Disco 3 2.7 tdv6 wont start 😬

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charlie@autoworxengineeri said:
I agree but I'm still niggled by the easy start thing 😆.
No I turned the engine over with the viscous fan tbh. So when the crank snaps its not totally obvious? I just presumed it crank had snapped then the crak pulley wouldn't turn.
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'If' the crank has snapped, which from what you've posted so far doesn't seem likely - because a) you've not mentioned uneven cranking speed, b) the timing belt wouldn't be turning, or not evenly, c) you've mentioned that the timing belt has been checked by others.
Take the engine cooling fan off (36mm spanner and a copper mallet), turn the crank by hand, checking for smooth turning and a easy return when released under compression. if either of those checks fail, it's likely picked up or spun a shell. If not, carry on with diag.

I'm not too worried by the easy-start issue - firstly, it may not be spinning fast enough, secondly, easy start does 'age'.
 
Graculus said:
'If' the crank has snapped, which from what you've posted so far doesn't seem likely - because a) you've not mentioned uneven cranking speed, b) the timing belt wouldn't be turning, or not evenly, c) you've mentioned that the timing belt has been checked by others.
Take the engine cooling fan off (36mm spanner and a copper mallet), turn the crank by hand, checking for smooth turning and a easy return when released under compression. if either of those checks fail, it's likely picked up or spun a shell. If not, carry on with diag.
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Once again I agree, but I think I might as well be 100% on cambelt and cam pulley bolts as you've mentioned previously, so I can check crank when I'm in there. The whole thing is really bugging me so I need an answer either way. There is nothing obvious from the original codes that I had and I can only assume those were generated from the last time it was running. So that rules out things like fuel presure and blocked exhaust, but only in theory ...
 
The thing is, if you turn the viscous fan, then you're relying upon the friction of the auxiliary belt, which will slip when it encounters resistance greater than the tensioner can overcome...
I've seen engines with mech. issues across marques with no relevant DTC's, so don't rely on them for a pointer to possible cause.

The previous owner sold it as a non-runner, presumably after investing a bit of cash in someone's time to diag. - so it was never going to be a quick code-read, fix & done type job.
What is prolonging the eventual diagnosis is you're using remote diagnostics from various sources, experience & opinions - not that it's a bad thing, but it's never going to be as quick or conclusive as going into a workshop with the skills, test equipment and data to hand.
 
charlie@autoworxengineeri said:
I agree but I'm still niggled by the easy start thing 😆.
No I turned the engine over with the viscous fan tbh. So when the crank snaps its not totally obvious? I just presumed it crank had snapped then the crak pulley wouldn't turn.
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Ok although not involved in this thread.
There is no way you can turn over an engine with the viscous fan.

something isn’t right if you did.

J
 
Graculus said:
The thing is, if you turn the viscous fan, then you're relying upon the friction of the auxiliary belt, which will slip when it encounters resistance greater than the tensioner can overcome...
I've seen engines with mech. issues across marques with no relevant DTC's, so don't rely on them for a pointer to possible cause.

The previous owner sold it as a non-runner, presumably after investing a bit of cash in someone's time to diag. - so it was never going to be a quick code-read, fix & done type job.
What is prolonging the eventual diagnosis is you're using remote diagnostics from various sources, experience & opinions - not that it's a bad thing, but it's never going to be as quick or conclusive as going into a workshop with the skills, test equipment and data to hand.
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Absolutely agree. He did spend around £400 trying to solve it, but was going to upgrade (if it is that as he bought a 2016 Disco) anyway so wasn't too keen on throwing too much away, especially after pumping nearly £1600 into September Mot. From what I gather there was a new EGR fitted to passenger side, drivers one was done the year before, then they checked all the belts and relays, fuses etc. They were then going down the compression test as could only conclude it must be heads.
I genuinely appreciate all the help, but agree that it will probably be going elsewhere very soon to someone I know that has the knowledge and equipment.
 
That's a lazy diagnosis from the workshop, one head, possible, but it'd still start and sort-of run, also wouldn't explain the cutting out - fit a pair of blanking plates on the EGR outlet - at this stage, don't worry about the throttle butterfly, that will eliminate EGR's as the cause (they've stopped many a Ford or PSA engined vehicle from starting) and have been known to cause a vehicle to cut out during throttle lift-off.
Check the turning resistance at the crank first, there's something off there.
 
Yes, you'll have a few emissions related bits, the HP fuel pump, injectors, fuel rails and some coolant hoses / VAC pipes etc. To swap over - I'd recommend replacing the oil pump too.
 
charlie@autoworxengineeri said:
Absolutely agree. He did spend around £400 trying to solve it, but was going to upgrade (if it is that as he bought a 2016 Disco) anyway so wasn't too keen on throwing too much away, especially after pumping nearly £1600 into September Mot. From what I gather there was a new EGR fitted to passenger side, drivers one was done the year before, then they checked all the belts and relays, fuses etc. They were then going down the compression test as could only conclude it must be heads.
I genuinely appreciate all the help, but agree that it will probably be going elsewhere very soon to someone I know that has the knowledge and equipment.
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Have you found out about your problem yet?
 
charlie@autoworxengineeri said:
Hi, no sorry I've just taken it down the road to a good garage I know and am awaiting their diagnosis, so I'll keep you posted.
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fingers crossed mate it’s not anything serious and is an easy fix

plse let us know how u get on

ps, sorry if it’s already been done but has the butterfly valve been checked along with removing the top plastic air inlet pipe and the route to the turbo is clear plse , easy to put an endoscope down there

would be tempted with those items removed to then see if it will start , if not trying some easy start
 
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gstuart said:
fingers crossed mate it’s not anything serious and is an easy fix

plse let us know how u get on

ps, sorry if it’s already been done but has the butterfly valve been checked along with removing the top plastic air inlet pipe and the route to the turbo is clear plse , easy to put an endoscope down there

would be tempted with those items removed to then see if it will start , if not trying some easy start
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I removed the blue silicone hose to the throttle body y piece and sprayed easy start down there and got nothing. 😬
 
charlie@autoworxengineeri said:
I removed the blue silicone hose to the throttle body y piece and sprayed easy start down there and got nothing. 😬
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many thks, oh wow indeed u would have thought it would at least give a splutter spraying in the throttle body

apologises as didn’t see that bit in the thread , certainly a head scratcher

assume ur Map sensor was clean as I know they can block up solid

suppose the other thing is I wonder if the crankshaft position sensor has fsiled ? seeing u checked the fuel pump belt and pressures at the test point at the back of the engine

just trying to rack my brains of what could be stopping it from starting , also assume the red alarm flashing night isn’t on , daft question but have u also tried ur spare key

dam im waffling again, lol , lastly have u cleared all the codes and then rescanned it plse , fingers crossed is a simple fix and nothing too serious
 
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