Frozen Diesel

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TAKdriver

TAKdriver

Active Member
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Beside a field in Midlothian
Hi Peeps:attention:
Just a suggestion for our southern neighbours who find an inch or two of snow distressing.
Take any old lamp holder ( every household has at least six.)Preferably with the usual metal frame for the lampshade . Drill hole in large ( Christmas size biscuit tin.) cable through : holder in biscuit tin > put under tank. Added advantage of being able to see tank in the dark when yer doing it.
Stay warm .

PS I should of course have added that y' put a 100 watt bulb in it.............
 
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I used to add paraffin to my truck in the 70's / 80's when it was very cold. Never had any problems of diesel freezing etc. Slept in the cab in -20 one night at Greenock (Scotland) with no cab heater, propper drivers us not like these modern men with night heaters:D
I put 4 gallons of paraffin to 75 gallons of diesel and that stopped the fuel freezing in the lines and filter on nights when lots of trucks were parked at the roadside with frozen fuel due to the wind chill at speed.
 
They put additives in nowadays (just for us southerners) so it wont freeze up, so no need for all that northern witchcraft these days :)
 
Dopey said:
They put additives in nowadays (just for us southerners) so it wont freeze up, so no need for all that northern witchcraft these days :)
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It will still go to jelly if it's very cold and you're motoring along on the motorway. Wind chill and all that.
 
Sorry guys, wind chill only applies to living beings, not inanaimate objects like a fuel tank/line. They just get the actual temp. So for problems to occur the temp has to actually drop to whatever temp diesel starts to freeze.

We Paddy's and you Scots will be well aware of this effect where +5 with a wind from the North West can feel a hell of a lot colder than -4 on a calm day but you don't get a single bit of ice on the +5 day.
 
SpudH said:
Sorry guys, wind chill only applies to living beings, not inanaimate objects like a fuel tank/line. They just get the actual temp. So for problems to occur the temp has to actually drop to whatever temp diesel starts to freeze.
.
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Sorry to disagree but a diesel filter in the cold airflow will turn the diesel to jelly whilst it will not be a problem when stationary.
We used to wrap the filters in rags as a desperate measure to get home, some truck manufacturers placed the filter behind the engine to prevent problems. Wind chill it may not be but stick your hand out of the window at sixty miles an hour and you will get frostbite this weather.:)
 
landowner said:
Sorry to disagree but a diesel filter in the cold airflow will turn the diesel to jelly whilst it will not be a problem when stationary.
We used to wrap the filters in rags as a desperate measure to get home, some truck manufacturers placed the filter behind the engine to prevent problems. Wind chill it may not be but stick your hand out of the window at sixty miles an hour and you will get frostbite this weather.:)
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Thats cause it's in a constant flow of air thats at the freezing temp for diesel that doesn't get warmed by the engine under the hood as it would if it were stationary.
As for sticking your hand out the window, thats a hand with a water content, hence the very real effect of wind chill. Do the same with a thermometer and it won't change.
 
Its funny, I remember reading that during WW2 the diesel fueled Russian T34's had far fewer problems due to frozen fuel than the petrol powered German tanks.
 
landowner said:
I used to add paraffin to my truck in the 70's / 80's when it was very cold. Never had any problems of diesel freezing etc. Slept in the cab in -20 one night at Greenock (Scotland) with no cab heater, propper drivers us not like these modern men with night heaters:D
I put 4 gallons of paraffin to 75 gallons of diesel and that stopped the fuel freezing in the lines and filter on nights when lots of trucks were parked at the roadside with frozen fuel due to the wind chill at speed.
Click to expand...

it was in the 70's that i slept in my cab in port greenock docks,when i woke up frozen in the morning and the pint of milk i bought had frozen solid.now my brother who is older than me and still driving has got bunks,cab heaters,cookers the bloody lot,he doesn't even have to change gear himself if he doesn't want to.ffs.:mad::p:p;)
 
Wind chill will affect inanimate objects.

It works the same as a fridge/freezer the cold wind is removing heat energy from the object it is interacting with. In the same way you can chill beer quite effectively in a little stream.

Also would a litre of vodka not do the trick? :p
 
SpudH said:
Its funny, I remember reading that during WW2 the diesel fueled Russian T34's had far fewer problems due to frozen fuel than the petrol powered German tanks.
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If it was the same thing I saw they were wrong in the way they sumerised, the difference was in two areas, one: the russians could light a fire under the diesel fuel tank to warm it and the engine oil before starting without much fear (at those temperatures) of setting it all on fire but with the german petrol engines tanks the couldnt because it would set the petrol and the tank on fire with the lower flash point.

