4x4 rescue

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redhand said:
But the response groups aren't first responders and were never set up to be first responders In fact they're usually last response. their role is to provide transport to the council/emergency services/nhs staff etc. to allow them to get to somewhere that a average vehicle couldn't get to. and that it. in effect it's a community transport scheme. Once they've been called out by plod/council etc then they may be asked to recover stuck vehicles etc but they should never be asked to indulge in firstaid or rescue wreck recovery etc.
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that's exactly what they SHOULD be doing - but, especially now during spate conditions, they feel the need to self deploy and often are at incidents before any of the other official services arrive and rather than doing something sensible like vehicle stabilization they feel the need to attempt tasks well beyond their scope of deployment

community first responders (medical) are being more used to provide interim support until a paramedic or ambulance arrives - out where we are a Cat A call which is a infant/child at risk or imminent life risk (cardiac issues etc) requires the service to be on scene within 8 minutes - by the very nature of their organization the community responders are very local and will be on scene within minutes - that leaves a potentially VERY ill person in the hands of someone potentially who will have had very little training for 5-6 minutes, a lot of harm can be done during even such a short time

I'm not knocking people who do volunteer but they should be made aware of their limits, before their being helpful kills someone

did i read it right somewhere in this thread that one of the requirements for membership of one of these response groups is that they attend ONE group exercise PER YEAR
 
One of these self appointed deputies is gonna hurt them selves or someone else.
It should be made crystal clear their for transport duties only but like your man said that's probably not glamorous enough to attract these people.
 
kernowdragon said:
I thought the role of community first responders was to hold De-fib equipment and administer treatment to heart attack victims, although they may have other first aid/medical training it's not a pre-requisit for the role.
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CFR training is generally a BTEC level 2 qualification that takes about 40 hours to attain - the sooner the NHS makes it a lega requirement that responders HAVE to have passed that qualification the better

all recent defib equipment is designed to be used by absolutely anyone, open the lid and it talks you through what to do - that's why you are seeing so many attached to walls in public places such as shops and leisure centers (cos we all know exercise is bad for your health)
 
happydog77 said:
our group is called, if ya check the web site www.cotag.net you will see that we have a slightly different approach to other groups.

and the main thing is helping the community in times of need.
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See this is what I'm saying,it's clear and simple, does what it says on the tin.

I'm old school community spirited and do help the old and vunerable.

What I dislike is some of the other groups who obviously want to be knights in hi viz.

I've said before I'd be prepared to join a scheme, providing the equipment and insurance is correct.
Excluding cotag I've just looked at that is quite clear on what they do from the start -others seem to sell themselves as emergency service and have none or very little detail explaining they have no legal remit other than as community volunteers
 
fanatic said:
See this is what I'm saying,it's clear and simple, does what it says on the tin.

I'm old school community spirited and do help the old and vunerable.

What I dislike is some of the other groups who obviously want to be knights in hi viz.

I've said before I'd be prepared to join a scheme, providing the equipment and insurance is correct.
Excluding cotag I've just looked at that is quite clear on what they do from the start -others seem to sell themselves as emergency service and have none or very little detail explaining they have no legal remit other than as community volunteers
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cheers fanatic, it has been 5 years in the making and took 3years to become operational, although thats only a year ive been involved, its a big difference to the group that was mentioned in an earlier post who train once a year :eek:
 
iannotts said:
Thats a bloody frightening read :eek: why the fook didnt they leave it to the pro's like yourself in both instences.
ffs dragging a car on its roof with someone who is complaining of neck pain they must have been numpty.

also bleeding from ears and quiet that sounds VERY major to me:eek:
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if it was down to me i''d have had a few people prosecuted for attempted manslaughter,a bit of very public bad publicity for these response groups mights have made the general public more aware of the fact that not everyone wearing a hi viz or driving a vehicle with flashing lights is actually competent

think a small part of the problem is the British nature of not to challenge anyone who looks official and who appears to be doing an important task - someone here said it's just common sense
 
happydog77 said:
its a big difference to the group that was mentioned in an earlier post who train once a year :eek:
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to be fair that's a slight misquote

i believe they said part of the requirement for membership is that you attend a group training event once a year

i bet they are all very well prepared :)
 
