2001 Range Rover 2.5 diesel doesnt pull in low revs!

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Hello,

It sounds like a transmission issue, not engine.
I would check the consistency and level of the transmission fluid. It should be clear and pink/purple colored, should not smell burnt.
In your model year the level check is a bit complicated, as the dipstick is not used any more.
The level has to be checked with cold engine from underneath the car from the filler plug while idling in neutral, after having selected through all gears.

to questions
1. not ok. the car should start crawling as soon as you select a gear
2. like 1.
3. this is normal until the gearbox reaches operating temperature
4. I do not understand this exactly
5. You could manually select each gear up, while accelerating and see if it changes to fourth gear.
The fourth gear, you mention could be the torque converter lock. It feels like a gear change, but it is not.
When the converter locks, the revs go back slightly at the same speed and this ocures normally at speeds like 60mph(?) / 80 kph

cheers, Korkut
 
eminenz said:
Hi again guys,
sorry i am new to this and have no knowledge in mechanics whatsoever...

What I notice in my 60.000 miles 2.5 TDiesel is that between 10000 and 3000 revs the car struggles to pull...


wills m8, the way i read it was as if he wasnt used to the turbo lag in that rev range and the almighty power lol of the bmw engine..
esp when his other auto cars where a bit nippy...
now he has explained a bit more it does sound like theres a problem esp with noise and gearchange?

eminenz. i would as said get your gear oil checked and changed along with the filter if its rammy.
as wills said they are slow from cold and when warm you do have to put your foot down if you want to build up speed but gearchanges should be smooth and noise free and 4th engages around 50mph..
let me know if you found that chip just out of curiosity..
Click to expand...
 
Thanks guys for all your comments!!

Kork, regarding Q5. I meant to say that when I am cruising, say at 40-50mph and I take my foot off the accelerator the revs drop to 1000... shouldnt they just come down slowly so when I accelerate back the revs slowly pick from where they are?

"noise" was not gear noise, no.... sorry, my english, I meant to say the noise the engine normally makes from gear to gear, like when I take my foot off, the engine should make that slowing down/breaking noise right, instead it just drops immediately to 1000 revs!

Mark, I have checked the Tune It chip, yes its there!! Its a III - I can see the little brass adjuester and as soon as i started turning it to the right I started hearing a series of clicks... I believe there are 9 of them... strange, the Tunit it in the car was all the way to the left!

is it good news for me???

I am going for a drive in about 1 hour so would be nice to know what you think of this!!

thanks!
 
eminenz said:
Thanks guys for all your comments!!

Kork, regarding Q5. I meant to say that when I am cruising, say at 40-50mph and I take my foot off the accelerator the revs drop to 1000... shouldnt they just come down slowly so when I accelerate back the revs slowly pick from where they are?

"noise" was not gear noise, no.... sorry, my english, I meant to say the noise the engine normally makes from gear to gear, like when I take my foot off, the engine should make that slowing down/breaking noise right, instead it just drops immediately to 1000 revs!

Mark, I have checked the Tune It chip, yes its there!! Its a III - I can see the little brass adjuester and as soon as i started turning it to the right I started hearing a series of clicks... I believe there are 9 of them... strange, the Tunit it in the car was all the way to the left!

is it good news for me???

I am going for a drive in about 1 hour so would be nice to know what you think of this!!

thanks!
Click to expand...

Hi Eminez

I had exactly the same opinion as you when I bought my DSE, the revs do fall away quickly unlike other autos Ive had. This car has a serious lack of low down grunt compared to its size. You really have to press the throttle a lot more than you expect, my wife still has trouble driving it compared to her TD4 Freelander which feels like a sports car by comparison !

I too have a Tunit 111 and here are the set up instructions (copied from Tunit leaflet)

Basic Adjustment

Turn the screw to the left until you hear a quiet click.

Adjustment

Start the car. Turn the screw clockwise (up to) 15 turns (step by step) and accelerate briefly. Search for the point when the car develops excessive smoke. When you find this point turn the screw back slowly until you are happy with the emission and power.

My car is almost turned to Max.

Basic rule: turn the screw
Clockwise = more power
Anti clockwise = less power

Im not convinced there is anything wrong with your car apart from the fact the engines too small !!
I have also shortened my turbo actuator rod by a turn and half which has given it more torque but I wouldnt recommend this unless you fully understand the possible consequences if it goes wrong.

Hope this helps, If you can get your head round the fact that its no sports car you will (like me) start to enjoy the ownership !
You are more than welcome to drive mine if your ever in Somerset ! ;)

Steve
 
Thanks Steve, this is exactly what i needed to know, as I didnt install the chip I didnt have instructions and couldnt find any information on how to actually operate the chip online... i will try tomorrow and let you know.

QUESTION: even with the chip working correctly for your car you still have the same behaviour at low revs?


thanks a lot!
 
Still regarding Kork's answers@

"5. You could manually select each gear up, while accelerating and see if it changes to fourth gear.
The fourth gear, you mention could be the torque converter lock. It feels like a gear change, but it is not.
When the converter locks, the revs go back slightly at the same speed and this ocures normally at speeds like 60mph(?) / 80 k"


>>>> manually select each gear up?? how do I do it if the car is auto?

