Georgeblade · Aug 27, 2023

Hello
Looking for alittle help here please.

Just replaced the tie rod ball joints in my D1 200tdi.

Haynes says tighten to 40nm.

This seems low to me given the job they perform.

Has anyone got experience if what rhey should be?

Many thanks

NPG · Aug 27, 2023

I could only find the following online. It's for a D1 300Tdi spec but I'm thinking they should work for yours. I agree that the torque seems uncomfortably low for a steering ball joint but it appears that Haynes is right.

Georgeblade · Aug 27, 2023

NPG said:
I could only find the following online. It's for a D1 300Tdi spec but I'm thinking they should work for yours. I agree that the torque seems uncomfortably low for a steering ball joint but it appears that Haynes is right.

Many thanks NPG. Seems everyone I know says 40Nm too.
As you say - feels a bit low but hey ho.

GRATCH · Aug 27, 2023

The ball joint taper locks it firmly in place, not the nut.

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

At the end of the day, as we all know when it comes to separating a ball joint once the nut it loosened, the friction between the conical parts holding it together is massive, so the nut is really only holding those two parts in place. If the two parts were straight cylindrical then it'd be a different matter.

marjon · Aug 27, 2023

The split pin stops the nut dropping off

.

J

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
The split pin stops the nut dropping off .

J

If you can find one with a split pin on it! not in this case nor in any others I have worked on for ages now! Maybe a nylock though.

marjon · Aug 27, 2023

Stanleysteamer said:
If you can find one with a split pin on it! not in this case nor in any others I have worked on for ages now! Maybe a nylock though.

I will some what disagree with that.
if its a nyloc you will come up against the nylon before the taper has seated. How do you hold it? Oh is it now a stupid hex in the head of the shaft?
cos that’s even worse

Castled nut wind it down til tight by hand, plus 1/4 turn with a socket, taper is set, turn it till you see a hole for split pin job done.

Last 1 I did albeit only a lowly defender.

J

discool · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
The split pin stops the nut dropping off .

J

Yes because a castle nut is locked with a split pin so can’t come loose, and also it can be reused using just a new pin, but a nylock nut should only be used once.

loads of both types on eBay for the D1. When I replaced my D1s steering ball joints I used these which are OEM so used by LR.

Anaconda · Aug 27, 2023

Most have a nylon lock nut now, in general not just Land Rover.

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
I will some what disagree with that.
if its a nyloc you will come up against the nylon before the taper has seated. How do you hold it? Oh is it now a stupid hex in the head of the shaft?
cos that’s even worse

Castled nut wind it down til tight by hand, plus 1/4 turn with a socket, taper is set, turn it till you see a hole for split pin job done.

Last 1 I did albeit only a lowly defender.

J

Have to say that, yes it can be tricky tightening a nyloc down, there are ways, however, as you say it is now an Allen key hex in the end of the taper joints threaded end. I am totally with you re the old skool castellated nut and split pin. One has to imagine that mechs from later on cannot handle the idea of a split pin.

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

discool said:
Yes because a castle nut is locked with a split pin so can’t come loose, and also it can be reused using just a new pin, but a nylock nut should only be used once.

loads of both types on eBay for the D1. When I replaced my D1s steering ball joints I used these which are OEM so used by LR.

View attachment 296349

I have heard an argument that a nyloc can be used up to three times, but who the heck would ever count? Or melt the nylon then reuse it. (cf @kevstar I believe) But new nylocs are cheap enough. Or a sprung/lock washer.

marjon · Aug 27, 2023

discool said:
but a nylock nut should only be used once.

Again I would suggest if you can wind it past the nylon by hand its US.
I used to generally say third time is the bin. We used to teach to punch the 2inch nuts so we all knew. But they were holding a straight joint.

But the cost of a new split pin is cheaper than a nut

.

J

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
Again I would suggest if you can wind it past the nylon by hand its US.
I used to generally say third time is the bin. We used to teach to punch the 2inch nuts so we all knew. But they were holding a straight joint.

But the cost of a new split pin is cheaper than a nut .

J

I love idea of actooly giving a poop about the cost of split pins as opposed to nuts!!!

So was it you or @kevstar who advocated the counting of the times used?
I'm getting befuddled!!

Anaconda · Aug 27, 2023

I imagine it's down to speed in the factory. It far quicker to wind a nut on with a impact gun set at a specific torque than fath about with a split pin.

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

Anaconda said:
I imagine it's down to speed in the factory. It far quicker to wind a nut on with a impact gun set at a specific torque than fath about with a split pin.

Deffo right I'd say!

Anaconda · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
Again I would suggest if you can wind it past the nylon by hand its US.
I used to generally say third time is the bin. We used to teach to punch the 2inch nuts so we all knew. But they were holding a straight joint.

But the cost of a new split pin is cheaper than a nut .

J

I changed my rear shocks the other year and reused the top nylon lock nut, it fell off!
Changed the top mount bracket and fitted a new nut shortly afterwards.
Wondered what the banging noise was.

marjon · Aug 27, 2023

Anaconda said:
I imagine it's down to speed in the factory. It far quicker to wind a nut on with a impact gun set at a specific torque than fath about with a split pin.

You couldn’t wind a nyloc nut down a ball joint (taper shaft) without setting the taper first.

personally I think it’s about competence.

J

Stanleysteamer · Aug 27, 2023

Anaconda said:
I changed my rear shocks the other year and reused the top nylon lock nut, it fell off!
Changed the top mount bracket and fitted a new nut shortly afterwards.
Wondered what the banging noise was.

Dunno what Disco you've got if indeed it is a Disco but on my Disco 2 my nearside rear shock top bolt started going round and round, I thort "It'll be OK". after 6 months in Frogland, got to channel port after hearing clunking noise, had a look, sho nuff the bolt had fellen oot.

So back in blighty fitted a longer bolt and then a lock nut on the end, flipping fiddly but it's been OK ever since.

Anaconda · Aug 27, 2023

marjon said:
You couldn’t wind a nyloc nut down a ball joint (taper shaft) without setting the taper first.

personally I think it’s about competence.

J

Don't remember the top mount being a tapered shaft.
You can wind a nylon lock nut onto a ball joint with an impact gun.

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