That's a great effort and you should be really pleased with the results too!
As others have said, keep the methodical approach going right up to the point you start it. It might sound silly but have a list of things that need to be done before starting, and tick them off as you go. It's a pleasing moment when the engine you've just built starts - almost like a newborn (just as expensive but less messy!)

I have been reading your thread very closely this last few months. I will be really pleased if I make half as good a job as you have.

greyhair said:

Top work
The engine is looking great.

Click to expand...

Cheers, greyhair.

florncakes said:

That's a great effort and you should be really pleased with the results too!
As others have said, keep the methodical approach going right up to the point you start it. It might sound silly but have a list of things that need to be done before starting, and tick them off as you go. It's a pleasing moment when the engine you've just built starts - almost like a newborn (just as expensive but less messy!)

Click to expand...

That doesn't sound silly. I did it towards the end of the body rebuild and I'll do it for the engine.

Sakara said:

I have been reading your thread very closely this last few months. I will be really pleased if I make half as good a job as you have.

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I think you'll do twice as good a job.!

I was considering having a go at the timing, but I've no way of knowing when No1 is at TDC. I could take the head off I suppose as its just on temporarily. Does anyone know a way or will I have to wait until the head is torqued down and the tappets are all set?
Not an issue as there are plenty of other jobs to do yet. Just stopped for a cuppa and thinking out loud.

Al2O3 said:

Cheers, greyhair.



That doesn't sound silly. I did it towards the end of the body rebuild and I'll do it for the engine.



I think you'll do twice as good a job.!

I was considering having a go at the timing, but I've no way of knowing when No1 is at TDC. I could take the head off I suppose as its just on temporarily. Does anyone know a way or will I have to wait until the head is torqued down and the tappets are all set?
Not an issue as there are plenty of other jobs to do yet. Just stopped for a cuppa and thinking out loud.

Click to expand...

You can do it with a degree wheel and a dial indicator but to be honest its not worth the hassle, just wait until you can do it with the timing set. Taking the head off and just watching the piston isn't accurate enough to set the pump timing.

Kwakerman said:

You can do it with a degree wheel and a dial indicator but to be honest its not worth the hassle, just wait until you can do it with the timing set. Taking the head off and just watching the piston isn't accurate enough to set the pump timing.

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I've got a timing set, but I'll wait until the head is properly torqued down and the tappets set. I'm presuming when @Saint.V8 refers to getting No1 at TDC he is watching the tappets to tell.

Todays enthusiasm is beginning to drain away. Partly because I'm tired and party because the Elring gasket sets don't list what they contain. (Have I mentioned before that this REALLY winds me up)
Turned my attention to getting other bits ready to go on. Turbo and the oil feed & return pipes and the fuel union to the FIP. Copper washers needed. No problem! I'll go and get them out of my Elring top and bottom gasket sets Now both the fuel union and oil to turbo unions have two copper washers each.
Can anyone explain the copper washers in these sets?
Some items from the bottom set which I don't know where they are for.

The copper washers - there are three the right diameter for the FIP fuel union and the oil feed pipe (which are the same diameter I've realised) The two on the left are thin compared to the one next to them which is thicker. What might they be for? As it's the 'bottom set', those two thinner ones might be for the oil to turbo union!
There is a tiny, collapsible, copper washer and a tiny O ring similar diameter. What are they for?
Whats the shiny metal one for?
The large O ring is the same as the one I put in the sump for the oil pick up. Why would they put two in? To mess with your head to make you think you've missed something important Or, have I missed something important

So, I turned my attention to the top gasket set. Straightforward, apart from the copper washers

The big one at the bottom I would suspect is a sump oil plug washer, but it's collapsible. Are they collapsible? I can't remember cos I've had one of these drain plugs on for donkeys years.
The group of 4 are injector washers.
The group of 8 are collapsible. Haven't worked out what they are for yet? Anyone know?
The group of 3 are similar to the bottom set and the correct diameter for the FIP union and oil to turbo union, except this time 2 are thick and 1 thin
@jamesmartin , @neilly , anyone! Sorry if I'm sounding desperate, but I am. Or, just sick. Not sure which I think I can hear the Guinness is calling anorl, which doesn't help

Al2O3 said:

I've got a timing set, but I'll wait until the head is properly torqued down and the tappets set. I'm presuming when @Saint.V8 refers to getting No1 at TDC he is watching the tappets to tell.

