L322. A bit of a challange !

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Seriously, When you read thru the threads almost everyone is having the same symptoms. I can not fathom why the place in Louth could not deal with it. once you know it must get easier. Am I right I need to or should park on level ground. put it in standard height. obviously clear codes(that I don't have now) wait 10 mins and have a brew while its in calibration mode. then measure from bottom rim to arch. this figure I enter in to reader and hey presto. Ive never had a problem such as this. its been off the road now for months. 2 failed MOTs, the last one it only failed on wonky suspension but it may well rust out while im trying to sort it.

Bloody wife wont consider a discovery, she wants her RR back. im tempted to just buy another one but its utter madness.
Steveeasy
 
Seriously, When you read thru the threads almost everyone is having the same symptoms. I can not fathom why the place in Louth could not deal with it. once you know it must get easier. Am I right I need to or should park on level ground. put it in standard height. obviously clear codes(that I don't have now) wait 10 mins and have a brew while its in calibration mode. then measure from bottom rim to arch. this figure I enter in to reader and hey presto. Ive never had a problem such as this. its been off the road now for months. 2 failed MOTs, the last one it only failed on wonky suspension but it may well rust out while im trying to sort it.

Bloody wife wont consider a discovery, she wants her RR back. im tempted to just buy another one but its utter madness.
Steveeasy
Sorry but yes level ground, standard height, engine running, doors closed ( I leave window open so can have cable out of it) give it 10 mins or so to settle then as you say measure heights input figures then in theory as you hit ok it should go to new heights but this is where it normally goes to pot best idea now is to lock it and walk away give it 10 mins and start it up see if it will now go to new heights, best of luck ( no, really best of luck).
 
Seriously, When you read thru the threads almost everyone is having the same symptoms. I can not fathom why the place in Louth could not deal with it. once you know it must get easier. Am I right I need to or should park on level ground. put it in standard height. obviously clear codes(that I don't have now) wait 10 mins and have a brew while its in calibration mode. then measure from bottom rim to arch. this figure I enter in to reader and hey presto. Ive never had a problem such as this. its been off the road now for months. 2 failed MOTs, the last one it only failed on wonky suspension but it may well rust out while im trying to sort it.

Bloody wife wont consider a discovery, she wants her RR back. im tempted to just buy another one but its utter madness.
Steveeasy
@steveeasy
you know the ' great indi garage ' i went to... balls'd mine right up, he made it lower, then lower, then so low it was in access mode. he was using dealer scanner!
i think he likes 90s and old crusty stuff.. l322 seemed beyond his abilitieso_O
thats when i got the two diag tools, it wasnt gonna beat me...then came the inpa.. that was after the head aches and disbelief
 
Hiya,
Ok ill try the foxwell tomorrow. I am waiting for cable to turn up to try inpa. Yes the storm clouds are rearing their ugly heads. Ive considered fitting springs, but really an expensive copout. I am also considering getting rid, but its quite close to being ok.
Steveeasy
 
Hiya,
Ok ill try the foxwell tomorrow. I am waiting for cable to turn up to try inpa. Yes the storm clouds are rearing their ugly heads. Ive considered fitting springs, but really an expensive copout. I am also considering getting rid, but its quite close to being ok.
Steveeasy
Dont give up, thats the spirit.
 
@steveeasy
you know the ' great indi garage ' i went to... balls'd mine right up, he made it lower, then lower, then so low it was in access mode. he was using dealer scanner!
i think he likes 90s and old crusty stuff.. l322 seemed beyond his abilitieso_O
thats when i got the two diag tools, it wasnt gonna beat me...then came the inpa.. that was after the head aches and disbelief

No I don't know but give me a clue?. I don't really understand why a pro would have a problem, I do cos I don't really yet understand how it works and what are the weaknesses. once you know you know. I seriously tried the big indi in Lincoln and louth to do subframes and both had never touched one. So what are they doing ?.
Steveeasy
 
When you work with cars all day long and all week you soon get to realize the differences are massive. Even cars that share the same engines all have their own ways of getting them into their own car designs. If they've never touched one, then they've not yet come across one that needs work doing to it.
Since when has a sub frame that supports critical components ever needed welding? The way cars are going for the second hand market it's a nightmare. Try telling an owner of a 2002 saab that it needs a 600€ egr valve and see how that goes down.
Quality isn't a need for a car that is designed to last effectively 10years max. After the first four years the dealers aren't interested and that is left to the independents who may get snippets of info from dealers who aren't exactly willing to share.
Tbh, from someone who runs his own small garage, it's not easy knowing everything about all makes and designs nevermind one particular brand. It's best to say to a client "I ve never done that and couldn't give you a price" or " I couldn't advise you on that. I had a client with a disco wanted the belts doing on the 2.7v6.
Ive done the jag varient but not yet the disco 3.
I said to him I'd like to see the car before I give him a quote, the body off thing is not something I can do but I know it's possible to do the rear belt with the body on. He just didn't turn up.. Fair enough, I've not lost any sleep over it and he'll find somebody who has more experience with it and hopefully be satisfied.
The short of it all, garages can't possibly know everything about every vehicle.

