200tdi stalling issue

@Hicap phill
@lynall
@tottot
I have some specific questions with regards to the timing if you don't mind.
The following photos are with the flywheel pinned and pulley at TDC.
1. How far should the pin go into the injection pump? See photos.
2. Other pictures I have seen the pin should be at the top left of timing case hole, ours pin goes lower right of the hole. Is this correct?
3. I am under the impression the 2 little holes should be central to the slotted holes in the timing plate.
Thanks for the help, sorry about what may be stupid questions.

Pretty sure that is the wrong hole, I think it is at the top ie 12 oclock, it is a round hole in the alloy casing of the injection pump.

I am not sure if I have any pics, but will take a look.

Random pic borrowed from the web, ignore the arrow.

lynall said:

Pretty sure that is the wrong hole, I think it is at the top ie 12 oclock, it is a round hole in the alloy casing of the injection pump.

I am not sure if I have any pics, but will take a look.

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Thank you lynall. That is pretty much what I thought.
So, the injection pump timing/pulley seems to be 180° out of position compared to the alignment of the crank pulley and flywheel, is that possible somehow?
I put some photos in my previous post ^

Anaconda said:

Thank you lynall. That is pretty much what I thought.
So, the injection pump timing/pulley seems to be 180° out of position compared to the alignment of the crank pulley and flywheel, is that possible somehow?
I put some photos in my previous post ^

Click to expand...

Rotate inj pump until proper timing hole lines up, then check the crank flywheel slot is visible, if no go rotate crank 360 and try again, obviously using the crank bolt to rotate engine and not the inj pump nut, sorry if teaching you to suck eggs!

I have never done it, but I have been told it is possible to time an engine 180 degrees out and it can run, not very well but it can run.

lynall said:

Rotate inj pump until proper timing hole lines up, then check the crank flywheel slot is visible, if no go rotate crank 360 and try again, obviously using the crank bolt to rotate engine and not the inj pump nut, sorry if teaching you to suck eggs!

I have never done it, but I have been told it is possible to time an engine 180 degrees out and it can run, not very well but it can run.

Click to expand...

Ok, will give it a go tomorrow if its not raining, many thanks.

lynall said:

Rotate inj pump until proper timing hole lines up, then check the crank flywheel slot is visible, if no go rotate crank 360 and try again, obviously using the crank bolt to rotate engine and not the inj pump nut, sorry if teaching you to suck eggs!

I have never done it, but I have been told it is possible to time an engine 180 degrees out and it can run, not very well but it can run.

Click to expand...

Thanks ever so much Lynall, I did indeed need to rotate the engine a complete revolution for the timing pin to line up.
My mistake, atleast that's one less thing to think about.
Fitted the new cut off solenoid, haven't started the engine yet to test it.
Ordered a lift pump and enough pipe to change all the fuel lines, hopefully something out of that lot will sort it out.

As an update it's not the stop solenoid or wiring, not the fuel filter, not the lift pump, not the leak off pipes. Haven't changed the pipes to and from the tank but highly doubt it's the problem.
If we are convinced it's a fuel problem that only leaves injectors or injection pump.
Would it be a good idea to up the idle speed a bit and see if that improves the issue? although it ticks over lovely when you start it.

Anaconda said:

As an update it's not the stop solenoid or wiring, not the fuel filter, not the lift pump, not the leak off pipes. Haven't changed the pipes to and from the tank but highly doubt it's the problem.
If we are convinced it's a fuel problem that only leaves injectors or injection pump.
Would it be a good idea to up the idle speed a bit and see if that improves the issue? although it ticks over lovely when you start it.

Click to expand...

Has the inj pump been messed with?
I ask as the only time I have seen a near stall when pedal released was when I backed my fuel screw off a knatts cock to much.
Cannot hurt to tweak the idle screw a little.

Is it a 200 or 300 injection pump?
200 is bare bones basci pump, 300 got more techy and one of the gadgets was a cold start thing located engine side of the inj pump, basically an extra lever with a couple of springs, how it wokred I have no idea!

Just had a thought, have you checked the valve clearances?

lynall said:

Has the inj pump been messed with?
I ask as the only time I have seen a near stall when pedal released was when I backed my fuel screw off a knatts cock to much.
Cannot hurt to tweak the idle screw a little.

Is it a 200 or 300 injection pump?
200 is bare bones basci pump, 300 got more techy and one of the gadgets was a cold start thing located engine side of the inj pump, basically an extra lever with a couple of springs, how it wokred I have no idea!

Click to expand...

As far as I am aware the injection pump is stock, we certainly haven't done anything to it in the 9 years my son has owned it. Except the big O-ring which we did about 8 years ago.
Also I do believe it's a standard 200tdi pump, although I wouldn't know otherwise.

lynall said:

Just had a thought, have you checked the valve clearances?

Click to expand...

Not recently although I did do them at the beginning of the year. Worthwhile checking them do you think?

They can stall with a bit of crap wedged into the pick up pipe out the tank. But also feels like there is a restriction/lack of fuel. Ours was like a match size so let a bit of fuel past but could not hold full revs.

Yep check valves. It’s 1 less thing it can be & rule it out

Hicap phill said:

They can stall with a bit of crap wedged into the pick up pipe out the tank. But also feels like there is a restriction/lack of fuel. Ours was like a match size so let a bit of fuel past but could not hold full revs.

Yep check valves. It’s 1 less thing it can be & rule it out

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Ok, valves and fuel pipe from tank tomorrow.
Incidentally I had the pick up pipe out of the tank and it's clear.

Anaconda said:

Ok, valves and fuel pipe from tank tomorrow.
Incidentally I had the pick up pipe out of the tank and it's clear.

Click to expand...

Have you an air line? Blow back to tank from filter

Hicap phill said:

Have you an air line? Blow back to tank from filter

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I have some new pipe, easy enough to change it.

Changed the fuel pipes, checked the valve gaps, run it without fuel cap, run it with the inlet pipe disconnected and none of it makes any difference, it still wants to stall when you let off the throttle. The problem can be replicated while stationary by operating the pump end of the throttle cable.
I have upped the idle speed which seems to have helped but yet to road test it, no one here to help if I break down!
I know it's hard to tell but is this idle speed to fast?

lynall said:

Has the inj pump been messed with?
I ask as the only time I have seen a near stall when pedal released was when I backed my fuel screw off a knatts cock to much.
Cannot hurt to tweak the idle screw a little.

Is it a 200 or 300 injection pump?
200 is bare bones basci pump, 300 got more techy and one of the gadgets was a cold start thing located engine side of the inj pump, basically an extra lever with a couple of springs, how it wokred I have no idea!

Click to expand...

Had a look today and the fuel screw still has the tamper proof seal thingy on it so looks like it's a stock pump.

Have you changed the throttle cable, might be frayed and catching internally ?

When you get another pair of hands ask them to operate the throttle without the engine running to see if the mechanics of the linkage behave themselves, especially at the pump end

Dragonwalker said:

Have you changed the throttle cable, might be frayed and catching internally ?

When you get another pair of hands ask them to operate the throttle without the engine running to see if the mechanics of the linkage behave themselves, especially at the pump end

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If only, then I would be happy. I could remove the cable completely and operate the lever and it would still happen.