egr

Zippy said:

Whilst i can see the enviromentalists theory for leaving the EGR valve in place, try disconnecting it and see how your car runs.

I have disconnected the one on my wifes TD4 for the last 12 months and it has ran much better with it blocked off than connected, even she noticed the car 'Felt' better after i had done it and she is one of them women who puts the key in and expects it to start.

The car even ran lower emmissions on its MOT with it disconnected it also passed with it un-blocked but with a higher reading but in my case it stays blocked off.

Zippy

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If your wifes car goes better with the egr disconnected, then there is something wrong with it, please do not encourage people to modifiy cars when you are only using a single car as an example without understanding how it is supposed to work or ensuring that it was working properly in the first place.I am not a raving greeny or a fan of manufacturers, but I do have the equipment to test and monitor egr systems in real time and if its working properly you would not notice any difference.

Do a search on EGR valves and see how many users on the whole of this board disconnect them and have no problems what so ever.

Most report smoother running and less cr#p in the induction system as a whole.

I havent seen this just done this to my wifes car either,i have 3 friends all the the TD4 and TD5 engines all in Landys who have all disconnected the valve and again have had no problems, so i can say with confidance that i'm not just reporting about a single engine here.

In my experiance the cars i have seen and also read about all report much better results with the EGR valve disconnected.

In a brand new engine then i agree with you that you shouldnt notice a difference but after 20,000 miles the build up of deposits in the induction caused by the EGR valve is significant enough to reduce the performance, i have cleaned a full induction system after a TD4 has done 40,000 miles and it wasnt nice, afterwards the owner left the EGR valve shut off and after an additional 9,000 miles there wasnt a sign of any build up any oil residue at all in any of the system.

So again in my experiance the engine ran better and had less build up of sludge in its induction system.

Just an idea of me, so just worth the 'paper' its written on, but when does an engine heat up the most ? I think in high revs ?? and when is the EGR valve opened and operational ?? (in some mid-range field I think ? so what's the benefit of the EGR in keeping the temp. down if it only works when the engine is under low effort ?).

Disconnecting the Egr will not cause your car any problems, I didnt suggest it did.So what if there is crap in the inlet manifold - what you ought to worry about is the crap coming out of your exhaust.Or are you a fan of acid rain ?
I'm also well aware of the amount of people who disconnect their Egr and dribble on about how much better it goes etc,shame they dont spend more time learning about how their car is supposed to work.Just cos loads of people do it,it does not mean its right.
I had a vehicle in this week,that was knocking like hell and black smoking badly.A local garage had disconnected the egr to "stop it smoking" - Made no difference at all,all that is wrong with it is that No 4 injector is sticking.On monday a new set of nozzles will arrive and be fitted,the egr will get re-connected and it will be fine.
My point is that diesel engines are not yet rocket science, so why are they ****ed about with by people who ought to know better ?

I agree mate, what most people seem to be after these days is a "quick fix" nobody want's to find out where or why all this c--p is in the system in the first place. As you quite rightly said, properly set up injectors and another very important thing the oil being used and it's correct level, are major factors in clean running. Dont scrimp on oil quality, you wouldn't chuck cheapo larger down your neck I bet!!

eightinavee said:

Disconnecting the Egr will not cause your car any problems, I didnt suggest it did.So what if there is crap in the inlet manifold - what you ought to worry about is the crap coming out of your exhaust.Or are you a fan of acid rain ?
I'm also well aware of the amount of people who disconnect their Egr and dribble on about how much better it goes etc,shame they dont spend more time learning about how their car is supposed to work.Just cos loads of people do it,it does not mean its right.
I had a vehicle in this week,that was knocking like hell and black smoking badly.A local garage had disconnected the egr to "stop it smoking" - Made no difference at all,all that is wrong with it is that No 4 injector is sticking.On monday a new set of nozzles will arrive and be fitted,the egr will get re-connected and it will be fine.
My point is that diesel engines are not yet rocket science, so why are they ****ed about with by people who ought to know better ?

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Not yourself but other users posting have impied it would cause a problem and can i also ask who is dribbling on here ?

If you want to harp on about acid rain then go get your soap box and shout out loud about it but others shouldnt try and say the cr#p in the inlet side of the engine isnt a problem, only what comes out of the exhaust.

When somebody's engine isnt performing correctly as in down on power due to the said cr#p in the inlet they tend to put their foot down even more to compensate for the lack or power, hence they use more diesel and create more of the dreaded toxins that will pass out of there exhaust pipe

The Exhaust gas in any diesel engine will always be dirty and contain particles that the EGR throws right back into the induction system, it is purley there for emission control.

