Head gasket symptoms? Please help!

While I understand head gasket issues are rare on the L322 and symptoms can sometimes relate to thermostat or other issues, I'd be grateful if anyone could comment on the following problems on a particular car...

Temp gauge rises to 3/4 and drops back down to 1/2 intermittently when driving.

Oil on filler cap and dipstick is thick, clumpy and light mocca coloured. I am unsure if this is just condensation or because the car has not been used in one year or because the oil maybe six years old or because water is mixing with it in the engine.

Water seems to have no contamination and does not get used up. It does bubble over when the car is ran and warmed up with the cap off.

White smoke from exhaust but unsure if this is steam or just usual from a cold car that is started up and hasn't been driven in a year or started for a few weeks. Did seem to clear after a while.

I haven't done a sniff or compression test on the car as the owner doesn't want to spend anything on the issue and just wants rid of it due to buying a replacement. The car even needed to be jump started as it has not been used im so long. The dashboard displayed warning lights afterwards in the form of the traction control light, abs and something else. It also stated "air suspension inactive" on the display although the owner states this was usual for a car that hasn't had a battery connected and that after a short drive it resets itself and all becomes ok. Is this correct?

Sorry for all the questions. The car is just what I'm looking for otherwise, and is also priced accordingly for an expected head gasket issue. The radiator was replaced prior to any of the above symptoms but has been maintained well prior to then also. Very grateful for any advice as I am in two minds of paying twice the price for a car that has no problems or to take on a do-er-up-er and save a few grand.

Thanks again.

Personally I'd walk on it....

The Golden Rule:

Never, Ever buy a Range Rover with faults unless you understand and are prepared for the potential time, money and frustration involved in repairing it. A Range Rover in Fault will empty a healthy bank balance rapidly regardless.

It does sound suspect, does it run lumpy at all?? The V8 is a surprisingly spritely engine, with power coming on in drooves all through the rev band once beyond 1500rpm, there should be no dead spots or struggling until you get into the higher rpm range.

Mine when started from cold and the cap off, the coolant level rises due to thermal expansion, but if the level is set correctly, mine has not 'bubbled' over, but the level gets very close to the top at times.

'Mayonnaise' under the oil cap is not usually a good sign, and if it has been standing for a while, that could be explained, but is it a risk you are worth taking??

The BMW M62TUB44 is a complex engine with the VANOS system which needs to be set just so using special tooling to set up the timing once you come to take it off and on again.

The EAS and ABS/HDC etc faults are usually a result of low or zero battery and requires the steering sensor to be reset by turning lock to lock...but by the sounds of it, he hasn't lavished much love on it, so it could be something a bit more complex.

There are plenty out there and unless this one is being offered in the sub £3k range for a 2002-5 or sub £4k or so for a 2006 facelift with a knackered engine and you have a couple of thousand left over for the repair...walk away.

The Golden Rule is stated for a reason, they are a champagne car and can't be run on orange juice money....even if you can get them for a song.

Whatever you buy, budget for your diagnostic gear too as this will save a fortune at a dealer.

Complex cars - heed caution.

saint.v8 said:

personally i'd walk on it....

The golden rule:

Never, ever buy a range rover with faults unless you understand and are prepared for the potential time, money and frustration involved in repairing it. A range rover in fault will empty a healthy bank balance rapidly regardless.

It does sound suspect, does it run lumpy at all?? The v8 is a surprisingly spritely engine, with power coming on in drooves all through the rev band once beyond 1500rpm, there should be no dead spots or struggling until you get into the higher rpm range.

Mine when started from cold and the cap off, the coolant level rises due to thermal expansion, but if the level is set correctly, mine has not 'bubbled' over, but the level gets very close to the top at times.

'mayonnaise' under the oil cap is not usually a good sign, and if it has been standing for a while, that could be explained, but is it a risk you are worth taking??

The bmw m62tub44 is a complex engine with the vanos system which needs to be set just so using special tooling to set up the timing once you come to take it off and on again.

The eas and abs/hdc etc faults are usually a result of low or zero battery and requires the steering sensor to be reset by turning lock to lock...but by the sounds of it, he hasn't lavished much love on it, so it could be something a bit more complex.

There are plenty out there and unless this one is being offered in the sub £3k range for a 2002-5 or sub £4k or so for a 2006 facelift with a knackered engine and you have a couple of thousand left over for the repair...walk away.

The golden rule is stated for a reason, they are a champagne car and can't be run on orange juice money....even if you can get them for a song.

Whatever you buy, budget for your diagnostic gear too as this will save a fortune at a dealer.

Complex cars - heed caution.

Click to expand...

+1

+2 infact I wouldn't walk id sprint

Thanks guys. I know it sounds like I'm crazy but I am prepared for the time, frustration and costs as long as it makes sense financially. I have a long checklist and the engine trouble on this one is the only thing stopping going for. It's black with cream interior, lpg system fitted, sub 100k mileage, in good condition and can probably get it for £4500. In comparison all others I've seen with these specs are advertised at 9k with a probably take home price of 8k. £3500 is a decent amount if cash to fix things with probably over 1k in my pocket left even if there's more than a head gasket issue. I appreciate your honesty as its a dilema for me at the moment!

