12. Other requirements–

  • Where two rear fog lamps are fitted to a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 or to a trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985 they shall form a matched pair.
  • 2. In the case of a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured on or after 1st October 1979, not more than two may be fitted and the requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are all those specified in this Schedule.
Pretty sure this says 2 are fine twice here?

I also agree that where one is fitted it does state position regs.




PART IIRequirements relating to optional rear fog lamps
1. In the case of a motor vehicle first used before 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured before 1st October 1979, any number may be fitted and the only requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are those specified in paragraphs 2(d), 7 and 10 of Part I.

Yep fair enough on that one mate.
 
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The legislation stated here .


States this. which is different to what you say @wammers.

On the centre-line or off side of the vehicle

Regarding the foglamp on the centreline of the vehicle.

Cheers

Where does it say differently than what i said?. What do you not understand about rear centre line to offside. It means the single fog lamp MUST be fitted on the rear of the vehicle, anywhere from the centre of the vehicle to the right hand side of the rear. It CANNOT be fitted from the rear centre line towards the nearside of the vehicle. We are talking a P38 here not a 1950s series 1.
 
@wammers you wrote this

After that only one is fitted and MUST be fitted to the O/S of the vehicle centre line.

The stds state

On the centre-line or off side of the vehicle

Do you not see the difference???

If not then do not worry about .

Cheers
 
12. Other requirements–

  • Where two rear fog lamps are fitted to a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 or to a trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985 they shall form a matched pair.
  • 2. In the case of a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured on or after 1st October 1979, not more than two may be fitted and the requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are all those specified in this Schedule.
Pretty sure this says 2 are fine twice here?

I also agree that where one is fitted it does state position regs.




PART IIRequirements relating to optional rear fog lamps
1. In the case of a motor vehicle first used before 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured before 1st October 1979, any number may be fitted and the only requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are those specified in paragraphs 2(d), 7 and 10 of Part I.

Yep fair enough on that one mate.

You finally found the word BEFORE then. Read the 1989 regulations, things changed. Only one is fitted and MUST be fitted as those regulations describe. 1979, 1980, 1985 and 1986 statements do not apply to YOUR car because the regulations changed in 1989. If you have a rear fog lamp fitted other than in accordance with the 1989 regulations it is a MOT fail. Any fog lamp fitted as described earlier reference LHD and RHD vehicles should be disabled to meet the UK regulations as stated.
 
@wammers you wrote this

After that only one is fitted and MUST be fitted to the O/S of the vehicle centre line.

The stds state

On the centre-line or off side of the vehicle

Do you not see the difference???

If not then do not worry about .

Cheers

A fog lamp can be fitted ANYWHERE from the centre line of the rear to the offside corner. You know what was meant stop being an arse.
 
Right. Am I reading something different to you because I'm looking right at this and it seems to agree with what I said?? I feel like I'm going mad. Is there another page I should be looking at? It says 1989 at the top of the page so is this not the 1989 schedule.

SCHEDULE 11


PART I Requirements relating to obligatory rear fog lamps and to optional rear fog lamps to the extent specified in part ii
1. Number:

One (one is required by law. agreed?)
2. Position–

(a) Longitudinal:

At or near the rear of the vehicle
(b) Lateral–

(i)Where one rear fog lamp is fitted:

On the centre-line or off side of the vehicle (disregarding any sidecar forming part of a motor bicycle combination) (Position of one lamp agreed?)
(ii)Where two lamps are fitted: (mine has 2 fitted agreed? Not required but not illegal either?)

