Paranoid about Parabolics

Paddock Spares:-
Parabolic Springs

Fronts £77, rears £107(SWB) £122(LWB) (ex Vat)
Look like the 'Padocks 'Black' Parabolics I got eight years ago. They dont have pics of the Monroe Gas shocks, but list them at £27.50 each.
Plain Leafs:-

Priced individually, from £22 each to £35..... depending on whether petrol/diesel, LWB/SWB, standard or HD
Oil-Stirrer shocks to go with them, a quid or so either side of £10
They dont mention make, I 'have a sneaky feeling they are made in india..... and they dont advertise the fact becouse they actually aren't THAT bad.......
Then for new shackles, pins & bump-stops to not have to worry (too much) about what old bits get destroyed in removal, theres aboyt £30 worth.
So, from Paddocks, swapping springs alone, Paras will set you back about an extra £80..... going paras and gas shox, an extra £70 ish.... in total, about £150 more for full para set up, all up about £350 over £200 for plains.... all on new pins, bushes etc.
Checked Craddocks, they dont seem to list a parabolic spring; plain leafs and other parts similar prices to Paddocks, though they do list individual leafs if you want to try and make up your own leaf-packs!
Chris Perfect, is now defunct; think the old boy has finally retired!
Springs he sold though were Paul Haystees, and he's still in business; PaulHaystee Automotive B.V
Doesn't list prices, but then he's based in Holland, so would be subject to exchange rates and carriage etc anyway; worth dropping him an e-mail for a 'quote' though, or checking out some of the reviews of his spring kits.
NOT 'Cheap', but they are 'good', I'd expect his springs on thier own to be around £300ish, and the dampers he recomends to go with them about £180ish.... but I'm just guessing.
Next on the list; British Springs Again, ask you to contact them for quote, and dont make much mention of dampers; I believe they used to 'reccomend' 'pro-comps' for you to source seperately, but I dont like the brand to be honest, they are over-priced for what they are, and NOT that well made, old-man-emu's were a good fit with Britsprings I seem to recall, but they were about +50% the cost of pro-comps. I'd expect prices to be less than Haystee's, but more than Paddocks 'black' probably around £250 for the springs.

Next Up; Rocky Mountain.......

Fronts:- £125 inc vat

Rears £150(SWB)/£170 LWB
They suggest a set of Pro-comps to go with them at £150...... but I also know that they have similar opinion of the make as I do........ but people ask for them becouse they are well marketed, and have a big margin on them! They also offer Old-ManEmu's, but as the HD option, for £220..... Definitely the better damper, but that one would be too heavy for 'normal' use I think.
When I did Wheezil, I went for the Padocks blacks and Monroes, as said; reason being that for the effort of doing the job, I wanted the most I could get out of it. I was also chucking a lot of dosh at the old girl, so thought 'what the heck'..... but at the same time I was trying to stretch the budget as far as I could, so I compromised on the 'cheaper' paras and dampers. And as said, I was very pleased with them.
If I was doing the job over, I'd probably go for them again, for the same reasons; but it depends.
IF I was chucking as much money at a series as I did at that old girl, then I would spend a LOT of it in different places, and top of my list would be a brand new galvanised chassis! Onto which I think I'd almost certainly attach Rocky Mountain paras...... I dont know what dampers I'd use..... I'd probably leave the decission to last, after everything else had been put on the rolling chassis, but they wouldn't be Pro-comps.... a 'soft' OMU if i could find one, possibly a De-Carbon, but those Monroes are tried and trusted, so I might go for them again.
IF I wasn't chucking money at a renovation, and doing a 'budget' fun-buggy, then I'd probably try and stick with the original springs and clean them up, and rebuild them on a new 'main-leaf'..... wouldn't save me a huge amount of money, and certainly be a lot more effort, but be 'fun' to do it the 'old-fasioned way'....... but new oil-stirrer shocks and new metalastic bushes would be included in the 'over-haul'..... Yes I would use the old leafs, but on a new main, becouse then at least ONE and the most important one, in the stack, would at least have the right shape and stiffness. and I wouldn't bother oiling them, for the little its worth!
A quick google on 'Land rover Parabolic' and you'll throw up a shed load of 'stuff', quite a lot on fitting them, and opinion on results obtained; and quite a few people supplying them, but will come down to the three main brands Haystee/santana, Rocky Mountain & British Springs, then the 'budget' alternatives like Paddocks 'black'.
I came accross a few other 'unbranded' Paras, similar price to Paddocks, different colour though, and often from suppliers with a lot of Brit-Part parts on thier sites, so presuming thier 'budget' bits are all going to be the same quality as that, haven't bothered to offer the urls........
Look like the Brit-Part ones too.... painted light green by the look of the pic (but seen them described as Brit-Part 'Blue' ?!?)in the Brit-Part catalogue:-

