Play in wheel?

DaveyGTi · Nov 24, 2018

If I hold the passenger side wheel on my 90, 12 and 6 and rock it there is noticeable play, got Mrs Dave to depress brake pedal and play is still evident, am I right in pointing my finger at swivel pin bearings needing replacement?
I also have some intermittent knocking/rattling coming from that corner while driving, along with occasional slight wobble in steering, is this likely the cause? (ruled out prop UJs- brand new and no play, doesn't seem to be any movement in steering or suspension components either)

Flossie · Nov 24, 2018

Yes.
I had that and it was the top two pin bolts had come loose somehow. 2 off 17mm spanner.

tottot · Nov 24, 2018

Yes, have a look behind the wheel while someone else rocks it to confirm.

dag019 · Nov 26, 2018

You may get away with just removing a couple of shims to increase the preload back to the correct level to compensate for wear. If this does not remove the play it will need stripping to replace the top pin ad the bush/bearin (dependent on age) You can get kits with everything needed including the seals and gaskets.

DaveyGTi · Nov 26, 2018

Thanks all, I've got a kit on the way so I'll keep my fingers crossed i can adjust the shims but if not I'll strip it down. Was hoping to enter an RTV event on sat so hopefully I'll manage it one eve!

bluedog333 · Nov 26, 2018

DaveyGTi said:
Thanks all, I've got a kit on the way so I'll keep my fingers crossed i can adjust the shims but if not I'll strip it down. Was hoping to enter an RTV event on sat so hopefully I'll manage it one eve!

Shims take less than an hour, I did one swivel overhaul yesterday and it took 8hrs for 1 side! Loads of time spent cleaning, especially manky old gaskets off all the mating surfaces. Would take someone more mechanicky less time of course.

dag019 · Nov 27, 2018

bluedog333 said:
Shims take less than an hour,

I was going to say this should only take about 10 mins, remove the wheel, remove the two top pin bolts, remove the top pin, remove couple of shims, and reassemble. But then I saw the second part of your statement.

bluedog333 said:
Would take someone more mechanicky less time of course.

I do not think of myself as a mechanic, but with 10 years of broken land rovers to build experience I guess I have a lot of knowledge to draw from and forget what it is like to be nearer the beginning of the journey.

neilly · Nov 27, 2018

dag019 said:
I was going to say this should only take about 10 mins, remove the wheel, remove the two top pin bolts, remove the top pin, remove couple of shims, and reassemble. But then I saw the second part of your statement.

I do not think of myself as a mechanic, but with 10 years of broken land rovers to build experience I guess I have a lot of knowledge to draw from and forget what it is like to be nearer the beginning of the journey.

You forgot jacking, I reckon you are pushing it to do all that in 10 mins .....and have a wheel back on and on the ground tightened up.

Cheers

bluedog333 · Nov 27, 2018

dag019 said:
I was going to say this should only take about 10 mins, remove the wheel, remove the two top pin bolts, remove the top pin, remove couple of shims, and reassemble. But then I saw the second part of your statement.

Do you work for a F1 pit crew? Let’s be realistic, chock wheel; jack up and remove wheel; remove calliper; remove track rod/steering rod; remove pin; try a couple of combinations of shims; reassemble.
I might be a bit slow, but ...

johnlad · Nov 27, 2018

bluedog333 said:
Do you work for a F1 pit crew? Let’s be realistic, chock wheel; jack up and remove wheel; remove calliper; remove track rod/steering rod; remove pin; try a couple of combinations of shims; reassemble.
I might be a bit slow, but ...

Yer forgot the spring balance to check loading

bluedog333 · Nov 27, 2018

johnlad said:
Yer forgot the spring balance to check loading

Yep, and tea break. Hang on, my tea break was 50mins, maybe I can do it in 10!

Hicap phill · Nov 28, 2018

Don't forget when you remove the caliper not to bend/snap/kink the pipe between flexi & calliper. This will add more time on.

bluedog333 · Nov 28, 2018

And for those of you following the Haynes manual, don’t forget to disconnect the battery!

dag019 · Nov 28, 2018

bluedog333 said:
Do you work for a F1 pit crew? Let’s be realistic, chock wheel; jack up and remove wheel; remove calliper; remove track rod/steering rod; remove pin; try a couple of combinations of shims; reassemble.
I might be a bit slow, but ...

Don't remove the caliper (just gently bend the pipe bracket clear), don't remove the track rod (just jack up the whole axle so you can turn it both wheels). Just remove enough shims that the movement is gone. Then judge the resistance by hand. If the resistance is high then the swivel needs rebuilding but you have removed the play as a short term fix. You cannot add more shims to get the resistance correct if this then reintroduces the play in the swivel. No movement is more important than correct pre-load.

dag019 · Nov 28, 2018

neilly said:
have a wheel back on and on the ground tightened up.

That's what a speed brace is for. Almost as quick as an air gun used as a nut runner but less time setting up the compressor

bluedog333 · Nov 28, 2018

dag019 said:
Don't remove the caliper (just gently bend the pipe bracket clear), don't remove the track rod (just jack up the whole axle so you can turn it both wheels). Just remove enough shims that the movement is gone. Then judge the resistance by hand. If the resistance is high then the swivel needs rebuilding but you have removed the play as a short term fix. You cannot add more shims to get the resistance correct if this then reintroduces the play in the swivel. No movement is more important than correct pre-load.

Each to their own, I’d personally spend the extra time and do it properly ( well as close to proper as my skills will allow!).

dag019 · Nov 28, 2018

bluedog333 said:
Each to their own, I’d personally spend the extra time and do it properly ( well as close to proper as my skills will allow!).

So would I. But usually doing it properly would mean a rebuild once you have got to the point of having play at the swivel. The above is a diagnosis of this fact and a short term "fix" (bodge) to remove the play so you can still use the vehicle while you wait for the rebuild kit to arrive.

DaveyGTi · Dec 2, 2018

Well that escalated quickly!
Had a quick look this morning, looks like there is only one shim top and bottom anyway, bottom one looks like it's a bit mangled too and swivel seal seems to be leaking a bit, chrome ball looks ok though. Looks like I'll be overhauling it next weekend, fingers crossed for dry weather!

bluedog333 · Dec 2, 2018

DaveyGTi said:
Well that escalated quickly!
Had a quick look this morning, looks like there is only one shim top and bottom anyway, bottom one looks like it's a bit mangled too and swivel seal seems to be leaking a bit, chrome ball looks ok though. Looks like I'll be overhauling it next weekend, fingers crossed for dry weather!

Bottom pin only has a gasket. Good luck with the overhaul, it’s quite satisfying to get it all apart and back together working, even if it does take 10mins-8hrs!

DaveyGTi · Dec 2, 2018

Well hopefully I'll manage short of 8 hours, might take me fractionally more than 10 mins though!!

Play in wheel?

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