steve2286w
Well-Known Member
when you put the crank wheel dot set to arrow does the dot on cam wheel match up with arrow
2 turns crank = 1 turn on cam
You have estimated the EP using pushrods but you should check with your dti on the rocker to see if the dots line up , then onto pump
2 turns crank = 1 turn on cam
You have estimated the EP using pushrods but you should check with your dti on the rocker to see if the dots line up , then onto pump
109Santana
Member
If I line up dots on crank and camshaft and put the belt on and the rockers there's all sorts of obstruction of valves and pistons...it is impossible to set clearances so this method is obviously not correct.
The only way I can get the tappets anywhere near where they were before is using one of the lines scored/machines into the cam pulley (not the dot) and crank at TDC.
The engine turns easily with resistance at compression strokes and all the tappets set well and no obstruction.
I have just noticed, after using the above method, that .......when turning the engine over (by hand) and looking at number 1 valve - when it is fully open....pushrod at max height (dti checked on valve) the dot on crank is close to the arrow (maybe 1 tooth out) and the dot on the camshaft pulley also lines up with the arrow (or damn close) .
This seems to be completely by accident, so can I assume that it has all fallen into place??
Should I adjust the belt to line up both dots??
The pump was 'calibrated' correctly using the special tool and the manual. I have lined the pump dot with the arrow.
With all this done I am assuming that the only way I will know if this is all correct is to try it
steve2286w
Well-Known Member
Your first two paragraphs in last post contradict each other ?
1. When dots on crank and cam line up valves foul pistons
2. Crank and can dots nearly line up and no problem
So yes use the dots or valve max opening EP and crank dot adjust belt with pump as well and that should be it so give it a go and good luck , ensure fuel bleed proper and heater plugs used
1. When dots on crank and cam line up valves foul pistons
2. Crank and can dots nearly line up and no problem
So yes use the dots or valve max opening EP and crank dot adjust belt with pump as well and that should be it so give it a go and good luck , ensure fuel bleed proper and heater plugs used
Ok Guys.
Now I don’t know the engine. But it’s an engine and they all time up the same way.
Forget the marks.
The pump is locked in what position?
You know TDC +/- .
You know Cam TDC position.
If the pump is locked on EP then that again is easy to find.
If you are a tooth out on the belt for TDC then do it accurately. Highest point “mark it” starts to lower “mark it” split the marks and “mark it”
All these marks can be found, you have, but you keep coming back and relying on the marks already in place.
I have read all this and find it hard to understand how/why you are having problems, except you keep coming back to the marks already in place.
Cos I am really
.
J
Now I don’t know the engine. But it’s an engine and they all time up the same way.
Forget the marks.
The pump is locked in what position?
You know TDC +/- .
You know Cam TDC position.
If the pump is locked on EP then that again is easy to find.
If you are a tooth out on the belt for TDC then do it accurately. Highest point “mark it” starts to lower “mark it” split the marks and “mark it”
All these marks can be found, you have, but you keep coming back and relying on the marks already in place.
I have read all this and find it hard to understand how/why you are having problems, except you keep coming back to the marks already in place.
Cos I am really
.J
109Santana
Member
Hi again,
Yes I realise that it didn't read right!!!
When I did it by the book and lined up the dots I did get fouling...don't know why. When I did it by ignoring the marks and settin everything from pistons halfway I did manage to get the tappets set.....then when I turned the engine the dots lined up!?! Pure fluke I think.
I'm going to put everything together, injectors and heater plugs, etc and give it a go.
Watch this space
109Santana
Member
Ok guys.....
I have put everything together.....
New heater plugs.
New injectors.
Fuel distributor pump set up as per the manual with special tool (this wasn't removed or messed with and was set as before).
Ok guys.....
I have put everything back together.....
New head gasket.
New heater plugs.
New injectors.
Fuel distribution pump checked as per manual with special tool.
New timing belt.
All lined up with 3 dots on 3 arrows....
Tappets all set and engine rotates easily.
