pedal boxes

bongo1 · Sep 6, 2020

Hi clutch pedal box assembly's both with spring assist , the later one has the pedal travel bolt adjuster at the bottom of the box , the earlier type like my 96 300tdi has the pedal height adjuster bolt half way up the box as most earlier type boxes .

Is one better than the other as in adjusting .
i read the later td5 type you adjust the pedal height using the m/cyl push rod , and it puts constant strain on the cylinder .
Or is the later type better . or i was thinking of putting the new pedal arm in my old box as its only the pedal trunnion bit that's worn , and i could then keep the earlier type adjustment , or is that been daft and just fit the later td5 type and be done .

flat · Sep 6, 2020

Potato potatoe tbh.

What box do you have now?

mine only has the lower bolt but the later one the bolt is higher up and work as a pedal stop when the pedal is at the end of its stroke (i.e depressed)

Also it doesn’t ‘put strain on the cylinder’ unless you adjust it wrong - there is a clearance you have to set. If this is wrong the cylinder will always be slightly compressed but set right there is a slight bit of slack (at the top of the stroke) that ensures the cylinder isn’t under pressure)

tbh just swap the whole pedal box if you are going to do it, to swap just the pedal you will need to take the pedal box out so you might as well swap.
Also I think the pedal box itself is different to take the spring.

I have an over centre box fitted to mine (Thin pedal atm) and the Long spring one (With the fat arm) I took off is still on the scrap pile So I can look at compare for you if you like?

bongo1 · Sep 6, 2020

mine is the flat bar pedal and the the adjuster is 1/2 way up and it has the spring assist spring ....... the one ive ordered on checking the pt Num looks to be the type with the bolt adjuster lower down , pedal stop adjuster .

I may be wrong and its the same as ive ordered for a 96 def 300tdi . But all the ones forsale now look like the type thats got the pedal stop bolt at the bottom ....guess i could put rivnut in the new one , THATS IF the pedals are the same .

bongo1 · Sep 6, 2020

ps do you adjust the rod so that when you push against the m/cyl spring resistance and it touches the piston , and then give clearance .
Or with the spring relaxed pushing the rod out the m/cyl , and then add more clearance . if you understand me ?

flat · Sep 7, 2020

bongo1 said:
ps do you adjust the rod so that when you push against the m/cyl spring resistance and it touches the piston , and then give clearance .
Or with the spring relaxed pushing the rod out the m/cyl , and then add more clearance . if you understand me ?

No, you have a smidge of clearance before the rod touches the mc. I can’t remember how much but it’s detailed in the workshop manual and is measure at the pedal end IIRC

If you have the flat bar Pedal and already have the over centre spring you will gain nothing by swapping the pedal over.

They are the same, so not sure what you are trying to achieve by swapping it. You don’t really need to touch the lower screw on the earlier boxes - the pedal adjustment is at the pushrod

If you want a lighter pedal your options are:

- update the over centre spring with the LoF updated one
- change the master cylinder for the LoF power master (makes a huge difference)
- fit a red booster (or cobbled together home made) vacuum assist servo
- go to the gym and work on your legs

flat · Sep 7, 2020

https://www.defender2.net/forum/post764260.html

neilly · Sep 7, 2020

flat said:
- update the over centre spring with the LoF updated one
- change the master cylinder for the LoF power master (makes a huge difference)

If you do both of these, and have the older style pedal adjustment that only adjusts the pedal up position you may find that the pedal will stick down. LOF will tell you to adjust the 17mm bolt to stop the pressed down stop postiion , but that only works for the later style pedal boxes.

I have heard they also say it is caused due to the clutch springs being soft, but I have their 2.8 TGV clutch fitted and it still had the clutch pedal stick down and required adjustment. Obviously you could not do this on the earlier style as they do not have that adjustment to stop the pedal down travel.

A few people I know and now taking the LOF spring out and just using the LOF mastercylinder.

This is catching a lot of people out.

Cheers

flat · Sep 7, 2020

neilly said:
If you do both of these, and have the older style pedal adjustment that only adjusts the pedal up position you may find that the pedal will stick down. LOF will tell you to adjust the 17mm bolt to stop the pressed down stop postiion , but that only works for the later style pedal boxes.

I have heard they also say it is caused due to the clutch springs being soft, but I have their 2.8 TGV clutch fitted and it still had the clutch pedal stick down and required adjustment. Obviously you could not do this on the earlier style as they do not have that adjustment to stop the pedal down travel.

A few people I know and now taking the LOF spring out and just using the LOF mastercylinder.

This is catching a lot of people out.

Cheers

yeah you and i discussed it when I did mine, the master cylinder mod and The updated spring were stronger than the fingers of the clutch plate and held the pedal down.
I could set the stop to stop the spring ‘over working’ so I removed the LoF spring and refitted the standard Lr item (which is noticeable smaller gauge wire) and Normal action was resumed also the pedal didn’t feel *that* different with the LoF spring and MC compared to LR spring and MC tbh - it’s still one finger push-able.

No point changing the Whole pedal box just to over come this issue though, just fit one or the other, spring or MC

neilly · Sep 7, 2020

flat said:
I could set the stop to stop the spring ‘over working’

I thought you could not set the stop on your box?

Cheers

bongo1 · Sep 7, 2020

flat said:
No, you have a smidge of clearance before the rod touches the mc. I can’t remember how much but it’s detailed in the workshop manual and is measure at the pedal end IIRC

If you have the flat bar Pedal and already have the over centre spring you will gain nothing by swapping the pedal over.

They are the same, so not sure what you are trying to achieve by swapping it. You don’t really need to touch the lower screw on the earlier boxes - the pedal adjustment is at the pushrod

If you want a lighter pedal your options are:

- update the over centre spring with the LoF updated one
- change the master cylinder for the LoF power master (makes a huge difference)
- fit a red booster (or cobbled together home made) vacuum assist servo
- go to the gym and work on your legs

My pedal at the trunnion has a lot of play . So im changing the whole pedal box as i could not find just a pedal arm . But the new pedal box assemblies appear to have the pedal travel adjustment , NOT what i have now which is pedal height half way down the box , not at the bottom as the new ones pedal travel . .

ive ordered the LOF spring so i may have to use the new type box , unless i modify and have Both adjustments ?

bongo1 · Sep 7, 2020

IMG_0122.JPG.41f23971913995e6d0199cb36fb0d8fe.JPG

bongo1 · Sep 7, 2020

This is what im thinking of doing , Drilling a hole and sticking a rivnut in .

flat · Sep 7, 2020

neilly said:
I thought you could not set the stop on your box?

Cheers

Sorry yes that’s a typo - I meant ‘couldnt’

flat · Sep 7, 2020

bongo1 said:
This is what im thinking of doing , Drilling a hole and sticking a rivnut in .

Can’t see why that wouldn’t work if it’s in the right place - Make sure the pedal arms are the same shape inside and don’t have a different pivot point or something - I didn’t look into that.

bongo1 · Sep 7, 2020

should be here tomorrow so will compare them . Ive read they are the same and how the chap did it as per the picture . But yes i will check . ive got some rivnuts and should work , Even a bolt with 2 nuts one inside one out , locked against the p/box would work , as long as i can get some long nose moles to lock onto the inner nut once adjusted and lock the off against each other , once its set thats it for life should be .

pedal boxes

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