Freelander 1 Brake Fluid Question

Hi All,

Freelander 2005 TD4 2.0

Land Rover manual states to use "Shell ESL Donax EB break fluid or any break fluid having a minimum boiling point of 260 degrees and complying with FMVSS 116 DOT4

Question is I don't think that break fluid exists anymore, and from what I've seen DOT4 boiling point is 230Degrees.

Also I have no clue what fluid is in there previously, from what I've read I'm okay to just top up given it's the same spec (which hopefully the current stuff is correct spec!). Same thing for Anti freeze & power steering fluid, I need to do top-ups of these as all on MIN line - but I have no clue on the previous brands/spec.

Sorry if silly question, new to the world of car servicing.

Brands are pretty much irrelevant, as all decent makes will meet or exceed the original LR specification.

Brake fluid is just standard DOT 4, which is available everywhere, and is clear in colour, and very toxic to you and paintwork.

PS fluid is Dexron III automatically transmission fluid, which is cherry red in colour, toxic, but less damaging to paintwork.

The coolant will be OAT coolant, which is normally red or pink in colour, is again toxic and not too damaging to paintwork.

Green or blue coolant is Glycol based and not OAT and can't be mixed.

Nodge68 said:

Brands are pretty much irrelevant, as all decent makes will meet or exceed the original LR specification.

Brake fluid is just standard DOT 4, which is available everywhere, and is clear in colour, and very toxic to you and paintwork.

PS fluid is Dexron II automatically transmission fluid, which is cherry red in colour, toxic, but less damaging to paintwork.

The coolant will be OAT coolant, which is normally red or pink in colour, is again toxic and not too damaging to paintwork.

Green or blue coolant is Glycol based and not OAT and can't be mixed.

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Thanks for the reply. So I can ignore the boiling point and get Standard DOT4 for Break Fluid?

Here are some of the products I am thinking of using:

Break Fluid (Manuals calls for Shell ESL Donax EB break fluid or any break fluid having a minimum boiling point of 260 degrees and complying with FMVSS 116 DOT4
Amazon product

Coolant (This supersede the original spec "Castrol Ant-Freeze SF" as advised in manual afaik)
Amazon product

Power Steering (Manual calls for ATF Dextron III)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ATF-Dexr...L-20L-Optilube-/312730585179?var=611453882404

onza120 said:

Thanks for the reply. So I can ignore the boiling point and get Standard DOT4 for Break Fluid?

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All DOT 4 will exceed the minimum specifications for a DOT 4, so yes, ignore temperature stuff.

DOT 4 is the name and also the specification to which the fluid meets or exceeds.

DOT 4 has a dry boiling point (fresh out of a sealed container) of over 230°C, and a wet boiling (in the vehicle for 1-2 years) of over 155°C.
Hope this helps.

Nodge68 said:

All DOT 4 will exceed the minimum specifications for a DOT 4, so yes, ignore temperature stuff.

DOT 4 is the name and also the specification to which the fluid meets or exceeds.

DOT 4 has a dry boiling point (fresh out of a sealed container) of over 230°C, and a wet boiling (in the vehicle for 1-2 years) of over 155°C.
Hope this helps.

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Thanks Nodge. I posted some extra information on my reply regarding other fluids - would be very grateful for your insight. Thanks again for your responses.

onza120 said:

Thanks Nodge. I posted some extra information on my reply regarding other fluids - would be very grateful for your insight. Thanks again for your responses.

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I'm not sure what LR say for the PS fluid, but DII or DIII will be suitable, as the steering doesn't stress the fluid really. DIII will have a longer life, but it's pretty irrelevant just for topping up.

Coolant is just OAT coolant, and is available from many manufacturers under names like OAT or Organic Acid Technology, but as long as it matches the colour in the vehicle, then it'll be fine.

onza120 said:

Hi All,

Freelander 2005 TD4 2.0

Land Rover manual states to use "Shell ESL Donax EB break fluid or any break fluid having a minimum boiling point of 260 degrees and complying with FMVSS 116 DOT4

Question is I don't think that break fluid exists anymore, and from what I've seen DOT4 boiling point is 230Degrees.

Also I have no clue what fluid is in there previously, from what I've read I'm okay to just top up given it's the same spec (which hopefully the current stuff is correct spec!). Same thing for Anti freeze & power steering fluid, I need to do top-ups of these as all on MIN line - but I have no clue on the previous brands/spec.

Sorry if silly question, new to the world of car servicing.

Click to expand...

Hi, no question is too silly if your not sure, especially when it involves safety items. When topping up brake fluid, it should be the same spec as what's in there but if you don't know what's in there it makes it more difficult. As brake fluid should be changed every 2 years anyway (mineral brake fluids like DOT 4 are hydroscopic & absorb water, which in turn can corrode the internals of the brake components) it would be worth starting afresh & bleeding the whole system using new fluid, especially if you don't know when it was last done. You're right in what the OM says about the brake fluid (the Haynes manual only states DOT 4, no mention of boiling points). I only used 'over the counter' DOT 4 when I replaced both the front brake calipers on mine & bled the whole system at the same time, as I was unsure of when it was last done & have had no problems. DOT 5 has a boiling point of 260 but I'm not sure if these are mainly synthetic fluids that shouldn't be mixed with std. DOT 4. If it has got what LR recommended in it then it should be ok to top up with the lower boiling point DOT 4 but as I say a fluid change would be in order (just don't spill any on your paint work or plastics). It would be interesting to hear from others on here as to what they've used. Good luck.

BRAKE

onza120 said:

Thanks Nodge. I posted some extra information on my reply regarding other fluids - would be very grateful for your insight. Thanks again for your responses.

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Something else important with brake fluid. Don't buy more than you need for topping up, and don't actually top it up unless it's below the minimum mark.

Here's why.

Brake fluid is hygroscopic, meaning it absorbs water from the atmosphere. This water reduces its boiling point considerably.
For this reason, you can't keep any fluid you don't use straight away, so if you buy 5 Litres, and only use 5mL for topping up, the remaining 4.995 Litres will simply be useless after a few weeks and will need to be thrown out. I buy DOT 4 in 500mL bottles, unless I'm bleeding the system.
Brake fluid being hygroscopic is also the reason why brake fluid needs to be changed every 2 or 3 years, but preferably 2 years to maintain brake efficiency when hot.

Topping up is only needed if the fluid level is below the minimum level on the reservoir.
As the brake pads are worn down, the fluid from the reservoir takes up the space. When new pads are fitted, the pistons need to be pushed back, and the fluid level in the reservoir will rise again.
If you top up above the minimum line on the reservoir while the pads are worn, which are subsequently replaced, the fluid returned to the reservoir will overflow, spilling on the paintwork and strip it off, resulting in a mess and future rust.

Hope this helps.

flat said:

BRAKE

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Yeah just realised.

running away this thread lol
DOT 5 and 5.5 are silicon based and mainly used for racing applications - as they are silicon based they do not absorb water - but that is a negative for road going applications as you would then need to flush the system every now and then to get rid of water.

going to digress a small bit - meets or exceeds specification - I work in a heavily regulated industry and when a suppler turns round and states " it meets the minimum requirements - you have to accept it" makes my blood boil!!
One suppplier was going to charge us more for a PCBA when we pointed out the target for a solder fill was 100% - they were working to the minimum 75%!!!

Thanks for the replies everyone. A very helpful forum! Glad to be here.