Puma or TD5? Newbie questions

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TD5 would be the newest engine I would personally consider, older engines are just simpler to fix. The TDCI is without doubt the quicker and more refined engine, but I have heard rumours of them not being able to cope with the abuse they tend to receive as a works vehicle.

A decent remap will improve MPG as long as you don't use the extra performance all the time. My old Focus ST would achieve about 25/26 MPG when it had 225bhp and 320nm, and driven in the same manor achieved 27mpg when it had 315bhp and 560nm.
 
Hi it would probably be worth asking someone who fixes them which engine is better, on here like James Martin, even the last td5s are getting on a bit now, but a good condition td5 will last longer then a average condition tdci, lots of things to note not just the engine
 
Personally, I dunno what all the fuss is about concerning the Defender and long trips. I trundle the length and breadth of the country in mine, which is a 2006 TD5 model and don't find it too much of a problem. The most I've done in a day is 700 miles. From my position in the midlands I can have day trips to Lands End or Scotland, which is nice. The main thing that slows you down is not the performance of the vehicle, it's traffic. I like to get out in the early hours of the morning so I can get a few hours motoring in before the roads fill up when I have a long distance to cover. So with empty roads in the north of Scotland it will make pretty good progress. Just because it is a Land Rover doesn't mean you have to go at 55 all the time either. If it feels unstable at speed, then it may be time to renew the steering swivel bearings. With all bearings and bushes renewed, the handling feels quite tight and sure footed, even at the sort of motorway speeds achieved by the white van men doing battle in the outside lane.
 
Brown said:
Personally, I dunno what all the fuss is about concerning the Defender and long trips. I trundle the length and breadth of the country in mine, which is a 2006 TD5 model and don't find it too much of a problem. The most I've done in a day is 700 miles. From my position in the midlands I can have day trips to Lands End or Scotland, which is nice. The main thing that slows you down is not the performance of the vehicle, it's traffic. I like to get out in the early hours of the morning so I can get a few hours motoring in before the roads fill up when I have a long distance to cover. So with empty roads in the north of Scotland it will make pretty good progress. Just because it is a Land Rover doesn't mean you have to go at 55 all the time either. If it feels unstable at speed, then it may be time to renew the steering swivel bearings. With all bearings and bushes renewed, the handling feels quite tight and sure footed, even at the sort of motorway speeds achieved by the white van men doing battle in the outside lane.
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What sort of fuel economy do you get in the TD5 when you're travelling long distance like that? I find Defenders quite comfortable actually. Do you ever feel like you need a 6th gear?
 
Wimblowdriver said:
Puma has a good level of comfort and a heater that works exceptionally well. Depending on the trim/spec level there is good soundproofing, a radio you can listen to. A great car for long distance and motorways and with a good cruising speed. Will keep up at legal speeds plus a bit but you won't spend a lot of time in the fast lane, mostly with the trucks plus enough oomph to overtake when required. But f*****g awful in city traffic, too heavy on the clutch foot. But they are still very pricey, holding their value, I can't find one same year cheaper than what I paid for one 5 years ago.
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What is it about them that they hold their value so well? £16k is a lot to spend on an 11 year old car but I wouldn't mind that and the running cost if I was sure it'll keep its money
 
Jonewen413 said:
What sort of fuel economy do you get in the TD5 when you're travelling long distance like that? I find Defenders quite comfortable actually. Do you ever feel like you need a 6th gear?
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I haven't worked out an exact fuel economy figure but to give you an example the other day I filled up and did a round trip of 240 miles to my smallholding in Wales and back. This involves mostly motorway/dual carriageway until I get from my house to Shrewsbury, then A roads, then a bit of unclassified road driving. Filling up again on my return, I found I had used £57 worth of fuel, so about 24 p a mile. And that's with diesel prices at their current high levels. The trip out, early in the morning, took me 2 1/2 hours. What makes it more thirsty I find is when there is a headwind, or when I have stuff on a roofrack, rather than the speed I drive. Traffic jams also make for a more thirsty trip, which is another reason I try to plan my long runs so I go through the congested bits early in the morning. I've been doing this round trip since 2012 and in early 2016 I fitted an overdrive. It's not essential, but cruising on the flat at motorway speed it makes for a quieter ride.
 
