Fan Mod

tomcatrr · Jul 24, 2013

The info is diesel only.

Datatek said:
A Kenlowe 16" fan produces less airflow than the aircon fans.

Really?
You need airflow near the water radiator, no 10 ou 15 cm away.
Remember also you have an intercooler.

Until 20C, the kenlowe don´t work at all (don´t need the fan)
20-25C the fan kick in the lower speed and sometimes in high.
25-30C the fan kick high more time
past 30C almost on all times, low and high speed.
The tsat had this range of temp:
Low: 88-83 high 92-87 installed in the exit hose of the radiator.

Datatek said:
I've had no problem at 30C and the electric fans are more efficient than the viscous in crawling traffic, the viscous depends on engine revs.

Datatek, here we go again.

Yes, your right, the e fan are more efficient then a viscous, give more HP, more mpg, sound better... when they can deliver the same CFM or more, of the original viscous.

Remember with a viscous fan, you have all the time a airflow "cooling", and not a stage "on or off".
(in my case and all the DSE I checked, the viscous is pulling air and is not engage).

My DSE with 40ºC, AC on stuck in Porto traffic, the temp stay little below 12H00.
For what you say, your car with only the AC fan will not overheat?

Guys, I live in a hot country.
The datatek mod is ok for:
1. Backup fan like the My99 or M00 had.
2. viscous alternative until 20/25 (30C datatek report it´s ok).

Guys, some users here, who try to mess with running only with AC fan, and kenlowe with wrong tsat or setup ended with cracked head, and the temp don´t reach 25C.
One also reported, " my RR temp. was at 12H00, but the temp. with nanocom was about 98C"

, so like is petrol brother, we can not "trust" the t gauge.

It´s my 2 cent or 2 pennies.

tomcatrr · Jul 24, 2013

TCubed said:
I've wondered about this for a while; is there a case for engines revving at a standstill being more effective at cooling due to the faster fan, despite the increased heat production?

Is not the faster fan, but the cooling effect cames from the water pump

Datatek · Jul 24, 2013

tomcatrr said:
The info is diesel only.

Really?
You need airflow near the water radiator, no 10 ou 15 cm away.
Remember also you have an intercooler.

Until 20C, the kenlowe don´t work at all (don´t need the fan)
20-25C the fan kick in the lower speed and sometimes in high.
25-30C the fan kick high more time
past 30C almost on all times, low and high speed.
The tsat had this range of temp:
Low: 88-83 high 92-87 installed in the exit hose of the radiator.

Datatek, here we go again.

Yes, your right, the e fan are more efficient then a viscous, give more HP, more mpg, sound better... when they can deliver the same CFM or more, of the original viscous.

Remember with a viscous fan, you have all the time a airflow "cooling", and not a stage "on or off".
(in my case and all the DSE I checked, the viscous is pulling air and is not engage).

My DSE with 40ºC, AC on stuck in Porto traffic, the temp stay little below 12H00.
For what you say, your car with only the AC fan will not overheat?

Guys, I live in a hot country.
The datatek mod is ok for:
1. Backup fan like the My99 or M00 had.
2. viscous alternative until 20/25 (30C datatek report it´s ok).

Guys, some users here, who try to mess with running only with AC fan, and kenlowe with wrong tsat or setup ended with cracked head, and the temp don´t reach 25C.
One also reported, " my RR temp. was at 12H00, but the temp. with nanocom was about 98C", so like is petrol brother, we can not "trust" the t gauge.

It´s my 2 cent or 2 pennies.

90/95C is a normal running temperature, stat is not fully open until 85C. The airflow passes throgh the condensor, intercooler and oil cooler whether pulled through by the viscous or pushed through by the elecric fans, it does not have a choice.

StuckAgainSteve · Jul 24, 2013

Electric fans are a boon in stop/start traffic - particilarly when towing - where you won't be revving enough to make full use of the engine-driven fan.
For what it's worth, try opening the bonnet of a running p38 v8 on a hot day. The underbonnet heat is staggering. I've had more cars than I care to remember. Nothing produced anything like the heat of my p38.

