Smoking TD4.

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LenV

Member
Posts
50
Location
Beerwah Queensland Australia
My TD4 has just been checked by a LR dealer here in Australia [ replaced radiator] & found no problems with the ecu ect, had been running rough at at start up with light blue smoke but then settled down. Has run well for the last 2000k but has started the same problem again, yesterday at 2000 revs belching smoke like motor was stuffed. Turned off & restarted, ran perfectly, have replaced PCV vale a couple of years ago, have fitted new silicone hoses recently, have seen same problem on you tube but no answer? Do not really want to rebuild or replace engine as cost more than the car, radiator & 2 new shocks fitted cost $2k, wreckers will give me $1k, so anybody out there can help? would be most appreciated. Video on YouTube Title : Smoking Freelander TD4 51 plate BMW what's wrong
 
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Found this on YouTube, also will put a high quality engine head gasket repair sealer, [ Nulon Head Gasket Repair] Cost $60 cheaper than the following blog on YouTube. In cases where there's also slight coolant loss, for the KV6, the cylinder sleeves are micro-vibrating, the original ones installed when the vehicle left the factory line, and in the process, the force strikes the head gasket leading to a tiny coolant weep in to the combustion chamber - therein leads to your white smoke and coolant loss. The way to fix this is not just the head gasket. I know folks who've done only the head gasket only to have it blow again as the root cause was not addressed. Also replace the liners/sleeves and re-seal everything, entrust that task to a good engine reconditioner. Remember you only want to do this job once so look for the root cause if your symptoms are as described earlier.
 
The TD4 or a KV6 are very different animals, you may as well include quotes on servicing a Jumbo Jet, it would be just as relevant.

Saxavordian's advice is relevant and you haven't answered that.

What ever you do - do not stick a bottle of instant gasket seal in the engine. That stuff should only be used as a last resort if you're stuck in the middle of the outback.
 
Get the crap you put in the cooling system out. It has no good properties and lots of bad. It doesn't matter how much the stuff costs, they are all crap.
Why put a cooling system sealer onto a TD4 with a misfire anyway? Unless it's losing coolant, the cooling system is fine and definitely not responsible for the 2K misfire.
The fact is, no one really knows why some TD4s misfire. Mine does it at light throttle while driving and smokes too if held at 2K in neutral.
Your best bet is to clean the inlet manifold and EGR valve. Spend money on a decent diesel injection cleaner and replace the crankcase filter.
Also ignore any advice relating to the KV6, as they are as different as chalk and cheese.
 
saxavordian said:
Do I get a sweet:D:rolleyes:o_O
Click to expand...
No, but Len might have a bottle of instant gasket seal you can have!

BTW @LenV just in case you're not sure what to do with the injector cleaner - don't do as in that YouTube video and put it in the cooling system, it goes in your fuel tank - but read the instructions on the bottle re how much to use. I think people may run a few bottles/tanks through to get results. Some may even use it permanently (diluted) to keep the injectors clean - but that is probably overkill.
 
saxavordian said:
How much smoke would be given off by dumping a whole bottle of Miller Injector cleaner.
Click to expand...
Lots, I bet. I think they formulate these things to make some smoke so you say 'wow, that's doing some good!'

It's our equivalent of the electrolysis foot bath scams. The difference being that injector cleaner might actually be doing some good at the same time.
 
LenV said:
Found this on YouTube, also will put a high quality engine head gasket repair sealer, [ Nulon Head Gasket Repair] Cost $60 cheaper than the following blog on YouTube. In cases where there's also slight coolant loss, for the KV6, the cylinder sleeves are micro-vibrating, the original ones installed when the vehicle left the factory line, and in the process, the force strikes the head gasket leading to a tiny coolant weep in to the combustion chamber - therein leads to your white smoke and coolant loss. The way to fix this is not just the head gasket. I know folks who've done only the head gasket only to have it blow again as the root cause was not addressed. Also replace the liners/sleeves and re-seal everything, entrust that task to a good engine reconditioner. Remember you only want to do this job once so look for the root cause if your symptoms are as described earlier.
Click to expand...
Head gasket trouble with a Td4 would be one of the last things on my list. As for cooling system sealers - yes, put it in your Massey Ferguson 135 with a pinhole rad leak. Otherwise, I wouldn't even store a bottle of K-Seal NEAR a modern car.

As for the misfire, get your MAF checked (and fuel pressures), check operation of boost solenoid and all vacuum hoses. Inspect fuel rail pressure sensor harness for corrosion. Change the fuel pressure regulator O-ring. Consider having injectors reconditioned.
 
guineafowl21 said:
Head gasket trouble with a Td4 would be one of the last things on my list. As for cooling system sealers - yes, put it in your Massey Ferguson 135 with a pinhole rad leak. Otherwise, I wouldn't even store a bottle of K-Seal NEAR a modern car.

As for the misfire, get your MAF checked (and fuel pressures), check operation of boost solenoid and all vacuum hoses. Inspect fuel rail pressure sensor harness for corrosion. Change the fuel pressure regulator O-ring. Consider having injectors reconditioned.
Click to expand...

