Winch wiring opinions please.

Yep, I have searched and I did find a couple of interesting threads in regards to this subject, BUT I have a slightly different plan.

I have a Tmax 9500 I won on Ebay last week (£180 including the bumper) but I detest the look of the control box mounted on the top of the winch. So, here's my plan.

I have mounted the bumper and winch onto the vehicle and I would like to make a small cover out of chequered plate which will sit over the winch to help protect it from the elements, so I have removed the control box. I plan to fit the control box in an out of sight location (probably behind the wing) and I plan to change a couple of things.

1. I want to extend the remote control socket to the vehicle interior (either dash mounted or on the front of battery box.) Easy enough to do, only three wires, I might even simply fit a winch control switch on the dash for in & out and keep the remote socket elsewhere for external use.

2. I will fit TWO isolation switches, one out front within easy reach of the winch to work as an emergency stop should anyone become entangled in the works, with another on the interior of the vehicle. I will probably put one on each supply lead so that the winch is completely isolated when not in use, though both could be on the +ve supply cable.

This is where I am in a bit of a pickle. The wiring which came with the winch is too short to reach my battery box. So, I have been thinking, can I draw the +ve supply to the winch from the starter cable where it connects to the solenoid?
This would have two advantages but one disadvantage that I can see.

Advantage one, if I mount one of my isolation switches near the battery on the starter cable, this would double as a starter motor immobiliser and would provide a little extra vehicle security, but it would have to be switched on to start the vehicle. Advantage two, the existing wiring that came with the winch will reach the starter solenoid no problem.
The disadvantage would be that the +ve supply wouldn't be isolated at all times unless I mount the second isolation switch to the same +ve cable (I'd need to switch the first one on to start the engine, though it could be switched off again once the engine is running.)

Can anyone see any major flaws with this plan?
At this stage, I am assuming that the starter cable can handle the current drawn by the winch, but if necessary I will upgrade it should this be required.

Thanks in advance for any relevant input from you guys.

Ron.

I dunno mate, but I'll watch this one with interest as considering (long term) a winch on my bus.

i'd not run it through the starter cable personally. I've just wired up my winch, and I used 300A welding cable (becuase its super flexible so easy to work with) wired directly to my second battery. its only £5 a meter so fairly cheap too. 300A is the max current my winch will draw at stall, so isnt overkill.

as for your isolators, you have it pretty much right, one on the front for emercencys, one in the cab to stop people messing with it in carparks. also if you are extending the sockket, you may as well fit a switch in the cab within easy reach, makes things much easier than the silly remote controls. if you do this then i'd fit a 3rd isolator for the cab controls (a low current switch will be fine, that way you can have your main isolators on when you go off roading, but the cab controls still isolated so you dont accidentally wnch in/out when driving

do you still have the old style 4 solenoids in a lunch box arrangement? i'd highly reccommend an albright style sealed contactor as i had nothing but trouble with the original ones. also its far smaller so easier to hide

Disco_Lewis said:

i'd not run it through the starter cable personally. I've just wired up my winch, and I used 300A welding cable (becuase its super flexible so easy to work with) wired directly to my second battery. its only £5 a meter so fairly cheap too. 300A is the max current my winch will draw at stall, so isnt overkill.

as for your isolators, you have it pretty much right, one on the front for emercencys, one in the cab to stop people messing with it in carparks. also if you are extending the sockket, you may as well fit a switch in the cab within easy reach, makes things much easier than the silly remote controls. if you do this then i'd fit a 3rd isolator for the cab controls (a low current switch will be fine, that way you can have your main isolators on when you go off roading, but the cab controls still isolated so you dont accidentally wnch in/out when driving

do you still have the old style 4 solenoids in a lunch box arrangement? i'd highly reccommend an albright style sealed contactor as i had nothing but trouble with the original ones. also its far smaller so easier to hide

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I should have mentioned that my winch will rarely be used (if ever) as I only want it as back-up should I get stuck when launching/recovering a small boat on stony beaches, I don't do any serious off roading (yet.) I never thought of welding cable, but I am trying to avoid unnecessary cables around my engine bay (not avoid expense.) I did find a thread where someone used his starter cable and apparently it was effective.

A very good point you mentioned about isolating the dashboard controls to avoid accidental operation, though if the front isolator was open then it wouldn't make much difference except when the winch was about to be used. I had intended to get a heavily sprung single pole double throw switch which aint too easy to accidentally operate and will return to the off position when released.

The solenoids with this unit come in a pair, but once I re-locate the control box I'll need to extend the cables to the winch itself. Again, welding cable would be perfect for this job, so I appreciate that suggestion very much. Once I have everything up and running and, if any problems develop with the solenoids, I will replace the unit with an Albright as you suggest.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Ron.

If its only for occasional use then it may be okay, but be sure that the starter cable is up to the job, 300A is 50mm² so i'd check what it is. and this way you still have the problem of isolating the winch without isolating your starter as well.