Rant over, leaving with coat and hat in hand! :(
 
When you work with cars all day long and all week you soon get to realize the differences are massive. Even cars that share the same engines all have their own ways of getting them into their own car designs. If they've never touched one, then they've not yet come across one that needs work doing to it.
Since when has a sub frame that supports critical components ever needed welding? The way cars are going for the second hand market it's a nightmare. Try telling an owner of a 2002 saab that it needs a 600€ egr valve and see how that goes down.
Quality isn't a need for a car that is designed to last effectively 10years max. After the first four years the dealers aren't interested and that is left to the independents who may get snippets of info from dealers who aren't exactly willing to share.
Tbh, from someone who runs his own small garage, it's not easy knowing everything about all makes and designs nevermind one particular brand. It's best to say to a client "I ve never done that and couldn't give you a price" or " I couldn't advise you on that. I had a client with a disco wanted the belts doing on the 2.7v6.
Ive done the jag varient but not yet the disco 3.
I said to him I'd like to see the car before I give him a quote, the body off thing is not something I can do but I know it's possible to do the rear belt with the body on. He just didn't turn up.. Fair enough, I've not lost any sleep over it and he'll find somebody who has more experience with it and hopefully be satisfied.
The short of it all, garages can't possibly know everything about every vehicle.

Rant over, leaving with coat and hat in hand! :(

Hi Mark,
was that a rant. ok. A Land Rover/Range Rover independent garage charging 60-70 per hour should be perfectly capable of what we are talking about here, or they should not be charging 60-70 per hour. As for welding subframes, that was never considered. I searched for a garage to replace subframes.
If I was dealing week in week out with Range Rovers and the normal problems associated with them such as the dreaded suspension problems, it would not be difficult to fix. I would not expect to take a RR with suspension faults to a general garage and expect them to know everything. that is just unfair. that's why we have specialised independent garages, they specialize in certain makes.

I took in 1995 a 2 year old 200TDI to keith Gott for a service(wish id not sold it). People will recognise the name. I then drove from Hampshire to Yorkshire. On the M1 the oil light came on. Yes the oil filter seal was half left on. and the oil poored out. I sued him as he refused to rectify it. the car was towed to a garage and a report was provided . That was a very poor service.

I took in 1998 a 3ish year old 300tdi to Dunsfold LR . very good independent. paid a very high price for a full service. gearbox oil, diffs, the lot. when it returned it looked as if they had done nothing. I went back and was told course they did. it was all marked with yellow. so I took the car back to them and low and behold, they had done none of the work at all including not changing the oil in the engine. It was apparently a mistake. I think I paid £500 25 years ago for that. at todays prices nr £1000.

So that's why lots of people with these cars just get on and do it themselves. its pointless paying someone for something if they don't want to, can be bothered, or don't know what they are doing. I am sure lots do provide a very good service. I

Steveeeasy
 
Ok,
Ive had the Foxwell on the car. I left it running for 10 mins before starting. no codes. in standard height mode. measured each height from bottom of rim to top of arch. entered them in. and it levelled. but it sits heigh at 760mm at each wheel. The car sits right at the low setting, normal ride height is too high, and high is well blow the air bags off. don't seam to be able to get it to come down but its level. wife cant get in it.
Steveeeasy
 
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Tried that. Ive got the deflate to let down each corner. had her sitting looking mean. drove up the road and it was perfect. came back perfect. turned it off and it went back up. :(. So ive deflated it again. taken measurements entered these and its still in the right heights. think ill leave it there, see if that helps.

