are terms that are mutually exclusive.

If its a car that is maintained then this is not the case IMO.
If the Previous owners dont maintain then yes.

But would agree I have had few EAS issues except leaky bags, height sensor and compressor issues on our P38/L322 all sorted all are (for me ) considered consumables and running costs TBH.

J
 
If its a car that is maintained then this is not the case IMO.
If the Previous owners dont maintain then yes.

But would agree I have had few EAS issues except leaky bags, height sensor and compressor issues on our P38/L322 all sorted all are (for me ) considered consumables and running costs TBH.

J
They are always at the bottom of the reliability surveys.
 
It always pays to carry diagnostics in a P38 or any other JLR product. Reliability and Range Rover are terms that are mutually exclusive.
Unless of course it's an early one, you know the one's that weren't stuffed full of 'lecktronics & (in certain cases) could be mistaken for a London cab at first glance or have a propensity for slipping V8 liners.

No offence guys ;)
 
I'm new to this forum but, I've read loads of past discussion about air to spring conversion for a P38. At the risk of attracting the wrath of purists, I have suffered five EAS failures in only three years and 10K road miles. I'm not an 'off-roader' and EAS has become very weary and expensive. My P38 is currently on its bump stops (again) and can't be used until it's fixed (again) for ££££. It already has had all the air bags replaced but despite this R&M, it's failed again. At my wits end, I'm seriously investigating air to spring conversion because my other cars have been various Volvo estates and they never dropped their spring - damper suspension, not once in thirty years of ownership and over 350K miles between them. So EAS has got to go before I really lose patience and the dump the entire car, which is a Yr2000, 4.6L. Can anyone advise the best kit to buy for a road going, standard height conversion. I heard the Britpart and similar UK kits are sourced from the far east. Is there any merit importing a British Atlantic or Strutmaster from the States or is a UK kit, e.g., Terrafirma OK ??. Given a choice between reliability and comfort, reliability is always my first choice. Thanks
Sadly the EAS can be a pita. And while a few claim they can be reliable, they are by far the very small minority....

Anything you do to fix them, they can still go wrong. In some ways the suspension is not that complex, but if you need to sort lots of bits, it is expensive.

As for coils, it really isn't such a bad thing. Most cars, even plenty of Land Rovers run coils even today. The only thing you really loose is the ability to change the ride height for access or if off road for extra clearance. The EAS on the p38 is pretty flawed conceptually anyway, as it is rock hard in the extended off road modes and super soft and saggy in the low down fast modes. 100% the wrong way round for both driving disciplines.

Going to coils will probably make it ride and handle better by and large and certainly take the wollow away that p38's have.

As for the conversion kits, tbh there isn't really much to them. The only key bit is the aluminium adapter for the lower spring seat, as p38 air bags clip in place. These adapters just let you run a Discovery 1/Defender lower spring seat. And that's it.

As for the springs, well as Rover never offered a coil p38, there are no factory rates. So the springs are generally just another Land Rover spring, that someone 'thinks' will be the correct length and spring rate. Once you know what part numbers are being used, you could easily look for alternative springs if you wanted to source elsewhere or go for a different spring rate.

Prices do seem to be crazy for the conversion kits these days though...

Worth shopping about or even seeing if you can buy just the adapters:
1739811253164.png


The only other bit you need that isn't generic Land Rover is the electronics to stop the warning light. Although it is just a few wires at the end of the day.

Everything else in this picture are bits from other vehicles. Disco 1 spring isolators, Disco 2 front spring isolators. Disoc1/Def lower spring seat and spring retainers. They are all cheap as chips to buy.

You can get a full set of quality springs from here: https://www.flatdoguk.com/p38-std/hd-1~460

Unless of course it's an early one, you know the one's that weren't stuffed full of 'lecktronics & (in certain cases) could be mistaken for a London cab at first glance or have a propensity for slipping V8 liners.

No offence guys ;)

What those London cabs with round headlights like a classic RR??
1739810682148.png

1739810737783.png
 
Put some Schrader valves on the lines and pump then up manually?
Check with insurance before you commit to any changes.
Don't forget the headlights don't have any self leveling, the eas is relied on for this
Yes insurance for mods. Shouldn't be an issue for the headlights, as that would have been for Type Approval. And won't be rechecked for anything you do with the vehicle. And if insured as a modification, all good. Older vehicles also don't have anyway to adjust the headlights apart from at the headlight itself. So no different to the headlights on an RRC or Defender.
 