As with all these mods that us fully trained mechanics p#ss about with that actually work, its down to choice, me i have chosen my way and if any other user asks my opinion which is what i'm doing to the first question i will give my tried and tested thoughts which they can choose if they wish to implement but dont try and imply i'm wrong or have no idea what i'm doing and once again imply the world will come to an abrupt end if all Land Rover users disconnect their EGR valves.

Not implying anything - you are wrong ! I have the end of the world booked for Friday 2am GMT !!! Just find it hard to believe that if you are "a fully trained " mechanic that you so casually dismiss a bit of kit that can make a drastic improvement to emissions.All you are doing is giving tree huggers ammo to sling at Ic engines when what we all need is access to a clean fuel to stick in them. - Or do you want to get around in electric Smart (NOT) car?

So this is what it all comes to these days,(fully trained or not) if it's not working take it out,blank it off,throw it away or bodge it. This is why I do my own repairs etc, who knows what "fixes" garages do and charge the earth for. Why is it hundreds of folk never have any egr problems?
Here's another for you, how many garages actually drain the oil when doing a service? I mean take the drain plug out!! if your engine is full of filthy oil it's going to to gunge everything up egr or not.
Is the apprenticeship for a vehicle fitter still four years, come on guys unless you are my age you have never had to find out a fault, if the plug-in says it's faulty take it off and replace it, I'm afraid the days of "FULLY QUALIFIED" are long gone.

eightinavee said:

Disconnecting the Egr will not cause your car any problems, I didnt suggest it did.So what if there is crap in the inlet manifold - what you ought to worry about is the crap coming out of your exhaust.Or are you a fan of acid rain ?
I'm also well aware of the amount of people who disconnect their Egr and dribble on about how much better it goes etc,shame they dont spend more time learning about how their car is supposed to work.Just cos loads of people do it,it does not mean its right.
I had a vehicle in this week,that was knocking like hell and black smoking badly.A local garage had disconnected the egr to "stop it smoking" - Made no difference at all,all that is wrong with it is that No 4 injector is sticking.On monday a new set of nozzles will arrive and be fitted,the egr will get re-connected and it will be fine.
My point is that diesel engines are not yet rocket science, so why are they ****ed about with by people who ought to know better ?

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Does this mean you are going to take all four injectors out and mount new ones instead? If yes I am curious to know how many miles the engine has done and whether you will be able to take out injector no. 1 without problems ?? (On another forum a member had to have his injector no. 1 replaced as it was slightly leaking, the dealer/garage was unable to get it out the normal way, they tried everything out but no go, the injector kept stuck in the head, they tried by heating and cooling the stuff around but no use, all this against big ££££ of course and in the end a new head etc. would have to be installed. It ended up the member left his car to the dealer (for a ridiculous price as it was not road ready, after they broke almost everything possible they/the stealer, had the nerf to offer him an alms to take it over) and he is now looking for another one, he was also one of the biggest LR Freelander adepts who thought, as I do, to be homefree for a lot of years with the famous BMW engine, unfortunately he had to review his ideas and I hope I am not going to end up in a similar situation.

No, not new injectors - just nozzles and springs.Nozzles are £34 each,Injectors £92 each.It is a Toyota hilux diesel with 125000 m recorded - dont know if its true mileage.I run a Landrover garage and would not normally touch it,but it belongs to a good friend and I want to help him.
Part of my work is for local garages within 30 odd miles radius and I have to say most are providing a good service to local repeat customers and dont advertise much.The only difference between most of them and me is that I do what I do firstly out of technical interest with money very much an annoying secondary consideration.Dont think that all the skill has gone out of the motor trade - you just need to seek it out.

Sorry, it looks as I incorrectly assumed you were going to work on a Freelander. Good luck and take care.

I agree with some of the comments about modern mechanics sorry technicians not being able to fault find but thankfully i'm not one. I also believe that prevention is better than the cure.

Hence why i have disconnected my EGR valve, emissions or not, the car runs cleaner according to the MOT machine without it anyway and smoother.

On another point i have done some business with a L/R dealer and was within the premises for some time and they do just replace parts willy nilly trying to cure a fault and charge the clients for all parts used without knowing which one cured the problem, i also firmly believe that L/R are not alone in this practice as now a days technicians have a Tech II device in hand ready to plug into the diagnostic port and hope it has logged a fault code.

Zippy

Thanks Zippy for being man enough to say all that. You are of course dead right, and it does apply to all dealers, the whole after care set-up is a complete farce and the sooner the authorities start an investigation the better!!
Motorists get ripped off enough, and deserve a better deal. One idea is to stay with your vehicle and watch what is going on and ask questions. If it only takes an hour to do a job, don't be conned with the old "we'll give you a ring when it's ready". It will probably have been ready for hours before you get the call, and have to shell out for four or five hours labour.