110 300tdi cranks but wont start, perhaps fuel starved

I have not checked the FIP, I'll add that to my list for when I'm next out. Fuel line still hasn't turned up for my to test with a can of fuel.

I couldn't find a battery charger, so gonna borrow one tomorrow. I did go back out though to have another look at things.

Took both lines off the fuel filter, both leaked out a little fuel. On a whim I took the fuel filter off, to find its only half full? So here's me pumping away at the fuel lift pump, only putting a dribble of fuel in the filter at a time so no wonder nothing was coming out the bleed screw.

So I've been cranking the engine till the battery went flat, yet the fuel filter is only half full. I honestly don't know what that means.

It certainly won't start in that case!
Fuel either isn't getting to the lift pump
Tank empty?
Pickup tube blocked?
Air getting in somewhere between the pick up pipe and the lift pump?
Imagine trying to suck(lift pump) water (fuel)out of a glass (fuel tank) using a straw, it would be easy. The straw now has a hole in the side above the level of the water- now it's very difficult or impossible depending on the hole size in the straw to suck up the water.
The straw on your Landy is your fuel system/pipes up to the lift pump.
The sucking is done by the lift pump, if the straw is good then no water coming out the straw means you don't have the capacity to suck good enough- lift pump faulty, lines to it incorrectly fitted.
Once the fuel is sucked up inside the inlet of the lift pump it's pumped out of the outlet up to the fuel filter with decent flow and pressure NOT a pathetic dribble.

Take the outlet pipe off the lift pump at the filter and crank the engine, fuel should flow freely and plentiful.
Stick the fuel line from the filter to the injector pump in a can of fuel
and I bet she will start. Retighten any injector pipes first.
I wouldn't bother bleeding the air out for that test, the fuel run is short and the TDI self bleeds anyway.
Check your cambelt hasn't snapped first before any of the above though!

Sorry for abandoning this, had a rough few months and only just getting my life sorted out again, everything's been a bit of a mess!

Finally got around to doing a little work on it today, I think I've narrowed it down to the fuel injection pump.

I tried cranking the engine with the fuel pipe disconnected from the injection unit, no fuel came out. I then tried cranking the engine with the pipe that goes *in* the injection unit disconnected and fuel came pouring out the pipe.

I think, unfortunatly, that's pretty certain to be my fuel injection pump.

Glad your getting things sorted, the landy is a great distraction
I’m not convinced it’s the fuel injection pump as they are pretty robust
I thing it’s an air problem as mentioned previously based on half full fuel filter( have you changed the fuel filter)
Did you try flossies test with a pipe from injector pump into a can of clean diesel so it siphons to injector pump

try this and this should prove injection pump ok and then a problem getting fuel to filter from tank

Sorry for not replying for like a month, managed to get to the point where I can work on the landy again. Been having a right faff on trying to get pipes to run to fuel can with them being rigid and loopy tubes, along with them having banjo connectors. soaked them (with the ends sticking out) in hot water to free them up and put the battery on charge so tomorrow I'll go out and give it a try running directly from a fuel can into the fuel injectors. Must also remember to put the line from the manual pump into a jar or bottle so I don't send fuel flying everywhere!

Alright then, went out today to give it a test. So fuel filter disconnected with the line that comes from the lift pump going into a bottle (to the the fuel spurting everywhere) and the line that runs to the Fuel Injection Pump going straight into a fresh container of diesel fuel.

Unfortunatly lots of cranking, but not even a splutter or cough of trying to start. I also tried loosening the Fuel Injector Pipes to see if any fuel seeped out, but they were bone dry. I then loosened the pipe that runs to the fuel injection pump and found there was a little fuel in there. I'm unfamilier with the internals of the Fuel Injector Pump, but it seems to me that its trying to suck fuel in, but unable to pump it out.

I uploaded a couple of short videos just so people could see (incase I've made a blunder somewhere, though I'm pretty sure the test was correct).




Thanks for everyones patience, and for all the suggestions! I think I've ruled out everything else at this point, but it would be nice if someone can confim before I look at pulling the injector out

Stuck solenoid on the fuel pump?
With that pressure from the lift pump it should be working

I dont think its the shut off solenoid as when this first happened I replaced it (with only a few hundred miles use) with a brand new unit, I also ran a new live wire straight from the battery to the solenoid to ensure it had a good feed. I've also tested it while removed and it functioned correctly.