:)Steveeasy
 
No I don't know but give me a clue?. I don't really understand why a pro would have a problem, I do cos I don't really yet understand how it works and what are the weaknesses. once you know you know. I seriously tried the big indi in Lincoln and louth to do subframes and both had never touched one. So what are they doing ?.
Steveeasy
@steveeasy hi there, i put a post up a while back about my day out at an indi garage..thats why i started.... 'you know when i...'
re garages, they are a bit like cars.. some good and some not so good,
that indi garage did have a very expensive autologic diag tool, but he seemed to be more at home with the lr 90s and such, the complex systems on l322 seemed to be a bit beyond him ( im being very diplomatic)
but that said l322 eas is a pain and unless you ve been there and seen it all first hand and worked out what speaks to what and when etc,
it can confuse the best of us.
as myself and @kds have found and others..
all height sensors need to be free to move, they seize or can over rotate on the front so arms pointing wrong way,best way is have all corners up and really check,then the brackets can be bent /out of alignment,the wiring plugs can fail and rust out on the pins, if not snap off,check for wiring chafing,eas compressor working at correct bar pressure,not overheating,tyres correctly inflated, level ground, engine running, all doors shut, ( some say have a weight in the osf to simulate driver weight, but i havent done that ) make sure alternator is charging at correct rate,check every ecu to make sure no hard faults stored, they lurk in various places,
then with foxwell i could too get mine to around 770mm, but it only once made an adjustment i could see, from then on it was a case bit by bit and waited while car was locked.
if theres any faults it wont accept any inputs, then there is a strange code that can pop up in other ecu's..' eas.. can fault ooo8a/ or 0006a ' from memory, that wont erase on a foxwell but will on a icarsoft lr v2.0.
but some have said online this can point to abs problems..
on the foxwell there is a graph that can be brought up and you can see a ' line' as the sensor moves.. sometimes it just disappears and shows a 'dirty tack on the sensor windings/track'
also with a sensor disconnected from the lower arm,but still wired in you can see the graph do the above( car on axle stands)
the movement you have is easily over 45 degrees up or down on the arm... but this does not correlate to what you see on the diag tool you only get approx 10 degrees of sensor information then it goe's out of limits and wont read. ( i found that interesting)
this is just some of the stuff we found, luckily there was no water ingress issues near to eas ecu, that will get confusing and expensive.
before i bought the tools and before i went to indi garage i phoned harwoods,a range rover main dealer.
i said im ex mercedes tec and now aero engineer so i know my way around stuff and know these can be a problem to set up...they stopped me and said' if this is due to eas calibration you will need to book it in and leave it with us,' i asked why, they said these can take hours to do sometimes it goes well others dont.. then they said the model year 02 05 is the easier ones to do..they arent an easy fix.
from my experiance in the motor trade.. i found a merc tec condemed a full/complete engine, because he could not turn it over by ignition or front bottom pulley,
when i was given the job and engine to fit, i obviuosly removed the gearbox at that point the broken starter motor bendix fell out from between the bell housing and fly wheel, i then turned the engine over by hand... you can imagine the conversation i had with the manager.
at mercedes again.. a tec condemed a sprinter full engine because a customer complained of a rattle and vibration..
when i recieved that job card and read it through i again did my checks and removed the g/box only to find the dual mass flywheel was just about hanging out, that was rattling and vibrating then disappeared over 2000 odd rpm..that conversation with my manager nearly resulted in the tec being fired.
again at mercedes, a vehicle comes in with a worn steering rack, the tec, same one, condems it for a new rack and wants the parts dept to VOR it,
vehicle off road, this is expensive and parts dept dont like it and you need special permission, so owner driver has to rent a van to carry on his work.
when i recieved that job card, again i did my checks then checked the parts computer,then i fitted the track control rod that is a serviceable part and didnt need a whole new steering rack, saving them time and money.
the service manager called me in for a interview, and then gave me a day off to a mercedes ride and drive event for the then new m class and shooting with a select group of customers, as a way of thank you..
my colleagues were shocked as this had never been done there before.
the tec who was at fault left within two weeks..( again im being very diplomatic)
so re why cant garages get it right and fix things...what i found is there is good and bad every where, not everyone cares enough, some are happy just to turn up and take the money, others want the bonus pay, and a few do actually care and take the time to sort it and see it through, that can be said of many walks of life.
its the luck of the draw who you get working on your pride and joy, i had customers request me by name... as we were an off shoot of a london mercedes dealership we had many famous people, i looked after ian wrights then sl500, (aresnal). tom chiltons car mercedes sl ( btcc touring car driver) andrei kinchelskis, maffia owned footballer, ( not sure if its spelt correct) and the mactoomb family,ubber wealthy saudi royal family connected and hobnobbed with the british royal family to name drop a few.
 
Hi Mark,
was that a rant. ok. A Land Rover/Range Rover independent garage charging 60-70 per hour should be perfectly capable of what we are talking about here, or they should not be charging 60-70 per hour. As for welding subframes, that was never considered. I searched for a garage to replace subframes.
If I was dealing week in week out with Range Rovers and the normal problems associated with them such as the dreaded suspension problems, it would not be difficult to fix. I would not expect to take a RR with suspension faults to a general garage and expect them to know everything. that is just unfair. that's why we have specialised independent garages, they specialize in certain makes.

