Axle refurbishments

Another quick update. When I was doing my axles last weekend I couldn't help noticing that the drop arm ball joint was losing its rubber concertina. Accordingly I ordered a kit for it. I was wondering whether I'd be able to get the top bearing out, because it doesn't project into the hole in the top of the drop arm, but in the event it came out with the pin. Getting the new one in was a bit fiddle because my purpose made tool tends to pull it in on a skew, so it is apt to jam before it reaches the shoulder it is suppose to sit against. So I wedged a sledgehammer between the arm and the axle to act as an anvil and hammered it in with a drift. It was much more controllable.



This time around I've drilled the bottom plate and put a grease nipple in, as suggested by people on here:



Look at that lovely yellow curl of grease coming out of the top. So now let's get the concertina on and tighten the nut. Yes, I did remember to spread the little legs of the split pin before finishing.



With the wheels off the ground I had another feel of the bearings I'd replaced last weekend. The initial stiffness has gone now they've run in and there doesn't seem to be any slack, so it's looking good. I've also discovered that thin runny Dinitrol can be sprayed with a spray bottle so you don't need to get the compressor out every time. So from now on every time I see rust showing through I'll be able to zap it straight away.

jamesmartin said:

you place chisel on the side of the nut not down the length of it , a its easier and b it splits before you get to thread so no damage
you advance adjuster till c/w is just touching no backlash then leave that adjuster alone , then use other adjuster to create the backlash this gives the correct backlash and bearing preload

Click to expand...

Sorry to butt in here gents, just gotto ask a question... a few weeks ago i fitted a rear locker in my 90, checked the backlash with dial guage before stripping everything...
Backlash was just over 6 thou. replaced bearings and fitted the locker, but I set the backlash to about 5 thou as the manual said... would this cause issues as it's different from the way i found it??

I think it has reduced the "clunking" a bit when changing gear!?

Cheers

Loz

your backlash is ok but are your bearings preload ie did you follow procedure as i described

Brown, how did you find the LSD's on road, any different? My mate's got LSD's front and back, goes pretty much everywhere and keeps taking the p*ss, as his setup is the same price as my rear locker i got on my 90...

Building a tomcat atm, so i think i'll be going for slips front and back eventually!

Good job on the swivel rebuild, did you double up on the oil seal retainers around the ball or just use one?

Cheers

Loz

jamesmartin said:

your backlash is ok but are your bearings preload ie did you follow procedure as i described

Click to expand...

Ah cool, yes, had to do it a couple of times (as i've never done it before), but the final attempt was pretty much exactly as you said, with the bearing cups torqued to the settings in the overhaul manual, i think it was about 80 nm or there about.

Did you use a press to get the bearings on to the diff?? not sure if this is frowned upon, but i gently heated up the centre of the bearing with a small propane torch till they were just starting to get to hot to handle without gloves...? they just slipped on and stayed there happily...

Cheers

heating isnt a good idea ,they do tap on with a suitable socket ok as not to tight a fit

I haven't been too far on the new diffs yet. As you'll see from another thread I started, my engine has stopped and won't restart and my sump is filling with fuel so I think I have an injector seal problem. I've ordered new seals and washers but with the Christmas post it could be quite a while before they get here.

In terms of how the limited slips feel on tarmac, I haven't noticed the difference. Maybe there's a tiny bit more bump steer, for example when you hit a pothole whilst going round a corner, but if I didn't know they were there I wouldn't notice the difference. Once I'm mobile again I shall put in some more miles and see. In the meantime there is a product review thread here DEFENDER2.NET - View topic - ATB (torsen) front and rear install

Getting bearings onto shafts or into housings I tend to find I do best hitting them with a hammer and drift, just hard enough to move them, and if you imagine the bearing like a clock face, do a 12 o'clock, 6 o'clock, 9 o'clock, 3 o'clock. The trouble with presses and with using improvised devices made out of bolts and washers and spacers is that it's very easy for them to get a bit skewed and jam. Whereas if you're tapping them you can compensate for this as you go. Bit of grease helps too, and will help you get them out again should you need to eventually. As James says I'd try and avoid heating in case it interferes with the tempering.

