19j air in fuel.

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Cranking and quite a bit of fuel comes out, not as much as I expected, hand priming very little comes out, With the engine running at idle and the bleed cracked on the filter it just seeps out, I'm now wondering if its a pressure thing, the pump isnt effective enough at idle and start up.

Ive just been all over it, fuel lines all checked, replaced one that looked dodgy, cleaned the gauze in the regulator in the injector pump, checked the tank, so now I need to explore other options, intake leak (it would need to be pretty bad), lift pump still suspect, injector timing, poor compression.
 
I just had a thought, my new engine is a older type 19j, my old one was more recent, Im not sure the pumps are compatible, the pump I have is a Delphi unit ETC7869 , late 19j/200tdi.
IMG_1747.JPG
o

I have a conversion kit, I might give that a go!
 
nobber said:
I just had a thought, my new engine is a older type 19j, my old one was more recent, Im not sure the pumps are compatible, the pump I have is a Delphi unit ETC7869 , late 19j/200tdi.
IMG_1747.JPG
o

I have a conversion kit, I might give that a go!
Click to expand...
pumps are compatible but later has longer operating lever so needs the plastic spacer if fitted to earlier engine,earlier engines have a flat steel plate pump bolts to later like tdi an aluminum plate with a raised boss pump bolts to
 
It wasn't that, I pulled the pump off and both boss's were the same, pump lever arm was contacting the cam on the turned up bit where it was supposed to. The pump is working normally and holding pressure. Next stop is pump timing, Im letting the engine cool and I will adjust the timing to see if that helps, looking at the pump it has taken a knock at some point in its life, one of the outer injector feed pipes was askew on the pump end indicating that its had pressure put on it, its not leaking but its not straight, it seems to be on a banjo so shouldn't have damaged anything. The engine was sat on its side on a pallet when I collected it, and I remember oil coming out where the lift pump should have been so it was sat on the injector pump side.
 
That was miles out, a good 5 degrees or very close! Its definitely helped with the smoke, its not right yet but its close. Yet to test drive it and the engine was warm when I set it so I will allow it to cool and check again. How a pump can go out like that I dont know, apparently its a fairly new pump too, unless the timing belt is knackered but even so it wouldn't have stretched by that much.. I will see what its doing from cold.
 
That was miles out, a good 5 degrees or very close! Its definitely helped with the smoke, its not right yet but its close. Yet to test drive it and the engine was warm when I set it so I will allow it to cool and check again. How a pump can go out like that I dont know, apparently its a fairly new pump too, unless the timing belt is knackered but even so it wouldn't have stretched by that much.. I will see what its doing from cold.
 
nobber said:
That was miles out, a good 5 degrees or very close! Its definitely helped with the smoke, its not right yet but its close. Yet to test drive it and the engine was warm when I set it so I will allow it to cool and check again. How a pump can go out like that I dont know, apparently its a fairly new pump too, unless the timing belt is knackered but even so it wouldn't have stretched by that much.. I will see what its doing from cold.
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Probably fitted wrong originally. Or somebody has attempted to change the timing without using the pins, in an attempt to improve performance.It doesn't.
 
I just ran it up again, so far so good, except I now have diesel streaming out of an injector socket! One of the nozzles mustn't have sealed properly, no washers left, will be Wednesday before I get some more. It is the 13th today , so that figures. Im still dubious as to why the domed washers were not crushed by the original injectors, the only thing that can be is the seats have been cut.
 
I just ran it up again, so far so good, except I now have diesel streaming out of an injector socket! One of the nozzles mustn't have sealed properly, no washers left, will be Wednesday before I get some more. It is the 13th today , so that figures. I'm still dubious as to why the domed washers were not crushed by the original injectors, the only thing that can be is the seats have been cut.
 
nobber said:
I just ran it up again, so far so good, except I now have diesel streaming out of an injector socket! One of the nozzles mustn't have sealed properly, no washers left, will be Wednesday before I get some more. It is the 13th today , so that figures. I'm still dubious as to why the domed washers were not crushed by the original injectors, the only thing that can be is the seats have been cut.
Click to expand...