Todays enthusiasm is beginning to drain away. Partly because I'm tired and party because the Elring gasket sets don't list what they contain. (Have I mentioned before that this REALLY winds me up)
Turned my attention to getting other bits ready to go on. Turbo and the oil feed & return pipes and the fuel union to the FIP. Copper washers needed. No problem! I'll go and get them out of my Elring top and bottom gasket sets Now both the fuel union and oil to turbo unions have two copper washers each.
Can anyone explain the copper washers in these sets?
Some items from the bottom set which I don't know where they are for.
View attachment 123621
The copper washers - there are three the right diameter for the FIP fuel union and the oil feed pipe (which are the same diameter I've realised) The two on the left are thin compared to the one next to them which is thicker. What might they be for? As it's the 'bottom set', those two thinner ones might be for the oil to turbo union!
There is a tiny, collapsible, copper washer and a tiny O ring similar diameter. What are they for?
Whats the shiny metal one for?
The large O ring is the same as the one I put in the sump for the oil pick up. Why would they put two in? To mess with your head to make you think you've missed something important Or, have I missed something important

So, I turned my attention to the top gasket set. Straightforward, apart from the copper washers
View attachment 123622
The big one at the bottom I would suspect is a sump oil plug washer, but it's collapsible. Are they collapsible? I can't remember cos I've had one of these drain plugs on for donkeys years.
The group of 4 are injector washers.
The group of 8 are collapsible. Haven't worked out what they are for yet? Anyone know?
The group of 3 are similar to the bottom set and the correct diameter for the FIP union and oil to turbo union, except this time 2 are thick and 1 thin
@jamesmartin , @neilly , anyone! Sorry if I'm sounding desperate, but I am. Or, just sick. Not sure which I think I can hear the Guinness is calling anorl, which doesn't help

Click to expand...

Top left gasket is FIP to case joint, top right looks like exhaust manifold to downpipe, shiney one is probably EGR

Kwakerman said:

Top left gasket is FIP to case joint, top right looks like exhaust manifold to downpipe, shiney one is probably EGR

Click to expand...

Yes, I can see that now. The FIP hasn't been off, which will explain why I didn't recognise that one. That is the shape of the exhaust, but I've got a metal one for that with the turbo. The one in the picture is not metal? The EGR! I've put that to one side, cos it's not going back on.
Cheers, Kwakerman.

We had light rain here until midday, so a delayed start working outside. Started cleaning stuff in the garage.
The intercooler had received a fair bit of oil when the engine carped.

All I had was petrol for the chainsaw, so ran that through it. Took ages and the petrol kept coming out thick and black. Taped plastic over the end so I could swill it in all directions.

Nice and clean in there now. I'll need to swill it with something else as the petrol already had two stroke oil in it and so there will be a thin film of two stroke oil to get rid of.
Then started on the inlet manifold. It was pretty dirty and with dirt ingrained oxidation on the outside. But, you can't really tell from this picture.

The inside was a disaster though. twenty years of EGR deposits and the oil from the, albeit brief, run away.


This took hours to clean. Petrol and brake cleaner with a tooth brush down the ports. Swilling petrol around inside.
Then I hit on this idea.

I used some rope taped to a long metal bar to make a bottle brush
Put some petrol in and set the drill away. WARNING if you are going to do this don't do it in the garage or anywhere near the house! Bottom of the garden at least.
And put some blue roll in the port holes
Anyway, after a hell of a mess I ended up with this.