Disco_Lewis said:

If its only for occasional use then it may be okay, but be sure that the starter cable is up to the job, 300A is 50mm² so i'd check what it is. and this way you still have the problem of isolating the winch without isolating your starter as well.

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Yep, I reckon the starter cable would do the job I need it to, I don't consider isolating both starter and winch with an internal switch as a problem, it'll give a minimum of extra vehicle security and I do intend to have two isolation points anyway, one inside and one outside, so even when the internal one is on, the external will be off until I need to use the winch.

I'll give it a go once I have organised some longer cables for the solenoids to the winch. I'll need three with 8mm tags on each end, should be easy enough to make these out of welder cable. Hopefully, I'll be able to get them organised during the week and ready for fitment next week-end. I want to get a little practice in with using the winch before I need to "use it in anger" so to speak, which will give me ample opportunity to inspect/clean/lubricate the winch cable and get it wound neatly onto the drum.

Tbh it sounds like you've already thought through the pros and cons of your plan, so if you're willing to live with the compromises you've highlighted, I can't think of a reason not to share the cable with the starter.

If you do decide one day to install a second battery and a split charge relay, you can always change the wiring then.

mundungus said:

Tbh it sounds like you've already thought through the pros and cons of your plan, so if you're willing to live with the compromises you've highlighted, I can't think of a reason not to share the cable with the starter.

If you do decide one day to install a second battery and a split charge relay, you can always change the wiring then.

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Yep, I think I'll go with this plan, I have just ordered some 50mm welding cable rated at 370amps constant, borderline I know but if I'm not happy with it I'll upgrade it later, and 8mm lugs for making up the leads I require with a little left over for making a heavy duty starter lead if it's required.

Will let you know how I get on once the job is done.

P.S. I also found a thread where a garage wired someone's winch to the lead at the alternator - this I didn't fancy too much, I wouldn't have thought the alternator lead was heavy enough for the winch current.

Whenver i have wired anything to any vehicle i have owned i have always done it as a stand alone operation so its dead easy to disconnect without effecting the operation of the vehicle, ie you can always get it to start and get home every time.
Plus its only one more metre of cable to run is straight to the battery which has got to be the best way, then put the isolator switch in the seat box simples.


Lynall

Clanforbes said:

Yep, I think I'll go with this plan, I have just ordered some 50mm welding cable rated at 370amps constant, borderline I know but if I'm not happy with it I'll upgrade it later, and 8mm lugs for making up the leads I require with a little left over for making a heavy duty starter lead if it's required.

Will let you know how I get on once the job is done.

P.S. I also found a thread where a garage wired someone's winch to the lead at the alternator - this I didn't fancy too much, I wouldn't have thought the alternator lead was heavy enough for the winch current.

Click to expand...

370A is plenty for your winch
a T max 9500 has a 6hp motor

1hp = 746 watts

so 756 x 6 = 4476 watts

4476 / 12v = 373A

of course this is the maximum current it will draw at stall, normal use will draw only a fraction of this. so the cable you have bought it fine. I'd fit an appropriate circuit breaker/fuse between the starter and solenoid

Disco_Lewis said:

370A is plenty for your winch
a T max 9500 has a 6hp motor

1hp = 746 watts

so 756 x 6 = 4476 watts

4476 / 12v = 373A

of course this is the maximum current it will draw at stall, normal use will draw only a fraction of this. so the cable you have bought it fine. I'd fit an appropriate circuit breaker/fuse between the starter and solenoid

Click to expand...

so how long would you have to use the winch for your battery to drop to say.....10v

4476 / 10 = 448A......approx :doh:

Disco_Lewis said:

370A is plenty for your winch
a T max 9500 has a 6hp motor

1hp = 746 watts

so 756 x 6 = 4476 watts

4476 / 12v = 373A

of course this is the maximum current it will draw at stall, normal use will draw only a fraction of this. so the cable you have bought it fine. I'd fit an appropriate circuit breaker/fuse between the starter and solenoid

Click to expand...

Thanks for that, I used to know those equations, but not thought of them for many years. I tend to believe that the rated capabilities are approximately half of it's real capabilities therefore I was happy to settle for the one I choose.

good evening

I'm just finishing up on my wiring for the winch, the supplied cables inside the box were long enough to make it from the solenoid box in the engine bay to the winch.

I've currently wired it to the starter motor, but I've generally read a lot of negative stuff about it online and then on the other hand in general just conflicting stuff... is it worth it to re-wire to the battery terminals? should I be worried of cooking up some wires and burning stuff? (I've done some very small test just to basically see if it works but all the people saying it's a bad idea to hook it up from starter have made me slightly paranoid....the local 4x4 group)

also added an isolator before the switch rated for 400 amps of constant draw. (they were also saying this will not be enough)

the winch is a 6hp unit

I don't purposefully plan on going to do long days of winching for fun and giggles, but I do want to have a problem & future proof setup just for that day I might have to....

how is life working out for all of you with the winches directly to the starter motor using the vehicles cabling? problems? fires? or happy days?

this thread does give me hope I don't have to re wire it again tomorrow though (or at least its only the two cables going to the battery worst case scenario)