So... I gave it a go ..... using a clean fuel container direct to pump and electric supply direct to heater plugs and fuel solenoid, so, should be no gremlins there.
Perfect fuel spray from injectors (tested before fitting).
So, cranked over a few times without fuel just to get oik circulating...no worries there, oil pump working fine.
Bled the system...plenty of fuel so tried starting.....yep...you've guessed it....it will not start.
Checked timing and nothing has moved.
I removed inlet and exhaust manifolds to see if I getting anything out and I getting a little bit of smoke but that's it.
It turns over as I'd expect but just will not fire- tried heater plugs on for 30 seconds and, with no heater plugs and it made no difference. Checked fuel still pumping and all good.
I just don't know any more.
Any help welcome.
109Santana
Member
Yep keep coming back to it cos that's the only way the book says...I am not a mechanic but I think I have got it timed right according to everything I read and the little bit I do know.Ok Guys.
Now I don’t know the engine. But it’s an engine and they all time up the same way.
Forget the marks.
The pump is locked in what position?
You know TDC +/- .
You know Cam TDC position.
If the pump is locked on EP then that again is easy to find.
If you are a tooth out on the belt for TDC then do it accurately. Highest point “mark it” starts to lower “mark it” split the marks and “mark it”
All these marks can be found, you have, but you keep coming back and relying on the marks already in place.
I have read all this and find it hard to understand how/why you are having problems, except you keep coming back to the marks already in place.
Cos I am really
J
I don't know why it won't start and we're to go from here.
Thanks for the input.
109Santana
Member
Done that...all OK
I did try a squort of easy start and of course it tried to run but wouldn't keep going once that had been used.
109Santana
Member
Fuel pump not been removed and is as air free as I can see, plenty coming out of the overflows - is there any way I can further bleed it?
109Santana
Member
Hi...there very little smoke coming out - I have inlet and exhaust manifold off and it looks more like a spray if diesel than smoke...I get tons if I give it a spray if easy start but I expect that.
Are we thinking pump timing??
Cheers
I am thinking no diesel at all.
If it is cranking fast enough and injecting then that diesel has to do something, even if is just making smoke.
DPA pumps had a ban name for bleeding them up back in the day.
109Santana
Member
Ok...I agree, if there was some diesel getting in it would at least try ... just like the easy start.
Is there a tried and tested way of ensuring that the pump is completely free of air? And supplying sufficient fuel at the right time??
Cheers
I would start from the very beginning.
Fuel in tank
Tank pick up pipe under the fuel level
Pick up pipe cracked/rotten
Lift pump lifting fuel manually and when cranking, some have a filter in in the cap, air free fuel coming out of the lift pump
Filter clear and all seals sealing
Fuel reaching the lift pump manually and when cranking
Fuel squirting from injector pipes, this is the critical bit as I can remember you saying something about the stop solenoid?
Fuel in tank
Tank pick up pipe under the fuel level
Pick up pipe cracked/rotten
Lift pump lifting fuel manually and when cranking, some have a filter in in the cap, air free fuel coming out of the lift pump
Filter clear and all seals sealing
Fuel reaching the lift pump manually and when cranking
Fuel squirting from injector pipes, this is the critical bit as I can remember you saying something about the stop solenoid?
109Santana
Member
Thanks,
I have bypassed most of the first problems by using a 10 litre container of clean fuel direct into lift pump.
Lift pump working very well, manually and cranking.
Good spray from injectors when cranking (these are new). I checked these by pointing them up in the air with a blackboard behind to see the spray! It works quite well. The only thing I can't tell is if the injector is squirting at the correct time!!
Fuel solenoid is also operating correctly - I checked this when testing injectors.
Thanks
109Santana
Member
When I say it runs on easy start...it coughs splutters and makes smoke but doesn't really run! I don't want to spray too much in it in case there is something wrong......
I've done everything by the book and done everything suggested on here and still it won't run....I've spent a fortune on parts and it still won't run....I am at a loss