Gave the gasket surfaces a rub over with some 1200 grit paper. Not perfect inside, but a hell of a lot better than it was before. It took hours

When it stopped raining I took the bonnet off and got all the bell housing bolts fitted and tightened down. Tightened all the engine mounting bolts. Fitted the clutch slave cylinder, the starter motor.
Carefully cleaned every tooth and groove in the timing pulley wheels with blue roll dampened with brake cleaner. Wanted them clean and dry.
Thought I'd leave it there for tonight as the forecast is good for tomorrow. Thought I'd get the head off make sure all clean, put new gasket in and torque it fully down, get the injectors and heater plugs in and do the timing. That was the plan, so tidied up and then came in.
Checked LZ before heading off to the shower and Disco1BFG had like a post. I clicked on the link at it took me a few pages back in the thread to last week. Scrolled through it and it was putting the rear crank oil seal, clutch and everything on.
Anyway, went in the shower and something was nagging me about the oils seal picture. I also had a clear picture of putting it on in my head because after fitting it I noticed a hair was trapped in the seal and I used a magnifying glass and tweezers to pull it out (actually it snapped)
Anyway, in the shower it dawned on me that I have fitted that seal incorrectly and so the engine is going to have to come out again I'm gutted. Definitely Guinness time now

The woodruff keys on the crank will be at 12o'clock, this will allow you to take the flywheel wade plug out and fit your timing pin....may need a gentle tweak with a screwdriver through the hole to get the slot to line up.

Then rotate the cam pulley unitl the mark on it lines up with the pointer on the timing housing bolt hole (around the 8o'clock position....

Finally, rotate the fip until the time holes line up and you can slide the locking pin in (around the 10 or 11o'clock position).

With the crank pin in, the fip pin in and the cam pulley lined up, loosen the 3 fip pulley bolts and turn pulley as far coockwise as possible....

Now feed the belt under the crank sprocket and working anti-clockwise, keeping tension on the right handside of the belt, go under the idler, over the top of the cam pulley, over the top of the fip pulley and over the top of the tensioner pulley......

Now, as you apply tension to the belt with the tensioner, this will rotate the fip pulley back anti-clockwise (hence loosening the pulley and turning all the way clockwise). Tighten the 3 bolts and remove the locks.

Once tensioned, rotate the engine on the crank twice, then the timing marks should reallign. Refit the locking pins, loosen the 3 bolts, loosen the tensioner and retension again. Do the 3 bolts back up, remove the locks and rotate the crank twice.....it should all line up.....job done.

Saint.V8 said:

The woodruff keys on the crank will be at 12o'clock, this will allow you to take the flywheel wade plug out and fit your timing pin....may need a gentle tweak with a screwdriver through the hole to get the slot to line up.

Then rotate the cam pulley unitl the mark on it lines up with the pointer on the timing housing bolt hole (around the 8o'clock position....

Finally, rotate the fip until the time holes line up and you can slide the locking pin in (around the 10 or 11o'clock position).

With the crank pin in, the fip pin in and the cam pulley lined up, loosen the 3 fip pulley bolts and turn pulley as far coockwise as possible....

Now feed the belt under the crank sprocket and working anti-clockwise, keeping tension on the right handside of the belt, go under the idler, over the top of the cam pulley, over the top of the fip pulley and over the top of the tensioner pulley......

Now, as you apply tension to the belt with the tensioner, this will rotate the fip pulley back anti-clockwise (hence loosening the pulley and turning all the way clockwise). Tighten the 3 bolts and remove the locks.

Once tensioned, rotate the engine on the crank twice, then the timing marks should reallign. Refit the locking pins, loosen the 3 bolts, loosen the tensioner and retension again. Do the 3 bolts back up, remove the locks and rotate the crank twice.....it should all line up.....job done.

Click to expand...

Cheers, Saint. I've read your how to several times. It's the getting No1 to TDC that I won't be able to tell withthe engine the way it is at the moment. I'm presuming that with the woodruff keys at 12 O'clock and the flywheel pin in No1 could be at TDC or at bottom?
Anyway, I think the engine is having to come out again.

Al2O3 said:

Anyway, I think the engine is having to come out again.

Click to expand...

WHY ??

Al2O3 said:

Cheers, Saint. I've read your how to several times. It's the getting No1 to TDC that I won't be able to tell withthe engine the way it is at the moment. I'm presuming that with the woodruff keys at 12 O'clock and the flywheel pin in No1 could be at TDC or at bottom?
Anyway, I think the engine is having to come out again.

Click to expand...

No, it could be at end of compression or exhaust stroke but it will be at TDC

Al2O3 said:

Cheers, Saint. I've read your how to several times. It's the getting No1 to TDC that I won't be able to tell withthe engine the way it is at the moment. I'm presuming that with the woodruff keys at 12 O'clock and the flywheel pin in No1 could be at TDC or at bottom?
Anyway, I think the engine is having to come out again.