I'd have much more faith in the factory-installed aircon fans over a bodged-on kenlowe.

tomcatrr · Jul 24, 2013

Datatek said:
90/95C is a normal running temperature, stat is not fully open until 85C.

just for info, I guy bought recently a new original BMW sat, he start to open before 80 and also had a bigger inside diameter.
The RR now runs, a little below 12H00, about +- 11H00.....

Datatek said:
The airflow passes throgh the condensor, intercooler and oil cooler whether pulled through by the viscous or pushed through by the elecric fans, it does not have a choice.

Your right, but the puller fan with shroud is about 30% more efficient then a pusher

.

And what about the AC fan mod and a kenlowe, spal scrapyard fan mod?
The alternator don´t have the capacity for all, and so the fans will loose speed, and efficient.

Since we are talking about FAN MOD take a look:http://home.comcast.net/~smithmonte/Auto/MarkVIII_Fan.htm

Note:Will not fit in the Diesel, without customize

@StuckAgainSteve, even this beast (mark VIII) can not cool the V8 in the 30C.

TCubed · Jul 24, 2013

tomcatrr said:
just for info, I guy bought recently a new original BMW sat, he start to open before 80 and also had a bigger inside diameter.
The RR now runs, a little below 12H00, about +- 11H00.....

Your right, but the puller fan with shroud is about 30% more efficient then a pusher.

And what about the AC fan mod and a kenlowe, spal scrapyard fan mod?
The alternator don´t have the capacity for all, and so the fans will loose speed, and efficient.

Since we are talking about FAN MOD take a look:http://home.comcast.net/~smithmonte/Auto/MarkVIII_Fan.htm

Note:Will not fit in the Diesel, without customize

@StuckAgainSteve, even this beast (mark VIII) can not cool the V8 in the 30C.

In fairness Data does say that the mod is a fix for diesel, but a support for V8s.

I reckon, if you have a later model with the massive 150A alternator, that it would have enough to keep it all running..

Datatek · Jul 24, 2013

tomcatrr said:
just for info, I guy bought recently a new original BMW sat, he start to open before 80 and also had a bigger inside diameter.
The RR now runs, a little below 12H00, about +- 11H00.....

Your right, but the puller fan with shroud is about 30% more efficient then a pusher.

And what about the AC fan mod and a kenlowe, spal scrapyard fan mod?
The alternator don´t have the capacity for all, and so the fans will loose speed, and efficient.

Since we are talking about FAN MOD take a look:http://home.comcast.net/~smithmonte/Auto/MarkVIII_Fan.htm

Note:Will not fit in the Diesel, without customize

@StuckAgainSteve, even this beast (mark VIII) can not cool the V8 in the 30C.

Bull****, the aircon fans are fully shrouded and if you remove the viscous shroud there is a much greater surface area for the the air to flow through. Kenlowe is a waste of time and cash.

tomcatrr · Jul 25, 2013

TCubed said:
In fairness Data does say that the mod is a fix for diesel, but a support for V8s.

TCubed, first I never "disagree" with Datatek mod (I have one variant of this mod

).

The info that I have (it can be wrong), it´s that diesel (my99 or 00) had a upgrade to kick the AC fan, past 100C.
Petrol engine, already had that, since first models.

I just give a "free warning" that is mod, is not bullet proof past 25C or/and towing, tested with several cracked heads in here.

So, I can not agree with the statement that is mod is a fix for Diesel (I understand a "fix" removing the viscous).
Yes, it´s a fix but under xy outside temperature.
Remember guys, why in hell LR put a viscous fan, if the AC fan could do the job.....

This a Fan mod thread, everyone that came to this thread, should know and be advice, the pros and cons of the Data mod (for example); Kenlowe, Spal; flex a Lite, or junkyard fan etc....

Datatek · Jul 25, 2013

tomcatrr said:
TCubed, first I never "disagree" with Datatek mod (I have one variant of this mod).

The info that I have (it can be wrong), it´s that diesel (my99 or 00) had a upgrade to kick the AC fan, past 100C.
Petrol engine, already had that, since first models.

I just give a "free warning" that is mod, is not bullet proof past 25C or/and towing, tested with several cracked heads in here.

So, I can not agree with the statement that is mod is a fix for Diesel (I understand a "fix" removing the viscous).
Yes, it´s a fix but under xy outside temperature.
Remember guys, why in hell LR put a viscous fan, if the AC fan could do the job.....