In fact in some cases, probably the same pic as in the Brit-Part catalogue!
Interesting to note how often Brit-Part are slated on the forums...... AND to note that when it comes to Brit-Part 'plain' leaf springs...... Island 4x4 list just about every Brit-Part APART from those...... offering instead 'Bearmach' brand plain leafs for about £45 a corner!
Ergo.... 'decent' plain leafs, that aren't going to say as you watch are a £190 investment, making the difference to paras a lot smaller...... at that price Paddocks black, if they haven't degraded in the last few years, are virtually the same price, while the Rocky's are only £100 more expensive, for a product of equal or better quality and performance......
Thing to note is the price of the springs is only half the story; plain leafs can get away with, and probably benefit from being matched with low cost oil-stirrer dampers, which seem to be around the £10-£15 mark (avoiding the Brit-Part items!). Going para you could 'get away' with staying on your oil-stirrers or pinching penies by fitting oil-stirrers, but the set up wont be that good..... but adding gas shocks really starts to ramp the rpice, as even the cheaper ones are twice to three times the cost........
Choices, choices, choices!
And you have this steering wobble to worry about!
On which topic, suspension not doing its job wont be helping your steering wobble or stability, or your braking stability......... so may still be worth tackling to help with that.......
Good chance that you could do with a swivil overhaul if you have a wobble, rather than just a lot of slop.... and that might be easier to do with the axle off the car, in which case why bolt it back up JUST to unbolt it when you tackle the springs.....
May also be the spring mounting..... a 'wobble' or more precicely the 'Land-Rover Lurch' under throttle on/throttle off shifts making the car tild diagonnally was one of the reasons for me tackling the leafs..... one of my U-bolts had stretched and the back axke was twisting in its mountings!
Could be worth checking out!

Parbolics are fab on and offroad , iused rocky mountain springs on my 1968 v8 converted onto rr axles and never had a problem in 4 years extreme off road challenge events ,worth every penny and to keep the leaf spring authenticity for the non coilers, go for it !!!

My God! Thanks again for all the advice. Duly noted and digested.

The steering vagueness (is that a real word) and heaviness was helped when I checked the tyre pressures (coughs ahem -).

However if we hit a decent bump in the road, it's a lottery as to where she'll want to steer to when we land.

I'm thinking of checking her into a club member's garage to get a wee overhaul done, as I'd like that sorted professionally, as it's the steering for goodness sake and I'd hate to feck that lot up. The swivel ball (RH) was replaced about 6 months ago, following a collapsed bearing. They both seem fine, as do the front springs, too.

My camera didn't retain the pics of the rear springs so I'll try them again later.

I'm gobsmacked at the amount of advice I'm getting, and it's truly appreciated.

Keep the ideas coming,

Cheers

Hi Chaps.

My digital camera had died recently. However I'm pleased to say that I've got the pics off it now and have added some of the better quality ones to show you all what the rear springs are actually looking like.

Cheers

. . . and here's the last two pics.

They are standard springs and they have 'had it'. Notice how the clips that go around the springs are bending outwards. This is because the rust is pushing the leaves of the springs apart.

If you are going for standard try and get replacement springs that are British made. The Chinese ones sag very quickly. Do a Google for the Series 2 forum and look on there. There is a thread about this very issue. If you can't find it the chaps over there will be more than happy to help.

Tend to agree, fooked!

Look at the shape of the springs.

Rust has expanded them between the axle and the hangers, where the clamps are splaying, but they are clamped solid at the axle by the U-bolts, so they have taken on a tripple 'bow', a curve following the 'nominal' semi-elypse of the spring, but a bend wither side of that above and below the nominal where the rust has splayed them.

Your the U-bolts will be under a lot more strain than they should be, becouse the rust will be trying to seperate the leaves in the clamped area, just like where the clamps have splayed, but also, where the leaves are splayed the 'wedge' will also be trying to lever the leafs away from the axle..... this is when U-bolts snap!

If you stripped those leaves, put a flap wheel over them, and re-assembled, they probably would work... just about, but to have got that bad, the double bow will probably have 'set' into the spring, so they wont slide like they should, and the actual spring rate will be all over the place........

Just Junk them!

Interestingly, you seem to have a 'bridged' axle......

Some-one has welded gusseting under the wide side of the axle tube to strengthen it, and added an enclosing bottom....

One wonders whether this was done becouse some-one thought it would be a good idea? Did it becouse they were fed up bending axles...... or becouse it was already bent.... and they gave it a little heat, straightened it as best they could then added metal to it!

Either way, suggests hard use.... also cautions replacing springs, but also suggests looking for stuff thats bent or fatigued in and around the running gear and steering for your wobbles......

What's the drag-link and track rod like?

Maybe worth replacing one of both. That kind of mod is usually done for comping, RTV or CCV trials, in which case high liklihood of steering rods being bent, and in all liklihood, straightened out with a sledge hammer...... in which case they could be err.. a bit past thier best, and flexing rather badly..... something you wont be able to see very easily!

Hi, interesting thread, after fitting parabolics to friends landys i now have to make a decision about mine, i have just replaced front dumb irons and wrecked one bush and before i started she leans to the right a weak rear spring i think was wondering how you got on with your springs and are new replacment standard springs that bad?, cheers Ady.

Hi All, and Hi Ady

Bessie has her own agenda, and has given me one of two other areas to attend to first: leaking wheel hubs and a knackered rear brake cylinder, which lead to the fooking of the nut that holds the pipe, which lead to the replacement of a section of brake pipe...you know how it goes!

I have to say though, that purely for budget reasons, I think I'm going to order standard springs from Paddock (unless these are the really nasty ones that I've read about on this thread). I've spent a lot on her recently and have a couple of weekend breaks and a holiday later in the year to pay for, so, my decision has been made for me. So if anyone does know CHEAP British springs inside out and where to source them from please let me know.

My logic behind this is that if they are crap, then I won't have wasted too much money on them. Even if they are going to flatten, then I may get a few years out of them giving budget and finances time to bolster.

So, Ady, in short, I've not changed them yet. It sounds tricky and bloody hard work, but I'll just need to get on with it!

Cheers