Thanks for replying. I'll investigate the Schrader valve advice but, don't hold your breath. From my perspective, my EAS experience has made me very nervous about taking the car anywhere further than a few miles from home. In which case, what's the point of owning it. An EAS failure 70 miles away would be expensive. I'm time poor and I think about the time I would spend getting stuck, then back home, then arranging for collection or driving the car (again) on its bump stops etc, etc. I know members are against conventional springs but, they're simple to apply and compared to EAS, infinitely reliable. When I bought the car, the previous owner said it drained the battery. I traced this problem to the SatNav and disconnected it. The radio worked until it woke me at 2am at full volume and I could not turn it off until I removed it from the dash and pulled its rear connectors and power. I don't listen to the radio so, no loss. It has since developed a periodic clicking noise through the speakers, which I have yet to trace but, putting EAS aside for one moment, that's its only fault. If EAS wasn't a regular and periodic problem, I would be praising my 4.6L Vogue but, any car is a pile of junk if it's consistently unreliable and can't be used when the owner needs to use it. I intend to get EAS fixed again but, this time, I'll also follow the air to spring conversion route because I can't own an unreliable and temperamental car. Thanks to everyone who has shown an interest in my EAS woe.
 
Thanks for replying. I'll investigate the Schrader valve advice but, don't hold your breath. From my perspective, my EAS experience has made me very nervous about taking the car anywhere further than a few miles from home. In which case, what's the point of owning it. An EAS failure 70 miles away would be expensive. I'm time poor and I think about the time I would spend getting stuck, then back home, then arranging for collection or driving the car (again) on its bump stops etc, etc. I know members are against conventional springs but, they're simple to apply and compared to EAS, infinitely reliable. When I bought the car, the previous owner said it drained the battery. I traced this problem to the SatNav and disconnected it. The radio worked until it woke me at 2am at full volume and I could not turn it off until I removed it from the dash and pulled its rear connectors and power. I don't listen to the radio so, no loss. It has since developed a periodic clicking noise through the speakers, which I have yet to trace but, putting EAS aside for one moment, that's its only fault. If EAS wasn't a regular and periodic problem, I would be praising my 4.6L Vogue but, any car is a pile of junk if it's consistently unreliable and can't be used when the owner needs to use it. I intend to get EAS fixed again but, this time, I'll also follow the air to spring conversion route because I can't own an unreliable and temperamental car. Thanks to everyone who has shown an interest in my EAS woe.
You got damp carpet and underlay in the drivers footwell by any chance? The P38 is really a car for DIY, otherwise it will be a money pit.
 
The EAS is as cheap as chips to overhaul, the only expensive part is the air springs and he has those.
It can get pricey....

If you need new height sensors or have any wiring issues.

Also if you need to rebuild the valve block, not everyone will want to do this themselves. And some places may charge you an arm and a leg.
 
Only when it lashes down and only when parked on a camber slope. When parked on level ground, it does not leak so, I ensure it's always parked on level ground when available. Fuel consumption alone is a reason to describe the car as money pit. I get 19mpg no matter how carefully I drive. But this is a choice I'm happy to make because there are several benefits from driving around in a 4.6L P38. EAS is not one of them but, from my perspective, the realistic alternative that saves the car from the abyss is spring conversion therapy. The more time I spend with you and others discussing this option, the more I'm convinced this is the right route for me. When I was younger, I did all my own DIY. Now I'm a pensioner, I can still get around a car but, I'm less enthusiastic about crawling under a car, especially when it's wet and cold as it usually is in February. As I said earlier, I'll get EAS fixed again and consider my options. Thanks to all.
 
Thanks for replying. I'll investigate the Schrader valve advice but, don't hold your breath. From my perspective, my EAS experience has made me very nervous about taking the car anywhere further than a few miles from home.
Schrader valves are fine to prove the individual air bags are not leaking. All you do is unplug each air line to the individual airbag, which is pretty easy. Then attach the vale and use any air-compressor to inflate one at a time. If they stay inflated, then the bags and lines to them are fine.

The issue is, its all a bit of a faff. And you are doing one at a time. Unless you build a 4 into 1 adaptor. Doing this will also obviously stop you controlling the height from the drivers seat or the vehicle doing it automatically at different speeds. But can be a way to make the vehicle mobile. emergency and diagnostic use is best.

Doing this can cause other errors though. If you have a dodgy bit of wiring or the height sensors are knackered. Do you know what is the actual issue you are getting?

The EAS is a bit pants, that if something goes wrong, it defaults to sitting on the bump stops. In reality a much smarter decision would be to not let it do this.

If it is throwing a code, you might be worth investing in something to read and clear the codes. P38's can throw lots of errors, so something like a Nancom might well be a good investment anyway. There are also ones just for clearing the EAS codes, which can make it work again. Something handy to keep in the cubby box, should it happen when its out.

Codes are likely (not exclusive) to electrical sensor or wiring issues. The other kind of issue is a leak somewhere, that the system just can't keep the suspension pressurised. I have this on one of my p38's currently. I'm reasonably sure it is the seals in the valve block, but haven't yet got that far looking at it. Need some nicer warmer weather.

Also do remember, a coil conversion kit is NOT a one way mod. It can easily be undone should ever want to go back to EAS.
 
Mine doesn't hit the bump stops if and when I get a fault any more and I've no idea why?? The only thing that has changed is a repaired faulty driver pack but I don't this changed any default programs in any way. It goes Into dormant mode and presets to normal height 🤷
Crap.... That's blown it...
Many a time previously I've threatened the bus with springs but I do like the functionality of the eas tbf🤔
 
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