This a Fan mod thread, everyone that came to this thread, should know and be advice, the pros and cons of the Data mod (for example); Kenlowe, Spal; flex a Lite, or junkyard fan etc....

110C I believe switched by the sensor at the end of the head near the bulkhead, this is when an overheat has already occurred.
On the V8 the fans are brought on by the engine ECU also when an overheat has already occurred.

I have never claimed this is a "fix" In fact I always stress that the mod should only be applied to a car where the engine and cooling system is working correctly. What I have said is that the fans produce sufficient airflow to replace the viscous on the diesel and that the viscous cowl should also be removed if the viscous fan is removed to improve airflow.
Twenty or more people have installed this mod and to date I have not had one report of a problem.

Why did LR use a viscous? Old habits die hard and the car has to be able to function in extremes of temperature, in Europe, the standard electrics suffice on the diesel but not on the V8, and maybe they would not in parts of America which has always been the focus of Land Rover design, a large additional electric fan such as is installed on the L322 for the condensor would still have been a better option IMO even on the V8.
Electric is always better in slow moving traffic as full cooling can be produced if needed regardless of engine revs or vehicle speed.

tomcatrr · Jul 25, 2013

The temp sensor is 100C, STC2254 (diesel only).

Datatek, if you and 20 more people have your mod and running fine, i believe.

I have a E Tsat(88-83C), auxiliary temp gauge (+- calibrated).
With 28C, AC on, traffic, my aux gauge start to pass 100C!!!
Only cooled it down, putting the heater at max and of course with engine running at +- 2000 rpm, to make the water pump do her job.

(I hope thar head cracked bill will not come)

With viscous fan, 40ºC, AC on, traffic stays at +- 95C, but cools down very "fast", since I get a open road.

1 week difference between this 2 situations.

So datatek, sorry but your MOD, viscous fan alternative did not work for me, and also others who finish with a head cracked, if the outside temp go up!

tomcatrr · Jul 25, 2013

Datatek said:
....
Electric is always better in slow moving traffic as full cooling can be produced if needed regardless of engine revs or vehicle speed.

Datatek, I spend a lot of time in the web, to put a good efan in my P38A.
Go to the USA, Australian forums, off road, hot rod, trucks .....

I came to some conclusion:
The CFM (airflow) of a Vfan is better than an electric. PERIOD
A engine fan is better: heavy towing with low speed, or outside temp usually high, above 30C.

Electric fan: they are better in traffic (AC works better, if the car don´t have a dedicated fan), low revs conditions like off road, and a cold temp, also make more mpg....

You need to "mix" all this information, and see what you want/better.

Datatek · Jul 25, 2013

tomcatrr said:
Datatek, I spend a lot of time in the web, to put a good efan in my P38A.
Go to the USA, Australian forums, off road, hot rod, trucks .....

I came to some conclusion:
The CFM (airflow) of a Vfan is better than an electric. PERIOD
A engine fan is better: heavy towing with low speed, or outside temp usually high, above 30C.

Electric fan: they are better in traffic (AC works better, if the car don´t have a dedicated fan), low revs conditions like off road, and a cold temp, also make more mpg....

You need to "mix" all this information, and see what you want/better.

Have you put an airflow meter on the fans or found the specifications or are you just guessing.
At anything above 30mph/50kph ram air provides enough cooling without the fans unless it's very hot.
Either way I'm not bothered, I have done this type of mod on many cars over the years without problems, what you choose to do is your busines but I think you are just quoting other peoples problems without knowing the real causes.

tomcatrr · Jul 25, 2013

Sorry datatek, are my English so bad???

Who you are a person, that don´t accept that he can be wrong, or in this case, a working solution for you can not work for others??

I just make a warning, with air temperature about 30C, your mod can fail, nothing more.

Datatek said:
....but I think you are just quoting other peoples problems without knowing the real causes.

Since you call me almost a liar, this fan Mod thread is for UK only, goodbye.

tomcatrr said:
I have a E Tsat(88-83C), auxiliary temp gauge (+- calibrated).
With 28C, AC on, traffic, my aux gauge start to pass 100C!!!
Only cooled it down, putting the heater at max and of course with engine running at +- 2000 rpm, to make the water pump do her job.
(I hope thar head cracked bill will not come)

With viscous fan, 40ºC, AC on, traffic stays at +- 95C, but cools down very "fast", since I get a open road.