>>>> this converter locks at ~ 55 mph for me, if I lift my foot, the revs go down nicely , like i would like to feel at 40, 30 0r 20...

thanks
 
eminenz said:
Thanks Steve, this is exactly what i needed to know, as I didnt install the chip I didnt have instructions and couldnt find any information on how to actually operate the chip online... i will try tomorrow and let you know.

QUESTION: even with the chip working correctly for your car you still have the same behaviour at low revs?


thanks a lot!
Click to expand...

Yes gearbox is exactly the same but Im used to it now
 
>> manually select each gear up?? how do I do it if the car is auto?<<
you have the "H" gate where your gear lever is. the left side for street gears, the right one for reduction (we drive on the right side of the street, yours may be the other way around). On each side you have the postions 1, 2, 3, and D (4). From stillstand you pull the lever to position "1" and move. when the revs go up to 3000- 3500, you push the lever to "2" and so on...
You can use it as a manual, just w/o the clutch. I use the third gear quiet often, when I want to accelerete from 70-80 kph, without using "kickdown".
It is normal for the revs to fall down with the foot off the accelerator while normal town driving, as the autobox selects highest possible level when the accelerator is eased. (you can check that as well, while driving in first manually).
I still think, the fluid should be controlled, as your car does not start crawling when you select drive and ease the brake. It definitely should.
(may be a seized brake caliper / handbrake as well).
And I have to note that the diesel P38 has the longest accelerator-pedal travel from all the cars I have driven. You have to get used to it and push more then you would do with a "normal" car. I found it very helpful at the very beginning setting the base of the drivers seat downwords at the front. (I am serious)

cheers, korkut
 
Beast o Bodmin said:
never had some trouble with 300tdi,in a heavy tipper too.Are the BMW lumps ****e?
Click to expand...


the bmw engine is a good lump but in std form its a bloomin snail.
my modded 300tdi is quicker from cold compared to the ranger.
now the ranger has been chipped the disco cant touch the ranger on power or economy..
having a bmw diesel engine chipped/remapped ls money well spent imho...
disco is more reliable with less gadgets to go wrong though lol
 
thanks guys,

but Javars... there must be something that can be done about this weak low revs power!?

according to Tunit:

"What is achieved ?
Immediately the increased power and torque can be felt. The throttle response is improved and particularly low and mid range torque is vastly improved, making the overall performance of the vehicle completely different."

this is pretty much the same as saying:


"Save fuel for life...
An efficient ignition map improves low RPM power enabling a driving style that requires fewer revs per minute. This significantly reduces fuel consumption and CO2 emissions by up to 20%, meaning that your tuning pays off very quickly. In addition, all our tuning boxes can be easily removed, reprogrammed and transferred when you change your vehicle."

this is another chip from Diesel Tuning by CHIP Express™


now, I am not raising this issue for saving diesel, what I want is to be able to drive at low speeds in a "natural" way.

The Tunit surely must have a setting between the click 1 and 15 enhancing "power at low revs" right?

---

I didnt have time today for following the instructions provided by Steve (thanks!) but I am so excited about doing this tomorrow...

will report back,

cheers!
 
eminenz, if yours is set to the left as you say then as per the instructions it sounds like its set low. adjust till it smokes like he said wich is excess fuel then turn back till it doesnt..
not the best of devices imho but each to there own..
hope it works for you m8.
mark..
 
Thanks Mark, sure I will try tomorrow, I also called Tunit today, they sent me the original instructions by email, very helpful.

You say this is not the best... which one is the best?

I am prepared to pay the price for low revs power!!

thanks again
 
I still dont think you will get that power low down, the turbo needs to be boosting with the auto to make progress. Boost = revs im afraid.
Chip express doesnt list our car by the look of it.
Mark.......how is your car between 1000-2500 revs ?(which I think is the trouble Eminez is struggling with) or do you have a manual ?

Steve
 
javars said:
I still dont think you will get that power low down, the turbo needs to be boosting with the auto to make progress. Boost = revs im afraid.
Chip express doesnt list our car by the look of it.
Mark.......how is your car between 1000-2500 revs ?(which I think is the trouble Eminez is struggling with) or do you have a manual ?

Steve
Click to expand...

steve, mine is also auto.
the chip i have comes with a 5yr guarantee and a guarantee on your engine it constantly maps to your driving style and computes at 20,000 per second and supposed to be able to compete with live mapping. it will still pull off lazy in the same low rev range if i let it but still save me more fuel than std, but if i want to pull off a bit sharpish,just simply put your foot down and it goes into performance mode in a flash.you can actually feel it try and spin the rear wheels turning out of junctions. once you have built up your speed it goes back into economy mode so not just power all the time wich is what a lot of plug in ones do as they just boost fuel etc...
if your not happy with your chip once you have adjusted it, then i would speak to someone who does live mapping in your area and tell them what you want out of it..mark..
 
mark1971 said:
steve, mine is also auto.
the chip i have constantly maps to your driving style and computes at 20,000 per second. it will still pull off lazy in the same rev range if i let it but still save me more fuel than std, but if i want to pull off a bit sharpish,just simply put your foot down and it goes into performance mode in a flash.you can actually feel it try and spin the rear wheels turning out of junctions. once you have built up your speed it goes back into economy mode so not just power all the time wich is what a lot of plug in ones do as they just boost fuel etc...
if you want to go all the way with bottom end grunt you need the full works for throttle response. chip/air filter/exhaust etc and if your still not happy buy a v8 and gas it lol
Click to expand...