I've owned my TD5 for near 6 years and i wouldn't part with it as i love it...in fact 13 prospective buyers have......stopped me in the street, asked at traffic lights, at the shops, at landy meets, at work even an MOT man begged me to sell it to him !!! As for running costs.... "cheap," to date i have always been able to get a part from the net or fleabay, it has only let me down badly "one time only" and that was the dreaded oil in the ECU which we all know about and i have fixed and keep tabbs on it. She is now on 165,000m and gets fresh oil & filters every 6 months (regardless of milage). All the niggles with the TD5 i have addressed and the chassis gets a coating of Morris ankerwax every 2 years. Not including the oil changes, i have bills for bits totalling £943.00 in 6 years of ownership. How many cars out there burn £157.00 a year in running costs and go up in price by £2,000 since buying it !!!!!
 
smithtrevor said:
I've owned my TD5 for near 6 years and i wouldn't part with it as i love it...in fact 13 prospective buyers have......stopped me in the street, asked at traffic lights, at the shops, at landy meets, at work even an MOT man begged me to sell it to him !!! As for running costs.... "cheap," to date i have always been able to get a part from the net or fleabay, it has only let me down badly "one time only" and that was the dreaded oil in the ECU which we all know about and i have fixed and keep tabbs on it. She is now on 165,000m and gets fresh oil & filters every 6 months (regardless of milage). All the niggles with the TD5 i have addressed and the chassis gets a coating of Morris ankerwax every 2 years. Not including the oil changes, i have bills for bits totalling £943.00 in 6 years of ownership. How many cars out there burn £157.00 a year in running costs and go up in price by £2,000 since buying it !!!!!
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But do you notice the extra money spent on fuel and road tax as opposed to a normal car? Are you worried about the future for older diesels when it comes to the government cracking down on them?
 
Brown said:
I haven't worked out an exact fuel economy figure but to give you an example the other day I filled up and did a round trip of 240 miles to my smallholding in Wales and back. This involves mostly motorway/dual carriageway until I get from my house to Shrewsbury, then A roads, then a bit of unclassified road driving. Filling up again on my return, I found I had used £57 worth of fuel, so about 24 p a mile. And that's with diesel prices at their current high levels. The trip out, early in the morning, took me 2 1/2 hours. What makes it more thirsty I find is when there is a headwind, or when I have stuff on a roofrack, rather than the speed I drive. Traffic jams also make for a more thirsty trip, which is another reason I try to plan my long runs so I go through the congested bits early in the morning. I've been doing this round trip since 2012 and in early 2016 I fitted an overdrive. It's not essential, but cruising on the flat at motorway speed it makes for a quieter ride.
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Is the TD5 your daily driver? Do you notice the increased fuel cost and road tax? What is it about defender that they hold their value so well?
 
They hold their value due to demand rising after production ended in 2016.

Unfortunately, diesel and road tax will only rise due to govt policy against diesels. But we drive defenders because we like them so we’ll just take the rising costs on the chin...
 
Jonewen413 said:
But do you notice the extra money spent on fuel and road tax as opposed to a normal car? Are you worried about the future for older diesels when it comes to the government cracking down on them?
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I suppose if i was to trade the Landy in for FIAT 500 then i would notice the price difference in fuel costs, but then i would want to hang myself from the nearest tree for doing it !! In regards to the government "cracking down," i would guess the thousands of military Landy's being driven on our roads every year might be a cause of concern if they were to start imposing anything on us private owners.
 
Late model TD5s in good condition seem to be getting quite collectable now, so even if the miles increase, there's relatively little depreciation. I suppose the cult status and the fact that they don't make them any more helps. If you really want to see that process in action have a look at what Austin Healey 3000s are advertised for on Ebay. About the price of a small house in some cases.

My only car is the Land Rover. I don't necessarily drive it every day as I live within walking distance of my workplace, but it does all the ferrying about as well as long trips. Yes, I suppose if I wanted economy motoring I'd be using a Nissan Micra or some such horror. Or maybe not having a car at all. After all, I managed without one for a great many years. It's a luxury rather than a necessity, but now I have a little piece of land to play with in Wales it's very useful.
 