The v8 sounded very smooth without any lumps. The coolant issue sounds like yours where it overflowed (bubbled over) rather than popped or shot out or anything but yes the brown mayo and the exhaust smoke rings alarm bells. The temperature fluxuation which caused the owner to believe it was a head gasket issue sounded very similar to your thermostat issue so I was tempted to buy it expecting to fix the head and hoped it was an easier fix. I'm glad to hear the eac and abs stuff is expected too but it just has me thinking like the owner says that its a genuine car just lacking tlc and a possible gasket issue.

Be grateful for what you think and also if I should be checking for one anywhere apart from autotrader, ebay and gumtree as the prices you mention don't seem to bring anything back even with the sky high mileage ones. Thanks again.

Ahhhh, you now say brown mayo and not mocca....(difference I hear people ask!!)

If it is brown sludge, it could be just poorly maintained and well over due for an oil change and flush....

Water in oil is a much lighter colour....

HEAD GASKET....


POOR MAINTENANCE....


That said, a sniff test or compression check is a good test if you are being asked to shell out £4.5K.....just cos it ain't that bad yet doesn't mean it is OK....

Give it a long run at varying road types and then go back and check the cap again....it *may* just be condensation

has it had any gearbox services ? or recon ? 100,000 your pushing your luck & will be costly,i say again buy cheap buy twice,seller could be more clued up than you realise,a recon box £2000 & as much as £3000 for engine

Thanks again. I can't see the picture of the poor maintenance sludge unfortunately. Can you repost it please? It won't show on either my laptop or phone. I would say the sludge was darker than the examples of the head gasket. On the filler cap I just thought it was condensation but I was then surprised to see the same stuff on the dipstick which I thought would be free of any condensation problems.

I would normally insist on a compression test but the seller doesn't want to know as he just wants rid. It is priced to sell with the suspected head gasket issue and if I push him to check it out too much and he can confirm the gasket is all ok, I can see him putting the price up quite a bit. Strange situation I know.

As for the gearbox, despite it having plenty of main dealwr history, nothing mentions the gearbox specifically. I should give the dealer a ring tomorrow for more info. The gear changes were smooth with no apparent problems though. Is it the general consensus that the gearbox will fail and therefore needs to be replaced before 100k or is just something that is admirable?

Any Better....??

KILOCHARLIE said:

Thanks again. I can't see the picture of the poor maintenance sludge unfortunately. Can you repost it please? It won't show on either my laptop or phone. I would say the sludge was darker than the examples of the head gasket. On the filler cap I just thought it was condensation but I was then surprised to see the same stuff on the dipstick which I thought would be free of any condensation problems.

I would normally insist on a compression test but the seller doesn't want to know as he just wants rid. It is priced to sell with the suspected head gasket issue and if I push him to check it out too much and he can confirm the gasket is all ok, I can see him putting the price up quite a bit. Strange situation I know.

As for the gearbox, despite it having plenty of main dealwr history, nothing mentions the gearbox specifically. I should give the dealer a ring tomorrow for more info. The gear changes were smooth with no apparent problems though. Is it the general consensus that the gearbox will fail and therefore needs to be replaced before 100k or is just something that is admirable?

Click to expand...

The dealer won't service the box as the considered it back in the days a sFilled For Life (everyone starts Laughing now)

They are a real weak point, eps. on the Diesels.

The main fault on the Petrol box is the O ring between a & B Clutch packs and the Needle Roller Bearing that seperates B and C Clutch Drums....the roller bearing fails allowing the clutch drum to move about on the shaft, this wears away the O ring underneath which splits and results in loss of hydraulic pressure to the A clutch.

As the A clutch is used in all gears bar 5th, the box trys to select all the different gears until it then bangs into 5th and you get Transmission Fault on the display.

The next fault is very weak friction material on the Torque Convertor Lock Up Clutch, causing a vibration at light Acceleration at between 40-50, most noticeable on a slight gradiant. Feels like a cattle grid effect.

The only solution is to replace the TQ and also the O Ring and Bearing....£££ look for a thread by Jolidaychicken, he has just DIY'd his repair!

Thanks Saint, you're a err.. Saint!
Can see it fine now but to confuse matters further I'd say its lighter than that yet darker than the head gasket pics. Probably slightly more towards a head gasket I'd say.

Will a head gasket issue throw any standard odb codes? I have one on my phone so I could check it if I go back to see the car again.

Will a head gasket issue throw any standard odb codes? I have one on my phone so I could check it if I go back to see the car again.[/quote]

not usually & you will need decent diagnostic equipment on a l322

L322 won't talk to a generic OBD scanner...you may get some of the generic codes, but not the LR specific ones (by Generic I mean the Emissions related ones)

The only one that may flag up with a Head Gasket fault is a misfire or knock sensor code possibly but also maybe not depends on if the ECU detects vibration or unburnt fual etc.

If it s darker, but not full on cheese, it may just be condensation - take it for a long run and see if it clears out....

You can get cheaper coolant testing kits from autofactors or even from the bay of E's to check the coolant for traces of hydrocarbons.

SMell the coolant too, if it smells of exhaust - that could be a sign.

I know you said you have some money left over if you buy this car, but budget £2.5-4K for a garage to repair it, less for you to do it, but beware of the complexity of this engine.

Get hold of RAVE from

pdf Land Rover Manuals | Landroverweb.com

or

Land Rover Workshop Manuals - Free Online

or

http://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Manuals/Workshop Manual L322 Range Rover.pdf

or

land rover service factory manual RAVE download land rover resource, service manual, workshop factory manual, download, rave, vehicles including discovery, series, defender, range rover, freelander, LR3, Handbooks, Catalog, Catalogue, Land Rover Inte