Hi Mark

Yep sounds the same as mine !
Done the V8 Thing with gas 5 times ! 3 had head gasket/liner issues.
Ive got used to the (lack of) torque but I think Eminez hasnt got his head around the amount of throttle it needs (lots).
Maybe those big wheels arent helping either as theyre bound to have an effect on gearing.
Perhaps a supercharger is the answer ! ;)

Steve
 
javars said:
Hi Mark

Yep sounds the same as mine !
Done the V8 Thing with gas 5 times ! 3 had head gasket/liner issues.
Ive got used to the (lack of) torque but I think Eminez hasnt got his head around the amount of throttle it needs (lots).
Maybe those big wheels arent helping either as theyre bound to have an effect on gearing.
Perhaps a supercharger is the answer ! ;)

Steve
Click to expand...


yep lol i also been there with the gas and the liners. and yep i think he just needs to get used to a 2.5 pulling a big hump around, maybe better when the chip is set propper. 1 thing got me thinking was why it was set low in the 1st place.if i was selling it with a chip i would want it to pull well for a test drive?
 
Hi guys,

from the news desk:

done a servicing today, it was due at 60K anyway, and the last one was 7000 miles ago.

I also wanted to know from a official dealer, and somebody I could talk to face to face and offer my opinions on 1 week driving since purchased, what and what not..., here are the results from leaving the car in the hands of Charlie at JLC Ltd in (Land Rover/Jaguar) Hernie Hill London for one day:

- full recommended 60K service done.
- they dont like chips, so they didnt bother with it (more on this below)



now the notes they wrote on the job sheet:
(under brackets - my comments / help me?)


1. "due to customer complaints advise, adaptor reset"
(YES, I mentioned the little power at low revs and the fact that if not in 4th gear, the revs drop down to 1000 (neutral level) if not accelerating... -
is this the ECU he did a reset? - Charlie did mention he was going to reset the ECU so it starts assimilating my driving behaviour...)

2. "front wipers worn"
(I will get some on ebay and fit them myself - it has to be easy...)

3. "high tone horn not working"
(I didnt know the P38 had 2 horns - I dont need the second, I think)

4. "Plenum grill mesh torn" (can get this on ebay and fit it myself?)

5. "slight play in front anti-roll bar - drop 1 mks" -
(???)

6. "Exhaust center box split (leaking) - maybe cause of power loss / note: massive corrosion on exhaust"
(eh eh... I think this is the first real problem - problem nr. 1 - I checked it from below and it has a 1/2 inch opening on one of the exhaust center boxes...! and its true most of the exhaust system is well corroded...need to get a new one asap!)

7. "Engine cam cover leaking oil"
(problem nr. 2 - need to get a new gasket!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)


8. "Gearbox oil cooler pipes leaking - top up at service"
(problem nr. 3)

9. "Front and rear discs heavily lipped but new pads fitted"
(need to change break discs soon?????????)

10. "turbo boost hoses slightly weak"
(problem nr. 4??????????/)

11. "Diesel spill pipes leaking"
(what does this mean?????)


END


now, I think item nr. 6, 7, 8 and 10 are probably affecting my low rev power... Charlie thinks the car drives well for a P38, actually, he thinks the car does need some repair (to these points above) asap, but it is a great example and one of the best he has seen with this mileage, some of these issues will happen sooner or later and he has the impression this is the first time they are happening to my RR.

He was honest and I was releaved.

Now, I am in to spend anything between 1000-1500 + VAT on all this....

surely I can get lots from e-blag, etc etc...


guys, let me know what you think!



PS: ON THE CHIP (TUNIT)...

after returning home after the service I did the adjustment to the Tunit III... well I dont really know what happened but I turned the screw like 15 times to the right and there is no exhaust smoke?! I let the engine run, step by step I accelerated, kickdown a few times, no smoke... just neighbours looking at the windows....

my engine does not produce any smoke....!?!!


I dont know, i left it at 6 clicks to the righ and went for a drive, from 2000 revs up it kicks in, goes really high on the turbo, it becomes HULK!!!

Its like it wants to fly!!

dont like that... what i want is smooth power, gradual power, not a shot of morphine!...

came back home, put it at 3 clicks and nothing really happens...

I am puzzled...

so:

1. up to 15 clicks, my engine doesnt smoke...
2. can't seem to get the right click count for ballanced efficiency/power
3. I believe the best is to just find a Tunit dealer who can do it for me...

Mark: you said yours is right at max?

do you get this surge in power from the turbo when accelerating smoothly or does the power comes gradually?



YOUR COMMENTS ARE WELL APPRECIATED!

thanks for reading.
 
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