I took in 1995 a 2 year old 200TDI to keith Gott for a service(wish id not sold it). People will recognise the name. I then drove from Hampshire to Yorkshire. On the M1 the oil light came on. Yes the oil filter seal was half left on. and the oil poored out. I sued him as he refused to rectify it. the car was towed to a garage and a report was provided . That was a very poor service.

I took in 1998 a 3ish year old 300tdi to Dunsfold LR . very good independent. paid a very high price for a full service. gearbox oil, diffs, the lot. when it returned it looked as if they had done nothing. I went back and was told course they did. it was all marked with yellow. so I took the car back to them and low and behold, they had done none of the work at all including not changing the oil in the engine. It was apparently a mistake. I think I paid £500 25 years ago for that. at todays prices nr £1000.

So that's why lots of people with these cars just get on and do it themselves. its pointless paying someone for something if they don't want to, can be bothered, or don't know what they are doing. I am sure lots do provide a very good service. I

Steveeeasy
Wow, that's not a good run..
I wasn't ranting at you directly ste, please excuse me if you thought I was. Sometimes garages can get a bad wrap but it seems the ones you have experienced may deserve it!!!
Happy face engaged!! :D
 
Wow, that's not a good run..
I wasn't ranting at you directly ste, please excuse me if you thought I was. Sometimes garages can get a bad wrap but it seems the ones you have experienced may deserve it!!!
Happy face engaged!! :D
Hey Mark,
Just my side. anyway I and we fully appreciate the challenges faced with dealing the ever increasing complexity in dealing with cars and indeed customers.
Happy Days
Steveeasy
 
Ok,
Time for an update. So in the middle of replacing subframes the suspension that had never worked correctly went all lopsided. In desperation took it to Indy and came back 6ft above the ground in access mode. So following advice from a few of you and some help as well, I downloaded Inpa. Bought a cable and tried to calibrate with Inpa. did not quite work at first but when I realised you have to use + to reduce height and - to increase Height, Then one go and she looks perfect now. So I am back on track. Just unfortunately need to change one bolt on rear upper inner wishbone (that wont be easy) new driveshaft on front(gaiter split) and the dreaded air bag light and she may well get back on the road gain
Thanks to all that helped. much Appreciated.
Steveeasy.
 
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Ok,
Time for an update. So in the middle of replacing subframes the suspension that had never worked correctly went all lopsided. In desperation took it to Indy and came back 6ft above the ground in access mode. So following advice from a few of you and some help as well, I downloaded Inpa. Bought a cable and tried to calibrate with Inpa. did not quite work at first but when I realised you have to use + to reduce height and - to increase Height, Then one go and she looks perfect now. So I am back on track. Just unfortunately need to change one bolt on rear upper inner wishbone (that wont be easy) new driveshaft on front(gaiter split) and the dreaded air bag light and she may well get back on the road gain
Thanks to all that helped. much Appreciated.
Steveeasy.
Well done, had to do front cv boot on mine not long after buying it, special tool to remove shaft from the hub (but a brass drift and 3lb lump hammer works) getting it back in however without said tool is a different matter and involves a lot of use of some very very bad words !
 
Well that was a long road. As you may recall 2 weeks ago I used Impa and the calibration was easy. Ive replaced the front driveshaft and at the same time replaced the tie bars on the front. I had a dodgy bolt on the upper arm on the rear. managed to replace that. So took car for a drive and its perfect. no lights suspension is all fine. so how did that happen. I previously took the RR to an expert indy who found every reason he could not repair car. he tried to calibrate it and told me it could not be done. I was going to scrap it at one point. Really pleased and thanks for those that helped me sort it. would not have managed to get there without Landyzone.
Thanks
Steveeasy
 
Well that was a long road. As you may recall 2 weeks ago I used Impa and the calibration was easy. Ive replaced the front driveshaft and at the same time replaced the tie bars on the front. I had a dodgy bolt on the upper arm on the rear. managed to replace that. So took car for a drive and its perfect. no lights suspension is all fine. so how did that happen. I previously took the RR to an expert indy who found every reason he could not repair car. he tried to calibrate it and told me it could not be done. I was going to scrap it at one point. Really pleased and thanks for those that helped me sort it. would not have managed to get there without Landyzone.
Thanks
Steveeasy
Good on you for hanging in there.
Just think if you'd thrown in the towel and bought a Kia or a Honda semi cross over thingy 4x4 wanabe..x2 wheel drive hairdressers/flight attendants car..
And then you look up at a real Range Rover as it wafts by... imagine that pain..
Keep it going, they are well worth it.
Dwarfer out.
 
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