crumplezone
New Member
That is not a defender and it's missing 10" (the wife pointed that out!).[/quote]
Er but was she even talking landrover?
Er but was she even talking landrover?
Landyjd
Active Member
I am so disappointed in Land Rover. They have completely missed the point of the Defender and done everything I hoped they wouldn't.
It should be simple in design for a start. They would be best to as least keep the current look which everyone loves. It also looks like they have gotten rid of beam axles and the ladder chassis. That automatically means that it is not a Defender. If utes can still use beam axles and ladder chassis then the Defender certainly should. It is a utility vehicle. What sort of ute could the produce from that concept, or are they not even going to bother?
And the final nail in the coffin; who on earth will be able to do any sort of work in the field on that vehicle? You will have to take a trained mechanical team on off-road trips in case you break something!
It should be simple in design for a start. They would be best to as least keep the current look which everyone loves. It also looks like they have gotten rid of beam axles and the ladder chassis. That automatically means that it is not a Defender. If utes can still use beam axles and ladder chassis then the Defender certainly should. It is a utility vehicle. What sort of ute could the produce from that concept, or are they not even going to bother?
And the final nail in the coffin; who on earth will be able to do any sort of work in the field on that vehicle? You will have to take a trained mechanical team on off-road trips in case you break something!
LR90
Active Member
I think that would put a lot of people off the idea of ever buying a Defender. I did find another "design" which if I had to make a choice I would choose.
I agree the N1 is a far far far better design N2 is going backwards!! If they have to change it which it looks 100% they are going to. i would much prefer a sympathetic design to the defender.
tombardier
Well-Known Member
I think the main thing is that they have to change it by 2015, as the defender in its current incarnation will no longer be legal to sell due to newer EU regulations. I think they could do a lot to improve the defender without ruining it though. I don't expect it to happen though.
Hungrydave
New Member
I initially reacted much in the same way as most folk on here. But, it's growing on me.
As others pointed out, this is the concept / starting point from which the production model will take some of it's design cues.
All concept cars come with ridiculous wheels but if you swap those with some steel or standard alloy wheels, raise it up a bit and take the god awful writing off the side then... It's less horrific.
The autocar article quoted a land rover spokesperson. It was along the lines of "we need to start with something and this concept allows us to guage the reaction from different market segments".
I think they're doing it all right - trying to maintain the brand, move it forward as a viable product and also build in time to get feedback and input before the final design is settled.
I think we all know that outside a decreasing band of enthusiasts and utility users, the defender is losing out to the more modern design and reliability of the Japanese manufacturers. Particularly overseas. Land Rover need to address this hence what we're seeing the early stages of in their concept car.
Personally, I prefer my 300tdi 110 csw... But I wouldn't buy a new one now anyway so doubt I'm their target market.
As others pointed out, this is the concept / starting point from which the production model will take some of it's design cues.
All concept cars come with ridiculous wheels but if you swap those with some steel or standard alloy wheels, raise it up a bit and take the god awful writing off the side then... It's less horrific.
The autocar article quoted a land rover spokesperson. It was along the lines of "we need to start with something and this concept allows us to guage the reaction from different market segments".
I think they're doing it all right - trying to maintain the brand, move it forward as a viable product and also build in time to get feedback and input before the final design is settled.
I think we all know that outside a decreasing band of enthusiasts and utility users, the defender is losing out to the more modern design and reliability of the Japanese manufacturers. Particularly overseas. Land Rover need to address this hence what we're seeing the early stages of in their concept car.
Personally, I prefer my 300tdi 110 csw... But I wouldn't buy a new one now anyway so doubt I'm their target market.
timtheenchanteruk
Well-Known Member
as long as the new defender doesn't end up along the same lines as the new "mini" or the new "beetle" seeing as these too were supposed to be modern interpretations of the original design.
Karlos28
Well-Known Member
I agree fully, they are both fails if you ask me. But, fair enough, they sell!
