Down shift without synchros

Hi all,


This may seem like a stupid question, but hear me out please.....


I have had a 69 Series 2A Landy for a few months now and still cannot "down shift" from 3rd to 2nd without scratching the gearbox. I dont have synchros between 1 and 2 and therefor need to "double clutch".
Shifting UP is not a problem, I get the "double clucthing" right.


From 1st to 2nd it would be something like this...
Clutch in
Gear neutral
Clutch out
Clutch in
Gear up
Clutch out


Apparently, when shifting DOWN, from 3rd to 2nd, you should rev the engine at some stage, but when:


Is it:
Clutch in
Gear neutral
REV
Clutch out
Clutch in
Gear down
Clutch out


Or is it:
Clutch in
Gear neutral
Clutch out
REV
Clutch in
Gear down
Clutch out

Hope you understand what I'm trying to say. Any suggestions please!!


Thanks

the second one.

but you shouldn't really need to rev it, if you've matched the road speed and engine speed.

when you rev are you just blipping or holding ?

all you doing in the first is an unneeded clutch in/out action

Ok, thanks!! That was my next question...... you probably cannot downgear (without scratching) if you're going too fast. If I go REALLY slowly (almost standstill) I can downgear without a problem, but even doing 30km/h, I cannot downgear without scratching.

Regarding blipping or holding, Ive tried everything!!

pfttt , puffs the lot of ya .... you should try a 13 speed fuller (non syncro) that'll rattle yer fillins out ....

30kph is probably about where it would be beginning to be ok to downshift.
I know if I try it much more than that in my syncro gear box it wants to complain about it. But its a mish mash of 2a and III parts in a 2a box.

2nd one
But i dont bother my self as a 2.25 landy will pull in 3rd from 20mph and up.
The only other tip i have is dont force it change gear slowly.

If you are familiar with the vehicle then it's easy to change gear without using the clutch, takes a little while to learn but is realy easy once you know.

can u change down gear with out using the clutch??

I have a series IIA Land Rover (no synchro on 1st and 2nd), this is my description of double de-clutching. To go from 3rd to 2nd do this:

1. Depress the clutch and simultaneously release the accelerator (as you would do with a normal gearbox).
2. Select neutral.
3. Release the clutch.
4. Depress the accelerator.
5. Wait for the engine revs to rise to the correct speed (The correct speed is the speed the engine would be running at if 2nd gear was selected, the clutch was out and you were travelling at the current road speed).
6. Simultaneously release the accelerator and depress the clutch.
7. Select 2nd gear
8. Depress the accelerator until the engine revs approximately match the road speed (As you should do with any gearbox).
9. Release the clutch.

Use the same method to go from 2nd to 1st. I find that the engine needs revving more in neutral when changing from 2nd and 1st than 3rd to 2nd.

It sounds complicated but with a bit of practice it is possible to do all that in a fraction of a second. You might even find yourself double declutching when you go from 4th to 3rd as it's faster than waiting for the synchromesh to do its thing, so you can keep the momentum going when you are coaxing the beast up a hill. Once you have mastered double de-clutching the next stage is to change gear without using the clutch. You follow a similar procedure but without using the clutch pedal. To get the box from 3rd into neutal you just apply slight pressure to the gear lever and then slightly back off the accelerator, it will then slip into neutral, then you blip the accelerator and move the gear lever into 2nd. It is better to practice clutchless gearchanging in somebody else's Land Rover.