Where adjustment is concerned, I have about 0.1 mm of backlash and a wee bit of preload. I re-used the ring gears and pinions which appeared to be in as-new condition. When you're working at such tight tolerances a single notch on the adjusters can make a noticeable difference to the feel but I'm pretty confident I have found the sweet spot. Under load of course even with something as rigid-feeling as a diff gear there can be some movement as the pinion and crown wheel try to push each other apart. Hence Ashcroft and others 'pegging' diffs for competition use.

in answer to the question, I've just used single thickness seal retainers, because that was what was on before and they seemed perfectly up to the job.

Interesting to know how you find it. I think my back diff is making a clunking noise when I let the clutch out aggressively, so am looking at something like this if I can find the funds.

james6546 said:

Interesting to know how you find it. I think my back diff is making a clunking noise when I let the clutch out aggressively, so am looking at something like this if I can find the funds.

Click to expand...

Me too, think I mentioned it at the start, mines for strength over the standard 2 pin though.
And they're cheaper than a proper locker, which I don't need so seems a good idea.

I've got an ashcroft atb in my rear too. Works really well on mud and on the road. It only gets caught out when you have an entire wheel off the ground.

Yes, there's less movement in the diff, but in my experience a good deal of the clunk comes from splines. I have got rid of most of my clunk via new drive flanges and halfshafts, around Easter this year. Some people recommend fitting the kind where the flange is forged on to the half shaft, if yours started life with separate ones. Don't forget the condition of suspension bushes and joints too, particularly the centre ball joint at the rear. Just waiting to get my engine fixed and I'll be out to try them some more.

Brown said:

Yes, there's less movement in the diff, but in my experience a good deal of the clunk comes from splines. I have got rid of most of my clunk via new drive flanges and halfshafts, around Easter this year. Some people recommend fitting the kind where the flange is forged on to the half shaft, if yours started life with separate ones. Don't forget the condition of suspension bushes and joints too, particularly the centre ball joint at the rear. Just waiting to get my engine fixed and I'll be out to try them some more.

Click to expand...

Mine has just been rebuilt so shouldn't be ball joints or suspension. The only thing that hasn't been done is the diffs or halfshafts. It did it before the rebuild so has to be something I haven't yet changed.

I've been out and about this weekend so have some more experience with the new diffs. I've not been able to update these last few weeks as the car has been out of action for other reasons detailed in another thread. However, over the past couple of days I've been over o Wales and have done a lot of motorway driving plus a good many (very) minor roads slick with mud and manure and some unsurfaced roads and open fields. On motorways and A roads it feels a lot steadier somehow. Previously, I could always tell when I was going over 70 because the steering would get jittery, even without looking at the instruments. Now I can overtake with good deal more confidence. This might be due to the new steering swivel bearings as much as the diffs. Like this guy notes
DEFENDER2.NET - View topic - ATB (torsen) front and rear install
it feels a lot steadier going round corners on twisty A roads and it's tempting to throw it around like an ordinary car, which I've resisted. It was fairly dry underfoot so I wasn't able to test out what I really wanted them for, which is better traction on wet grass slopes, slopes with a film of liquid mud, 1 in 4 hills with ice on them and so on.

In other news, my mid-Wales friend whom I visit has lost his Land Rover. He lost control of it on an icy road and ran up the bank at the side and rolled it. He was OK, but was trapped upside down for a while as his seat belt would not release. He refused to go to hospital and was eventually taken home by the police. The Land Rover was recovered to nearby Newtown, and then the insurers had it transported to Chester so their assessors could examine it. Whilst it was in the custody of the insurance company it was stolen. After some negotiation, the insurance company has offered him £10,500 which he accepted. But quite a saga altogether.

That feeling of sure footedness is exactly how mine felt following putting the atb in. Mines having a front one and another in the xfer box this year.

mikeh501 said:

That feeling of sure footedness is exactly how mine felt following putting the atb in. Mines having a front one and another in the xfer box this year.

Click to expand...

It'll be even better with a front one in, I'm sure.