Were there any copper washers embedded in the carbon? If there are 2 copper washers, the steel ones never get crushed.
Nothing to do with the date. But most of these old motors have been horribly bodged by previous owners who don't know how to look after them, so it will take you a while to go through it, and sort out all the problems.
Just relax and take your time, you will get there in the end.
 
Turboman said:
Were there any copper washers embedded in the carbon? If there are 2 copper washers, the steel ones never get crushed.
Nothing to do with the date. But most of these old motors have been horribly bodged by previous owners who don't know how to look after them, so it will take you a while to go through it, and sort out all the problems.
Just relax and take your time, you will get there in the end.
Click to expand...

There was no carbon, strangely enough , and only one copper washer, only one injector had signs of breeching the domed washer, so thinking about it they must have been sealing but only just. The tips of the injectors looked blue so as James pointed out they must have gotten hot.
 
So, all buttoned up, starts first time, isles lovely, no smoke. Until I drive it, smokes like hell. It won't smoke if I rev it up while stationary, so only under load, turbo seals?
 
Nope, white/grey smoke, there is a little puff of black when loaded and being driven but not excessive. The injector pump was a good 5 degrees out, looking from the front of the engine it turned anticlockwise to clear the white smoke while idling, could it be Ive turned it slightly too much? The blue intake pipe had some oil residue in it but I wouldn't call it excessive on one of these engines. There is soot on the back of the compressor but not excessive. Valve clearance? I did set it up but will check again, I set the idle a little high ontop of the pump by the return pipe but I dont think that effects fueling?
 
Nope, white/grey smoke, there is a little puff of black when loaded and being driven but not excessive. The injector pump was a good 5 degrees out, looking from the front of the engine it turned anticlockwise to clear the white smoke while idling, could it be Ive turned it slightly too much? The blue intake pipe had some oil residue in it but I wouldn't call it excessive on one of these engines. There is soot on the back of the compressor but not excessive. Valve clearance? I did set it up but will check again, I set the idle a little high ontop of the pump by the return pipe but I dont think that effects fueling?
 
nobber said:
Nope, white/grey smoke, there is a little puff of black when loaded and being driven but not excessive. The injector pump was a good 5 degrees out, looking from the front of the engine it turned anticlockwise to clear the white smoke while idling, could it be Ive turned it slightly too much? The blue intake pipe had some oil residue in it but I wouldn't call it excessive on one of these engines. There is soot on the back of the compressor but not excessive. Valve clearance? I did set it up but will check again, I set the idle a little high ontop of the pump by the return pipe but I dont think that effects fueling?
Click to expand...

Unless there is a lot of oil or fuel ending up in the intake pipe and manifold, I would be tempted to just run it around for a few days, see if it settles down.
You said earlier in the thread that the engine had been sat on it's side at some time, so there is probably oil all over the place inside the engine.
See what happens once it has all had a chance to heat through, cool, and settle down a few times.
 
I'll check the valve clearance again and see if that changes anything, there isnt anywhere oil can go that would cause it to smoke like that, it cant get into the fuel or combustion chambers, it certainly cant get into the intake unless something is bust. I reckon its ran 50 or 60 miles since putting the engine in, oil could seep past the rings but that would have cleared by now. I reckon its still got fuelling problems, If the valves are Ok I will turn the pump back a tad and see if that helps. I dont like running engines if there is a potential problem with them.
 
I'll check the valve clearance again and see if that changes anything, there isnt anywhere oil can go that would cause it to smoke like that, it cant get into the fuel or combustion chambers, it certainly cant get into the intake unless something is bust. I reckon its ran 50 or 60 miles since putting the engine in, oil could seep past the rings but that would have cleared by now. I reckon its still got fuelling problems, If the valves are Ok I will turn the pump back a tad and see if that helps. I dont like running engines if there is a potential problem with them.
 
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