Sean said:
to be fair that's a slight misquote

i believe they said part of the requirement for membership is that you attend a group training event once a year

i bet they are all very well prepared :)
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i stand corrected, tbh i had just scanned through a few posts as was tryin to catch up.

and its good everyone is doin there bit in this weather be it on there own or as part of a recognised group.
 
happydog77 said:
and its good everyone is doin there bit in this weather be it on there own or as part of a recognised group.
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And that is it isn't, it doesn't matter about the motivation as long as those of us who can, help out (within our capabilities) in any way we can, then perhaps people will think twice next time they moan about gas guzzling 4x4s.

There again probably not but we can still get that smug satisfaction that they needed us.
 
Skynet said:
Exactly, NOONE should go beyond their TRAINING :doh:
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ah but they often do, maybe they should have training sessions where they get taught what they CANT do

was it you that mentioned there being a requirement to attend at least 1 training session a year ?
 
Sean said:
that's exactly what they SHOULD be doing - but, especially now during spate conditions, they feel the need to self deploy and often are at incidents before any of the other official services arrive and rather than doing something sensible like vehicle stabilization they feel the need to attempt tasks well beyond their scope of deployment

community first responders (medical) are being more used to provide interim support until a paramedic or ambulance arrives - out where we are a Cat A call which is a infant/child at risk or imminent life risk (cardiac issues etc) requires the service to be on scene within 8 minutes - by the very nature of their organization the community responders are very local and will be on scene within minutes - that leaves a potentially VERY ill person in the hands of someone potentially who will have had very little training for 5-6 minutes, a lot of harm can be done during even such a short time

I'm not knocking people who do volunteer but they should be made aware of their limits, before their being helpful kills someone

did i read it right somewhere in this thread that one of the requirements for membership of one of these response groups is that they attend ONE group exercise PER YEAR
Click to expand...


WHAT???

We DO NOT self deploy!

The duty controller is called by the relevant service Silver Controller. Duty controller deploys the appropriate vehicle and driver!

If the driver feels it is beyond their training or competence they MUST NOT continue.

As was said before, dont usse the bad examples... which you can find everywhere, even professionals..... to paint us with the same tar brush! :mad:
 
When I did recoveries we were expressly told not to move anyone and to keep them warm and talking-unless they were going to die in a fire, in which case paralysing them better than death.

Community assistance I have no problem with,recovering a vehicle with injured person in or moving them ffs-trained paramedic and or fire brigade only.
gun ho attitudes risks both the injured person and getting sued.

If I've offended people then I'm sorry, but if you exceed your remit which is community volunteer-you'll end up in a whole load of **** even with the best intentions. Further to this you risk your own and others safety.
 
Sean said:
ah but they often do, maybe they should have training sessions where they get taught what they CANT do

was it you that mentioned there being a requirement to attend at least 1 training session a year ?
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Not me, I'm just miffed at people assuming the worst and sounding off at some of us trying to help out.

I am a First Responder with St John, and I have had further training with them under GWAS. But even I wouldnt be so stupid as to move a car seat in a wreck with ?spinal injury

Its that bloody tar brush again...... you know, the one that the public use on all 4x4 owners!
 
Skynet said:
WHAT???

We DO NOT self deploy!

The duty controller is called by the relevant service Silver Controller. Duty controller deploys the appropriate vehicle and driver!

If the driver feels it is beyond their training or competence they MUST NOT continue.

As was said before, dont usse the bad examples... which you can find everywhere, even professionals..... to paint us with the same tar brush! :mad:
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i never said that your mob self deploy, you may well have some competent people working in your group but i am yet to be convinced by either what i have seen out in the real world or have read here that these groups are competent enough to carry out anything much more taxing than a rugidized taxi facility - i really would like to be shown or to see some evidence to the contrary

any team is only ever as strong as it's weakest member
 
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