Two the russians knowing the winters well left plenty of clearance in all there maching of all parts to allow for cold contraction of metals and also hard packed snow and ice, and also all there oils and greases (for example in recoil mechanisms) were designed to operate at crazy low tomperatures wheras the german stuff froze solid!

Yes I am a Tank nerd sorry lol :D
 
Equium Duo said:
Wind chill will affect inanimate objects.

It works the same as a fridge/freezer the cold wind is removing heat energy from the object it is interacting with. In the same way you can chill beer quite effectively in a little stream.

Also would a litre of vodka not do the trick? :p
Click to expand...

Ok, I know I'm being pedantic, but here goes, the term 'wind chill factor' applies to the apparent temperature felt by someone (or any other living thing) due to the effect of wind. Wind chill makes a -5deg temp feel like, say, -10deg. So while its true that wind will cool an inanimate object quicker than still air it will never take it below the actual ambient air temp.

So wind will chill inanimate objects like a diesel filter but it will never get colder than the air temperature as opposed to the poor sod under the bonnet trying to bleed the filter who very much feels like it's -40deg.:p
 
SpudH said:
Ok, I know I'm being pedantic, but here goes, the term 'wind chill factor' applies to the apparent temperature felt by someone (or any other living thing) due to the effect of wind. Wind chill makes a -5deg temp feel like, say, -10deg. So while its true that wind will cool an inanimate object quicker than still air it will never take it below the actual ambient air temp.

So wind will chill inanimate objects like a diesel filter but it will never get colder than the air temperature as opposed to the poor sod under the bonnet trying to bleed the filter who very much feels like it's -40deg.:p
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Why then did the trucks filters gell up when driven at 60/65 mph and not gell up when driven at 50 mph. This is an instance during a very cold winter 30 years ago. It could be that at the slower engine speeds there was more warmed fuel being returned to the tanks, or that at the lower road speeds more engine heat was being retained under the bonnet.
anyways, I am going to try the thermometer out of the window at speed test and if my hand dosen't drop off I'll report back.:D
(btw. remember that the trucks thirty years ago were not governed to 56mph and up untill the end of the eighties truck motorway speeds were anything up to 80 mph and I once drove one that topped out at 103 mph calibrated)
 
When I use to ride my bike to work, i wondered re this wind chill thing.. so I put a temp gauge front of bike so it gets the full benifit of me riding at mach1, and getting max wind directly on the sensor..... the lowest reading was the same as the bikes own built in temp senser fitted in bikes fairing..... only i felt the cold re the windchill.... proven theory.....
 
landowner said:
Why then did the trucks filters gell up when driven at 60/65 mph and not gell up when driven at 50 mph. This is an instance during a very cold winter 30 years ago. It could be that at the slower engine speeds there was more warmed fuel being returned to the tanks, or that at the lower road speeds more engine heat was being retained under the bonnet.
anyways, I am going to try the thermometer out of the window at speed test and if my hand dosen't drop off I'll report back.:D
(btw. remember that the trucks thirty years ago were not governed to 56mph and up untill the end of the eighties truck motorway speeds were anything up to 80 mph and I once drove one that topped out at 103 mph calibrated)
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I don't really know much about trucks, but are the filters anywhere near the engine? Because at stationary, the air around the engine and filters would be allowed to sit still and soak up some residual heat from the engine. However, as soon as you start moving, the warm air is inevitably going to be blown through too quickly for it to warm up the filters, and thus you'll get your jellied diesel. Though, that all depends on whether the filters are near to a heat source.

The same thing happens in my 110 with no heaters - when I'm sat still for a while with a few mates in the car, the cab warms up quite nicely - but as soon as we start moving, the huge amount of drafts inevitably wash all the warm air out of the back of the vehicle. :D :D
 
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Equium Duo said:
Wind chill will affect inanimate objects.

It works the same as a fridge/freezer the cold wind is removing heat energy from the object it is interacting with. In the same way you can chill beer quite effectively in a little stream.

Also would a litre of vodka not do the trick? :p
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Load of arse, if I may say so.

Chilling beer in a little stream can only cool the beer down to the temperature of the water.

Don't confuse windchill with fridges, because that is a completely different bit of physics.

For the last word on this see Wind chill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Well,
Did the thermometer out of the window test at 30 mph today. Went back for it and it had broken when it hit the road. Failed test....:doh:

Going to get a more robust thermometer and try again soon:D
 
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