That 'defender' looks more like one of those skoda yeti's or the '4x4' mini.. But I do quite like that yeti..
I agree also, 'N1' is much better. Still not nice and I wouldn't have one..
Is this BMW's doing?
O Bife
Active Member
Instead of giving it a radical new face lift why don't they just concentrate on getting it sorted mechanically so that it passes the up-coming EU rulings.
As for it's design and as many have already said, if it ain't broken, don't fix it!
You guys at Land Rover, I reckon you should start listening to Jo public a bit more than so called designers looking to make a name for them selves.
As for it's design and as many have already said, if it ain't broken, don't fix it!
You guys at Land Rover, I reckon you should start listening to Jo public a bit more than so called designers looking to make a name for them selves.
Well... i think LZ will have to start a whole new forum section for these so-called defenders... where people can discuss such critical issues as upholstry options, how to plug it into a diagnostics computer and where to keep one's fluffy pink toy for demisting the windows on winter mornings... mind you they've probably got heated windows! How can they call it a defender?! can't see the MOD being too impressed.
YUCK!
YUCK!
tombardier
Well-Known Member
the MOD have abandoned land rovers after all of the negative publicity regarding them not being invulnerable to explosives - so the MOD are probably not in the list of concerns.
ah right... so they'll be using hilux's now then?!
if ever there was a brilliant piece of marketing propoganda it was that episode of top gear! if i had a quid for every time i've been fixing my landy and someone comes by and says - you should have got a hilux, they're indesructable... and they can fly to the moon you know!
tombardier
Well-Known Member
they're using vehicles by some other companies, but they don't make conventional consumer vehicles.
Tata must love social climbers and businesses that buy new range rovers every couple of years, non genuine parts have eroded their spares profits I would guess.
So build a machine that last decades or build tat that falls to bits in a decade- tata will build rubbish at a guess it is more profitable.
Remember tata loadbeta V peugeot 504 pickup-loadbeta fell apart
So build a machine that last decades or build tat that falls to bits in a decade- tata will build rubbish at a guess it is more profitable.
Remember tata loadbeta V peugeot 504 pickup-loadbeta fell apart
300bhp/ton
Well-Known Member
I don't think they've missed the point at all. Remember the Defender is currently sold in very few countries, most notably not in America (and I think maybe not even Oz anymore either, or least in tiny numbers if they do).
It may have utilitarian origins and some such as farmers and a few others might still buy them as work horses. But for many years the Defender has been far more a "lifestyle" vehicle than anything else. Look at all the urban trim, big alloys, silver trim dash and big plastic bull bars you can currently get from LR for a Defender.
Also it's worth noting, on a World stage the Defender would be up against vehicles such as these:
And while we in blighty see the Defender as a true workhorse type vehicle. Places like the US don't, they see them as recreational vehicles. Their workhorses are more like this:
What LR should do, is make a double cab LR4 on something like a Ford F150 chassis but utilising Land Rover running gear. Of course as there aren't owned by Ford any longer that won't happen. But they could still do something similar.
While I'm keen to know what running gear and engine options the new Defender is likely to have, I have to admit to liking the way it potentially looks.
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300bhp/ton
Well-Known Member
Yeah but N1 was 100% Ford Bronco concept that Landy (probably forced by Ford) jumped on the band wagon for.
Remember early Bronco's where about the same size as a current 90, with similar styling and very, very good off road.
ZeDefender
New Member
"Safety issues" - okay, so fit a rollcage (hide it even) and airbags... sorted
As for EU emissions - we are pretty strict here in Germany and the current (Puma) Defenders have a green light throughout.
Besides, there is a limit to how much (or little) CO2 you can get from burning diesel. As for electric Defenders - I think not (please God no)
Matt
As for EU emissions - we are pretty strict here in Germany and the current (Puma) Defenders have a green light throughout.
Besides, there is a limit to how much (or little) CO2 you can get from burning diesel. As for electric Defenders - I think not (please God no)
Matt
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