No requirement
(c) Vertical–

(i)Maximum height above the ground–

(A)Any vehicle not covered by sub-paragraph (B):

1000 mm
(B)An agricultural vehicle, engineering plant and a motor tractor:

2100 mm
(ii)Minimum height above the ground:

250 mm
(d) Minimum separation distance between a rear fog lamp and a stop lamp–

(i)In the case of a rear fog lamp which does not share a common lamp body with a stop lamp:

A distance of 100 mm between the light-emitting surfaces of the lamps when viewed in a direction parallel to the longitudinal axis of the vehicle
(ii)In the case of a rear fog lamp which shares a common lamp body with a stop lamp:

100 mm
3. Angles of visibility–

(a) Horizontal:

25° inwards and outwards. However, where two rear fog lamps are fitted it shall suffice if throughout the sector so defined at least one lamp (but not necessarily the same lamp) is visible
(b) Vertical:

5° above and below the horizontal
4. Alignment:

To the rear
5. Markings:

An approval mark
6. Size of illuminated area:

No requirement
7. Colour:

Red
8. Wattage:

No requirement
9. Intensity:

No requirement
10. Electrical connections:

No rear fog lamp shall be fitted to any vehicle so that it can be illuminated by the application of any braking system on the vehicle
11. Tell-tale:

A circuit-closed tell-tale shall be fitted
12. Other requirements–

  • Where two rear fog lamps are fitted to a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 or to a trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985 they shall form a matched pair. (Again mentioning 2 after 1986 but this is void you say even though this seems to be in the main body of text because my vehicle is 1995?)
13. Definitions–

  • In this Schedule “approval mark” means either–

    (a)
    a marking designated as an approval mark by regulation 5 of the Designation of Approval Marks Regulations and shown at item 20 of Schedule 4 to those Regulations; or

    (b)
    a marking designated as an approval mark by regulation 4 of the Designation of Approval Marks Regulations and shown at item 38 of Schedule 2 to those Regulations.

PART IIRequirements relating to optional rear fog lamps
1. In the case of a motor vehicle first used before 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured before 1st October 1979, any number may be fitted and the only requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are those specified in paragraphs 2(d), 7 and 10 of Part I. (So this is void correct? )

2. In the case of a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1980 and any other vehicle manufactured on or after 1st October 1979, not more than two may be fitted and the requirements prescribed by these Regulations in respect of any which are fitted are all those specified in this Schedule. (And this too?)
 
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MOT test. If on a vehicle made after 1980 the rear fog lamp is not fitted in accordance with lighting regulations, IE: to the off side of the vehicle from the centre line to offside rear corner it is a fail. The regulations are to be fair contradictory in some respects and in other respects ambiguous.
 
MOT test. If on a vehicle made after 1980 the rear fog lamp is not fitted in accordance with lighting regulations, IE: to the off side of the vehicle from the centre line to offside rear corner it is a fail. The regulations are to be fair contradictory in some respects and in other respects ambiguous.
that only applies if you only have one fog lamp. You can still have two if you wish.
 
Sorry guys. I wasn't trying to create an argument. Just trying to get some clarity.

No problem, your lamps look ok i suppose, not something i would do. But each to their own. Arguments are good they help to pass the time. ;)
 
I don't really like them either mate. I want to mod the light so it illuminates inbetween the fog and reverse. I was just getting the wiring done ready.
 
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Wow , that one grew legs and really took off.
Today, I took the Golden Girl for a run and for reasons known only to her she decided that me putting fuel in her was an affront, so she decided to throw up an air suspension inactive message.
Sorted her out, drove a few more miles, parked up and she had another strop. Obviously the car park wasn't to her taste, so she threw up the air suspension inactive again. Told her to have a quiet word with herself, and walked away. Came back a while later, all good. Drove home with no strops.
I bet she makes me pay for it tomorrow :oops:
 
The legislation stated here .
States this. which is different to what you say @wammers.
On the centre-line or off side of the vehicle
Regarding the foglamp on the centreline of the vehicle.
Cheers

Ah. Split into 2 parts: optional and required. From 1986 required and can have 2 equally spaced. Before 1986 they were optional and there was a split at 1980 for some reason with as many as you like before and only one after (if optional).
 
Ah. Split into 2 parts: optional and required. From 1986 required and can have 2 equally spaced. Before 1986 they were optional and there was a split at 1980 for some reason with as many as you like before and only one after (if optional).


The point was wammers was not exactly stating it correctly, which is why he decided to start calling me names ....LOL
 

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