Yeah I thought pressure from the lift pump seemed good, so no problems getting the fuel from the tank to the Injector Pump by the looks of it. Just problems once it gets there :/

Ok.... connect the fuel up & loosen an injector pipe(watch out for the high pressure spray) crank again

Hicap phill said:

Ok.... connect the fuel up & loosen an injector pipe(watch out for the high pressure spray) crank again

Click to expand...

Thats what I've done in the 1st video, the pipes to the first 2 cylinders are undone but no fuel comes out when cranked. Not even a dribble of fuel

Only looked at vid2
Have you removed the 3 screws of the front plate to make sure the cam belt is moving?

Hicap phill said:

Only looked at vid2
Have you removed the 3 screws of the front plate to make sure the cam belt is moving?

Click to expand...

Lift pump wouldn't work if the belt was broke as it's camshaft driven.
OP- have you checked you have 12v at the fuel solenoid with ign on AND whilst cranking?

Flossie said:

Lift pump wouldn't work if the belt was broke as it's camshaft driven.
OP- have you checked you have 12v at the fuel solenoid with ign on AND whilst cranking?

Click to expand...

Dam your good... forgot they are belt driven

Hicap phill said:

Dam your good... forgot they are belt driven

Click to expand...

Still worth a look though as it may be possible (unlikely) that the FIP pulley has sheared all three bolts and is spinning on the drive shaft taper. So pulley is turning but the FIP isn't.

@Flossie
Can you undo the 2 torxs on the base of the pump to see if diesel is moving through?
(I know if they go loose you loose diesel fast )
Unsure what this part is called or it does

CaptainHair said:

Alright then, went out today to give it a test. So fuel filter disconnected with the line that comes from the lift pump going into a bottle (to the the fuel spurting everywhere) and the line that runs to the Fuel Injection Pump going straight into a fresh container of diesel fuel.

Unfortunatly lots of cranking, but not even a splutter or cough of trying to start. I also tried loosening the Fuel Injector Pipes to see if any fuel seeped out, but they were bone dry. I then loosened the pipe that runs to the fuel injection pump and found there was a little fuel in there. I'm unfamilier with the internals of the Fuel Injector Pump, but it seems to me that its trying to suck fuel in, but unable to pump it out.

I uploaded a couple of short videos just so people could see (incase I've made a blunder somewhere, though I'm pretty sure the test was correct).




Thanks for everyones patience, and for all the suggestions! I think I've ruled out everything else at this point, but it would be nice if someone can confim before I look at pulling the injector out

Click to expand...

if lift pump works reconnect it,injection pump isnt going to suck it up from a container,take the plunger out of the solenoid

Flossie said:

Lift pump wouldn't work if the belt was broke as it's camshaft driven.
OP- have you checked you have 12v at the fuel solenoid with ign on AND whilst cranking?

Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure I did when I had the multimeter out. Also battery is in great condition and wire to solenoid is directly from battery (bypassing the ignition) to make certain. I'll add removing the plunger and spring from solenoid to my list though just to 100% rule it out.

Hicap phill said:

@Flossie
Can you undo the 2 torxs on the base of the pump to see if diesel is moving through?
(I know if they go loose you loose diesel fast )
Unsure what this part is called or it does

Click to expand...

I can't find any diagrams mentioning these screws, closest I've found the the 2 that hold the blanking plate on at the side near the bottom, part 40 on this diagram? https://injectionpumps.co.uk/interactive/interactive-bosch-ve-parts-diagram.htm

jamesmartin said:

if lift pump works reconnect it,injection pump isnt going to suck it up from a container,take the plunger out of the solenoid

Click to expand...

Oh I thought the injection pump was powerful enough to suck fuel from a container, otherwise my previous test doesn't really count for much. I made sure the container was up on the wing, higher than the engine and pump to help fuel flow.

So on my to-test list is;
1: Try a regular start with everything connected, but spring and plunger removed from solenoid to rule it out 100%
2: Check for torx screws at bottom of fuel pump, loosen them if I can and see if fuel runs out. - I'm cautious about unscrewing anything from the pump so I'll try and find a picture or diagram to confirm before I actually unscrew anything.
3: Take the inspection plate off and check the pully doesnt wobble around (sheared bolts).
4: Find some way of rigging up fuel to be pushed into fuel pump? I'm not sure how I'd do it due to the banjo ends. I could I suppose buy another fuel line, chop the banjo off one end and fit a funnel, then attach the other end to the pump and fill with diesel?