Knappster said:
They hold their value due to demand rising after production ended in 2016.

Unfortunately, diesel and road tax will only rise due to govt policy against diesels. But we drive defenders because we like them so we’ll just take the rising costs on the chin...
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Realistically how much can they keep increasing road tax though? Some of the Pumas are already incredibly expensive to tax
 
Brown said:
Late model TD5s in good condition seem to be getting quite collectable now, so even if the miles increase, there's relatively little depreciation. I suppose the cult status and the fact that they don't make them any more helps. If you really want to see that process in action have a look at what Austin Healey 3000s are advertised for on Ebay. About the price of a small house in some cases.

My only car is the Land Rover. I don't necessarily drive it every day as I live within walking distance of my workplace, but it does all the ferrying about as well as long trips. Yes, I suppose if I wanted economy motoring I'd be using a Nissan Micra or some such horror. Or maybe not having a car at all. After all, I managed without one for a great many years. It's a luxury rather than a necessity, but now I have a little piece of land to play with in Wales it's very useful.
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Have you had much experience with Puma's? Do they tend to hold their value as well as TD5's? I think a Puma would suit my needs more with the 6th gear and a family.
 
Jonewen413 said:
Realistically how much can they keep increasing road tax though? Some of the Pumas are already incredibly expensive to tax
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Herein lies a question. But the govt will keep taxing using the dirty diesel argument as justification.
 
Jonewen413 said:
Have you had much experience with Puma's? Do they tend to hold their value as well as TD5's? I think a Puma would suit my needs more with the 6th gear and a family.
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I haven't had a Puma so can't comment firsthand. I seem to remember that there were a number of complaints about poor quality gearboxes in the early Puma period. The way I price cars is to look at Autotrader and Ebay and see what they're advertised for. Of course, what they're advertised for isn't quite the same as what they go for, but it is a rough guide as to values. I remember a few years ago late model TD5s were fetching more than early model Pumas, but things seem to have evened out a bit now, largely because Pumas seem to be more expensive these days.
 
Early pumas were heavy on the road tax (about £500pa) later ones are about £240pa, something to do wit Land Rover getting them classified as commercial vehicles - including the station wagons. Its late in the day and I've been drinking with family so can't be arsed to look up the exact details. As regards why all defenders hold there value, its a simple equation of supply (short) and demand (high) for all models. I don't think that will change somehow so only one way for sold values to go.
 
As I have noted before on this forum, the Puma has been tarred with the same bog brush as ford transits because it has the same engine and peeps expect it to have the same problems as the transits have. But pumas have a different engine management system to the transit, and don't suffer the same electronic problems. Transits have a DMF which needs to be replaced now and again and should be treated as a consumable service item. Big job to change out, but the puma does not have one. And transits tend to be driven hard by people that do not own them or care how well they look after them. I got my puma as a primary everyday driver, for my work in the construction industry - so some site road work, open cast mine work, driving 500 mile in a weekend etc and in 5+ years of ownership it has been well looked after and utterly reliable. (but did need some warranty work early on). I am now retired and it gets used a lot less, but I will not part with it. And it is still my daily driver. :D
 
Wimblowdriver said:
Early pumas were heavy on the road tax (about £500pa) later ones are about £240pa, something to do wit Land Rover getting them classified as commercial vehicles - including the station wagons. Its late in the day and I've been drinking with family so can't be arsed to look up the exact details. As regards why all defenders hold there value, its a simple equation of supply (short) and demand (high) for all models. I don't think that will change somehow so only one way for sold values to go.
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Have you got an older Puma? Do you think 16k is a reasonable price to pay for a 57 plate puma with 60,000 miles on the clock that has been very well looked after? Do you think they will lose value when the government keeps increases road tax costs?
 
I have a mate who spends a lot of time fixing/replacing Transit Puma engines,when I asked him what problems the engines have he said mainly the Peeps [ not the word he actualy used ] who drive the hell out of them and ignore the servicing interval.
 
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