Quite.
HG failure on the TD4 is very rare.
The 2K misfire is common and very difficult to trace.
Mine has it regardless of replacing everything I feel is responsible. I've a new MAF, EGR blanked, recently changed HP sensor and it's overly harness. All injectors are pretty well balanced and clean. The misfire is still there.
The next thing I'll be investigating is the PCV valve. I suspect that at times of low boost. Oil is being drawn onto the combination chamber from the CV system. That's the best I can come up with at the moment.

The 2K misfire has remained illusive for many years, despite many components being replaced.
 
Nodge68 said:
Quite.
HG failure on the TD4 is very rare.
The 2K misfire is common and very difficult to trace.
Mine has it regardless of replacing everything I feel is responsible. I've a new MAF, EGR blanked, recently changed HP sensor and it's overly harness. All injectors are pretty well balanced and clean. The misfire is still there.
The next thing I'll be investigating is the PCV valve. I suspect that at times of low boost. Oil is being drawn onto the combination chamber from the CV system. That's the best I can come up with at the moment.

The 2K misfire has remained illusive for many years, despite many components being replaced.
Click to expand...
@Nodge68 By analogy with petrol engines, could we not use injector balance data to determine whether the misfire is lean or rich? My Pscan injector balance PID drops out as you rev past idle, for some reason. I've tagged @pscan.eu to ask why but they haven't replied.

If we could find out if the misfire is lean or rich, that might help trace the culprit.
 
guineafowl21 said:
@Nodge68 By analogy with petrol engines, could we not use injector balance data to determine whether the misfire is lean or rich? My Pscan injector balance PID drops out as you rev past idle, for some reason. I've tagged @pscan.eu to ask why but they haven't replied.

If we could find out if the misfire is lean or rich, that might help trace the culprit.
Click to expand...

Diesel injector balance compensation is only applied at lower Rpm. It's basically applied to give idle refinement and stability. Above 1500 or so revs, balance makes no difference to engine refinement.

On a petrol engine, the mixture ratio remains reasonably constant, over the entire rev range.
A diesel uses a variable mixture ratio to control power output. So is actually running lean for much of the time. This is why diesels are so fuel efficient.
It is possible for 1 cylinder to run more lean or rich than the others. But due to the variable fuel delivery rate, actual fuel delivered to individual cylinders isn't as important as it would be in a petrol engine.
A diesel more makes power by adding more fuel. So if one cylinder is making less power than the next, it's of little consequence. Power developed is simply an average of all cylinders added together. This is a very simplified version of what happens, but that's the idea.

So the TD4 2K misfire has to be something that is upsetting the way the fuel is being burned. This is most noticeable at times of light throttle application. Mine only does it at very light throttle and only around 2K Rpm.
This is why I was thinking that oil from the CV system could be drawn in. This could upset the way the engine burns, resulting in a misfire.
 
Nodge68 said:
Quite.
HG failure on the TD4 is very rare.
The 2K misfire is common and very difficult to trace.
Mine has it regardless of replacing everything I feel is responsible. I've a new MAF, EGR blanked, recently changed HP sensor and it's overly harness. All injectors are pretty well balanced and clean. The misfire is still there.
The next thing I'll be investigating is the PCV valve. I suspect that at times of low boost. Oil is being drawn onto the combination chamber from the CV system. That's the best I can come up with at the moment.

The 2K misfire has remained illusive for many years, despite many components being replaced.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help boys, will have to drain radiator & put new coolant in & try the injector cleaner. I've a new MAF, EGR blanked & also changed the crankcase filter a year ago. Does not backfire only runs rough for a few seconds on start up, small cloud of blue smoke then runs well, great acceleration but since Land Rover replaced radiator & reset the diagnostics fuel consumption has increased from 8 ltrs /100k to 10 as well as exhaust gas has a different smell?
 
Thanks for the help boys, will have to drain radiator & put new coolant in & try the injector cleaner. I've a new MAF, EGR blanked & also changed the crankcase filter a year ago. Does not backfire only runs rough for a few seconds on start up, small cloud of blue smoke then runs well, great acceleration but since Land Rover replaced radiator & reset the diagnostics fuel consumption has increased from 8 ltrs /100k to 10 as well as exhaust gas has a different smell?
 
Slight misfire when cold is of no real consequence. Blue smoke could be valve guide oil seals.
The crankcase breather is an annual job and should be done at the same time as the oil filter change. The PCV valve will also need cleaning, but is often overlooked. Carb or brake cleaner is the stuff for cleaning the PCV valve.
As for the 2k misfire with smoke. No one really knows the answer.
Mine does it too. I did a video of it a while back.
 
Yes Nodge it seems to start around 2krevs but sitting on that on the road it doesn't do it, I will have a look at the BMW sites as it is the [ The BMW M47 and Rover Group M47R are diesel straight-4 engines. Variants were manufactured by BMW from 1998 to 2007.]have found other information there. Have had to replace vacuum hoses recently & can not find a diagram I can read on line, is there any in a manual available? LenV
 
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