Help - Not Starting!

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If it starts witha jump start, then you are looking at a cold, dead battery.

We've recently noticed that teh glow plugs weren't working on ours - apparently someone had got a relay all soaked in cold muddy water. Can;t think who that was.

Cheers

Blippie
 
Hi,

Update: 08/01/09 @ 06:48

The car wouldn't start - same again. After Land Rover Dealership taking over 100 GBP of my money, the bloody thing wouldn't start again.

Battery fully charged.

Can hear the starter motor still clicking.

After about 15/20 attempts in succession, it started.

The Land Rover Garage quoted me 600 GBP for new starter motor & fitting.


Is the Solenoid(sp?)/Starter motor affected in cold weather?

Thanks,

Mat
 
hbweb said:
Hi,

Update: 08/01/09 @ 06:48

The car wouldn't start - same again. After Land Rover Dealership taking over 100 GBP of my money, the bloody thing wouldn't start again.

Battery fully charged.

Can hear the starter motor still clicking.

After about 15/20 attempts in succession, it started.

The Land Rover Garage quoted me 600 GBP for new starter motor & fitting.


Is the Solenoid(sp?)/Starter motor affected in cold weather?

Thanks,

Mat
Click to expand...


I'm sorry to hear your money has been wasted on a bad diagnosis. I wasn't convinced the battery was the reason. If the battery voltage was so low that the starter solenoid could not pull in fully then there definately wouldn't be enough voltage to get the headlamps to light with any effectiveness.

A fully charged battery has a low source impedance so it can supply loads of current without an significant voltage reduction on the terminals. A flat battery has a high source impedance so any attempt to draw current causes the voltage to collapse at the terminals. Such a collapse must affect all electrical systems. The glow plug load would have shut down most of the other systems in the car for this reason.

I does sound to me that your symptoms are identical to mine and a strip down of the starter motor and the solenoid showed that the solenoid contacts had burnt down to the point that there was no contact pressure being achieved. Sometime it would work, other times it wouldn't. You can mess about with them but the fix will always be temporary.

Importantly the starter motor brushes had loads of life in them so if there is a kit to replace the solenoid contact components then I for one am interested in getting one. 600 quid soulds very excessive to me.

I wish you look with this.
 
Update on this. Had a look on E-bay and found the kit, which is exactly what is required, was £10. Bought one straight away. Definately the best move. Cheers for the tip Chaser.
 
UM. . . . .Dunt wanna be a smartie pants , but you Earthlings have to know that Doozles pull a big load starting un with the quick heat glow plugs they do kick in when cold if yer battery int tip top. . . . .then you will get the click click sound, the best way to check this is to start with jump leads from a running motor and if it runs. . . . . . .buy a new battery !!!!!!!yer tite gits:) :) :) :boink:
 
Darmain said:
True words Ming but if the switch don't close the current don't flow. Thats the problem we are having.
Click to expand...


But as Ming says, if yer battery is good, a jump won't make any difference & then you know for sure it's, starter motor, wiring or ignition switch.
 
my money is on the solenoid. Just had a new starter motor (£280) after 3 years of problems with exactly the same symptoms. Only affected me every 3 or 4 months or so, pretty regular intervals. I used to imagine the ring gradually worked its way round in this time. If I sat an pulsed it it always started eventually, sometime within a minute, but a couple of times 20 mins or so.
 
Sounds very like the starter. Mine did same and I fixed it for a lot less. Listen to clutchdust and you can do it much cheaper if you just clean up the contacts on the solenoid - I couldn't be arsed to remove and replace if the clean up didn't work so replaced it.

I got a brand new un from Island 4x4 -next day delivery. Took about two hours to do and most of that was trying to shift the rear bolt and then find the one i'd dropped - two bolts hold it in, space connector and a small nut at the front.

LR will do an exchange for £150 or get a brand new um from Island for £130. New one at LR is £250 - which means they must be costing about 3hrs for the job to get to £600 odd.

Savings over over £450 on the steeler - it really is an easy job.
 
Darmain said:
Update on this. Had a look on E-bay and found the kit, which is exactly what is required, was £10. Bought one straight away. Definately the best move. Cheers for the tip Chaser.
Click to expand...

After an email exchange with this chap to determine the engine of me Hippo I have now received the solenoid refurb kit. Exactly the parts I need. The Armature plus flying contact and the two fixed contacts. About 13 quids worth and it will fix the problem for sure. Job on for the weekend I feel. :D :D :D
 
I'd still agree with Ming... does it jump start? If it does then you need a new battery.

I have a 2000 X TD4 and same problem last winter. I came home from work (work van) and decided I wanted - for some bizarre reason - to manually control the fuel burning heater.

I removed NSF wheel and messed around with 12v feeds to the heater. Yeah! It worked. Getting cold - only driven at weekends. Original battery....radio on whilst working.

Got bored. replaced bits removed. Cup of tea. Move landy from workshop. CLICK on turning of key. No dimming of lights AKA usual check for power reaching starter.

Cue work van. Cue jump leads. Start up van - turn key in landy - fires up!

I thought I had just ran the charge down but after having the battery charged up it would not hold enough charge for more than a few hours.

Diesel starters require a massive ampage on cold start - wanna see the batteries x 2 on our trucks at work - they are not there for fun!

1 x new battery and not a problem since - apart from siezed front brake piston, leaking power steering rack, leaking rear diff driveshaft oil seals, busted OSR ABS sensor and now a noisy air con compressor.......joy!

:drum:
 
Final update.

Thanks so much for all your help + advice.

I thought I would write a reply on here, as everyone has been so great, and perhaps someone might find this useful in the future?

The garage guy didn't replace the starter motor, instead he took it out, and cleaned the contacts (at least I think that's what he said).

He replaced an oval ring (gold coloured) if that means anything to anyone?

I didn't understand Polish, but that's what he showed me.

Seems to be fine now, although the weather has improved to -4 (rather than the -20 it was) ... so it's difficult to compare.

Whole thing £240.00 approx. Bugger.

Anyways, thanks again.

Over and out.
 
Jeez, £240 for a for a copper solenoid ring........Wish I could get that sort of money!

The kit to do this job sells on ebay for around 5% of that price and is a piece of cake to replace.......Hope everyone who has this problem reads this thread and saves themselves loads of dosh.....
 
Hi Hbweb, Glad to hear you're sorted now. I've changed my solenoid contacts with the ones off E-bay and the problem is no more. Sounds like your man did something similar, even if it cost you for it.

Happy Freelandering,

Dave
 
hbweb said:
Final update.

Thanks so much for all your help + advice.

I thought I would write a reply on here, as everyone has been so great, and perhaps someone might find this useful in the future?

The garage guy didn't replace the starter motor, instead he took it out, and cleaned the contacts (at least I think that's what he said).

He replaced an oval ring (gold coloured) if that means anything to anyone?

I didn't understand Polish, but that's what he showed me.

Seems to be fine now, although the weather has improved to -4 (rather than the -20 it was) ... so it's difficult to compare.

Whole thing £240.00 approx. Bugger.

Anyways, thanks again.

Over and out.
Click to expand...

B*gger - wish I had read these threads earlier! In future use ECC at Babice (Land Rover - ECC BABICE - Autoryzowana stacja obs³ugi Land Rover) - they charged me 300zl (60ish quid) for a complete starter motor refurb inc. solenoid on my td4 a while back. As parts here are dearer, you can ship cheaper from Uk and they will fit as well - not a bad deal? I've used them for last three years and I would not hesitate to recommend them to anyone
 
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