1 week difference between this 2 situations.

Datatek · Jul 25, 2013

tomcatrr said:
Sorry datatek, are my English so bad???

Who you are a person, that don´t accept that he can be wrong, or in this case, a working solution for you can not work for others??

I just make a warning, with air temperature about 30C, your mod can fail, nothing more.

Since you call me almost a liar, this fan Mod thread is for UK only, goodbye.

If I'm wrong, I admit it. There is plenty of evidence to support my position, I have seen nothing to support yours apart from your vague quotes about other forums and your problems with your vehicle.
Scaremongering an the basis of a personal opinion is not helpfull.

merlinpjl · Jul 26, 2013

As I posted the original question, here is the position for me.

I did the mod on Monday.

My radiator, water pump, thermostat, hoses, engine block, crankshaft, pistons, camshaft, oil pump etc... are all new.

Over the last three days I have towed my large twin axle caravan across France with temperatures reaching 35 degrees C.

I am sure that the engine would have been fine, but the added cooling provided by Datatek's inexpensive mod has ensured that I didn't have any cooling problems.

My journey was 890 miles from home, there were a large number of long steep hills on the way and the temperature gauge stayed rock solid in the middle.

Datatek - thanks for the advice, I'm very glad that I took it.

gfromleeds · Jul 27, 2013

When i towed my twin axle caravan mine started overheating on the moterway
Turns out the viscouse was fu@ked i did the ac fan mod to get home and was so much better...
Untill about 2miles from home theres a steep hill and she over heated!
so no its not as good as a working viscouse fan but its dam close and under normal driving its been fine since
But that said i left the cowl and knackerd fan on so dont know if that makes much differance

Datatek · Jul 27, 2013

gfromleeds said:
When i towed my twin axle caravan mine started overheating on the moterway
Turns out the viscouse was fu@ked i did the ac fan mod to get home and was so much better...
Untill about 2miles from home theres a steep hill and she over heated!
so no its not as good as a working viscouse fan but its dam close and under normal driving its been fine since
But that said i left the cowl and knackerd fan on so dont know if that makes much differance

The cowl and the knackered fan will cause a significant obstruction to the airflow.

merlinpjl · Aug 18, 2013

Final update on this one!

I returned home from 4 weeks in a very warm France having towed my large, heavy twin axle caravan for just over 2200 miles.

As I said earlier in the post, everything on the engine is fine and mainly new, so there shouldn't have been an issue.

But I wanted to protect the engine from getting too hot on the long steep hills pulling all the weight.

On one day I did 350 miles and the outside air temperature reached 37 degrees at times.

The temperature gauge did not move at all from it's normal operating position.

I am convinced that without this mod I would have seen some rise in temperature.

Thanks Datatek for an excellent mod.

I would like to stress again, that this mod is not there to mask a problem it is there to aid cooling in a good working system.

wammers · Aug 18, 2013

merlinpjl said:
Final update on this one!

I returned home from 4 weeks in a very warm France having towed my large, heavy twin axle caravan for just over 2200 miles.

As I said earlier in the post, everything on the engine is fine and mainly new, so there shouldn't have been an issue.

But I wanted to protect the engine from getting too hot on the long steep hills pulling all the weight.

On one day I did 350 miles and the outside air temperature reached 37 degrees at times.

The temperature gauge did not move at all from it's normal operating position.

I am convinced that without this mod I would have seen some rise in temperature.

Thanks Datatek for an excellent mod.

I would like to stress again, that this mod is not there to mask a problem it is there to aid cooling in a good working system.

Excellent result. But technically the 4.6 should not need the mod as using the aircon fans to aid cooling is already incorporated as standard into your model of car. Albeit that the fans are tripped at a slightly higher temp.

Datatek · Aug 18, 2013

wammers said:
Excellent result. But technically the 4.6 should not need the mod as using the aircon fans to aid cooling is already incorporated as standard into your model of car. Albeit that the fans are tripped at a slightly higher temp.

Actually they are only tripped on an overheat Tony.

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