Click to expand...

when key is at twelve no 1 and no 4 pistons are allways at tdc

Why take it out again....looking at the photo (below) aslong as you didn't take the plastic seal guide out and is still the right way round, it is fitted correctly surely....I am off to read RAVE now!

blue beasty said:

No, it could be at end of compression or exhaust stroke but it will be at TDC

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Cheers, BB. Good to have that confirmed.

Magicgrotto said:

WHY ??

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I'm not 100% sure, but I reckon I'm 99% sure. I'm goingto email Turner Engineering to see if they can say for sure.
The issue is this.
This is a rear crank oil seal I got bundled with the clutch. I suspect it may be a Britpart or other cheaper make.

You can see the seal is curved in over towards where the engine would be. This one is made out of fairly rigid plastic. I remember the one from Turners was softer.
Anyway, they come with a guide sleeve in like this.

This is looking at the back with the guide in. I took the guide out of the Turner's one (this could be the big mistake) Put it back in and didn't think much of it, though it was tricky to get back in. The one I have here is easy.
Somehow I think the one I've fitted is folded back over so the seal is curving out away from the engine.

I reckon it's not going to seal properly, though it's hellish tight on that steel diameter..
What's making me 99% sure is that you wouldn't need the plastic guide if it was going to fit curved out over. The other 1% is just me clutching at straws!

Saint.V8 said:

Why take it out again....looking at the photo (below) aslong as you didn't take the plastic seal guide out and is still the right way round, it is fitted correctly surely....I am off to read RAVE now!

Click to expand...

I did take it out, that was where I went drastically wrong!

Al2O3 said:

Cheers, BB. Good to have that confirmed.


I'm not 100% sure, but I reckon I'm 99% sure. I'm goingto email Turner Engineering to see if they can say for sure.
The issue is this.
This is a rear crank oil seal I got bundled with the clutch. I suspect it may be a Britpart or other cheaper make.
View attachment 123643
You can see the seal is curved in over towards where the engine would be. This one is made out of fairly rigid plastic. I remember the one from Turners was softer.
Anyway, they come with a guide sleeve in like this.
View attachment 123644
This is looking at the back with the guide in. I took the guide out of the Turner's one (this could be the big mistake) Put it back in and didn't think much of it, though it was tricky to get back in. The one I have here is easy.
Somehow I think the one I've fitted is folded back over so the seal is curving out away from the engine.
View attachment 123645
I reckon it's not going to seal properly, though it's hellish tight on that steel diameter..
What's making me 99% sure is that you wouldn't need the plastic guide if it was going to fit curved out over. The other 1% is just me clutching at straws!

Click to expand...

lip of seal needs to face toward the engine, you shouldnt remove the guide or wipe the seal lip

jamesmartin said:

lip of seal needs to face toward the engine, you shouldnt remove the guide or wipe the seal lip

Click to expand...

Do you reckon now it's been fitted once I'll need a new one, James?
The Turners one claimed to be a superior design, it was bloody expensive too. LINKY
The seal was definitely a different material to the spare one I have here. This one the seal is fairly rigid and you couldn't get it to fold out over if you tried. The one from Turner's was softer and I'm suspecting has folded the other way. Even though I took the guide out and put it back in I've no idea how I managed to fold it the wrong way. But it looks like it in the picture I've posted above. Plus I've got a picture in my head of it and I suspect it was. With it being a different design it might be meant to look like that.

if the seal lip has been disturbed fit another

jamesmartin said:

if the seal lip has been disturbed fit another

Click to expand...

Cheers , James. And thanks for confirming the TDC on No1 cylinder above.

If I look at the seal I have here (It's a new one cost about £11.00) If I folded the plastic bit back it would be VERY obvious in a picture. Plus, it would be impossible to do cos the plastic of the seal is so rigid, it wouldn't fold back on itself. With the Turners one being a different 'design' and, I presume, material I'm not so sure it has folded right back. I'll check with Turners as they must fit this design and see what they say about how it looks when fitted. I've seriously messed up by taking the guide out as this is making me think it could have folded the wrong way.