Cheers for help and suggestions again guys, I'll try and be prompt with the testing and come back with results.

Mine sucks fuel all the way from the rear tank of my 110 and I haven't got a manual lift pump, got a 12v facet but it packed up so I took the fuse out.
Starts and runs well even after a fuel filter change.
Just had another thought, I know nowt about them , but I wonder if yours has Zeus timing gears and one has lost its teeth so the FIP isn't turning.
Another long shot...

Well it started up! Even got a round of appause from the neighbours and 2 different cars stopped to congratulate me on getting it going again.

I reconnected everything as normal, cranked the engine a bit with the fuel filter bleed open just to get a bit of fuel through. Then I removed the shut off solenoid plunger and spring, started up first time! Actually started up really well considering its been sat about 6 months now.

I'm honestly not sure what to think, as I'm pretty certain I tried it with the plunger and spring removed back when I was stuck at the side of the road. I also know for certain that I tested the solenoid when removed from the car and it worked fine. Also this was a brand new solenoid, purchased incase the last one was at fault.

So either I've had a failed solenoid and replaced it with another solenoid thats half-failed enough strength to work off the car, but not when fitted. Or I've had a seperate problem of some kind that has been remedied by all my poking and prodding around in the fuel system. I think I'll test it off the car again, see if it still "works" when not fitted. I'll also check the voltage while cranking with a multimeter while I'm at it.

Could it perhaps be something obscure like, the engine not earthing correctly, so when fitted and earthing through the engine, its not getting a good enough connection to function?

Just as a reminder, first symptoms of this was when I tried to start it up one day it just turned over and over with no sign of starting (as if there was no fuel, so just cranking but no firing). Left it for 10-20 minutes and it fired up first time. Then about 10 minutes into our trip it shut off.

Honestly I'm just flummoxed, clearly more testing is needed. I'm gonna test it again with the plunger and spring fitted (to try and confirm this as the fault) and if it doesnt start with it refitted I'll remove it, test it again off the car and test the battery voltage with the multimter.

Thanks again so much for the help guys, if theres anymore suggestions while I'm testing feel free to suggest them, but I'll be back here with results of my tests once I've done them.

Bloomin land rovers eh!

CaptainHair said:

I'm pretty sure I did when I had the multimeter out. Also battery is in great condition and wire to solenoid is directly from battery (bypassing the ignition) to make certain. I'll add removing the plunger and spring from solenoid to my list though just to 100% rule it out.


I can't find any diagrams mentioning these screws, closest I've found the the 2 that hold the blanking plate on at the side near the bottom, part 40 on this diagram? https://injectionpumps.co.uk/interactive/interactive-bosch-ve-parts-diagram.htm


Oh I thought the injection pump was powerful enough to suck fuel from a container, otherwise my previous test doesn't really count for much. I made sure the container was up on the wing, higher than the engine and pump to help fuel flow.

So on my to-test list is;
1: Try a regular start with everything connected, but spring and plunger removed from solenoid to rule it out 100%
2: Check for torx screws at bottom of fuel pump, loosen them if I can and see if fuel runs out. - I'm cautious about unscrewing anything from the pump so I'll try and find a picture or diagram to confirm before I actually unscrew anything.
3: Take the inspection plate off and check the pully doesnt wobble around (sheared bolts).
4: Find some way of rigging up fuel to be pushed into fuel pump? I'm not sure how I'd do it due to the banjo ends. I could I suppose buy another fuel line, chop the banjo off one end and fit a funnel, then attach the other end to the pump and fill with diesel?

Cheers for help and suggestions again guys, I'll try and be prompt with the testing and come back with results.

Click to expand...

if fuel squirts from lift pump connect it all up and leave the front banjo bolt pon injection pump loose,pump liftp pump till clean diesel appears,tighten banjo and try,pump will only suck up fuel once its full,it wont if it has air in it, hence once running and lift pump fails its often not noticed till system needs to be bled up after a filter change or similar