Its this bloody PC crap again isn't it. The wife occationally helps when my daughters class go off site on some trip. Even though her daughter is there and she is with the teacher, she had to have a CRB check. Money making exercise is what it is cus at the end of the day, how many people in the population are really nasty perverts, kiddy fiddlers etc? A very small minority, but like global warming, its a political excuse to make money.
 
Sean said:
not wishing to sound argumentative (honest) - but where the fook did you get that pearl of nonsense from ?
Click to expand...


It does make it sound like Ambulance people wont come to your house unless you are CRB'd:D:D:D
 
The brief as I understand it is to support the blue light services, not do their job. In the case of Seans examples then it is clear these individuals over stepped the mark. If there is a damgerious situation developing such as the rolled car had caught on fire with the driver stuck inside then any one can see that something has to be done now. However, to administer detailed recovery treatment to the driver is wrong. Basic stuff only if necessary.
 
Sean said:
not wishing to sound argumentative (honest) - but where the fook did you get that pearl of nonsense from ?
Click to expand...
You're right Sean, the CRB check makes sure you have no police record that affects your credability to be in the position in question. But what if you have never been caught.......

(Not you personally, a hypothetical agruement)
 
Darmain said:
Its this bloody PC crap again isn't it. The wife occationally helps when my daughters class go off site on some trip. Even though her daughter is there and she is with the teacher, she had to have a CRB check. Money making exercise is what it is cus at the end of the day, how many people in the population are really nasty perverts, kiddy fiddlers etc? A very small minority, but like global warming, its a political excuse to make money.
Click to expand...

having been CRB is an irrelevance in the context of what these response groups are becoming involved with
 
Alas this thread is bringing out the hi viz cock masters.
But thank you for providing the entertainment.

You want to deliver meals on wheels because the pc correct neighbours don 't give a **** about the vulnerable- by all means do it.

You want to do recoveries and as Sean said some don't have a clue-leave it to the professionals.

Strikes me as join the club and have something to prove, Personally I've encountered some right tossers in hi viz.
 
I only do response recovery work for Nelly....and thats only so we can laff at him
 
Darmain said:
However, to administer detailed recovery treatment to the driver is wrong. Basic stuff only if necessary.
Click to expand...

what level of first response training do these groups provide or expect their members to have or had before they send them out ?

the ability to open a tin of germoline and apply a sticky plaster ?
 
redhand said:
Biggest delay is that Wessex insist all their members undergo a CRB check. meself I think it's pointless cos under no circumstances at all should a responder be left alone with a vulnerable adult or child.
Click to expand...

Std CRB check would not cover you in that situation anyway you would need the enhanced CRB check to be left in sole charge of vulnerable adults or children. I process the paperwork for the CRB checks for our directorate at a large General Hospital.

There are three types of CRB check,

  1. basic which is just to check for unspent convictions. which may affect you suitability for a job.
  2. Standard which allows you to work the children and vulnerable adults.
  3. Enhanced which allows you to care for, train, supervise or be soley in charge of children and vulnerable adults.
Most of the voluntary rescue groups CRB their active members.
 
Sean said:
we get to see a fair few of these responders in action, and it's quite scary how little (if any) training and/or experience they have - i guess they mean well BUT some of their actions are simply dangerous

2 examples

- small car rolled down a 20 foot embankment, landed on it's roof with the passenger suspended by the belt, complaining of neck pain - no SRS deployment

the very local 4x4 "rescue" bods were on scene within minutes and had stropped through the A posts and had started to drag the vehicle back up the slope - with the casualty still inside !

- 2 vehicle off sided on a 40 limit road, lots of frontal damage to both vehicles - 1 driver managed to get out, second driver was trapped by the pedals, slight bleed from both ears and very quiet

we arrive on scene to find a community first responder (medical) climbing into the back of the vehicle, after having first forced the drivers seat forward (3 door with the driver still sat in the seat) so that she could get in the back to provide c spine support

I'm all for these groups being used to ferry kit and people around but something has to be done to clip their wings as they are becoming more and more involved in activities they clearly are not qualified for
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more one of YL4x4 responders yesterday on his way back from transporting Hospice staff to work. He spotted the air ambulance coming into land near a busy & popular sledging spot and knowing the area realised they'd have a long trek from the only landing spot in the area. But he didn't drive up to the chopper. He went to the carpark where he knew the road ambulance would head for and liased with the crew to carry them to the casualty. and then transported them and the casualty to the chopper.

That's how it should be done. Not as some would have done gone speeding upto the chopper lights blaring and hand on horn. As I have heard of some peeps doing.

We had a member who was always going on about been allowed to fit blue lights to his vehicle and he was told straight off that's not what we're here for we support the emergency services we don't replace them.
 
Sean said:
what level of first response training do these groups provide or expect their members to have or had before they send them out ?

the ability to open a tin of germoline and apply a sticky plaster ?
Click to expand...

But the response groups aren't first responders and were never set up to be first responders In fact they're usually last response. their role is to provide transport to the council/emergency services/nhs staff etc. to allow them to get to somewhere that a average vehicle couldn't get to. and that it. in effect it's a community transport scheme. Once they've been called out by plod/council etc then they may be asked to recover stuck vehicles etc but they should never be asked to indulge in firstaid or rescue wreck recovery etc.
 
Sean said:
we arrive on scene to find a community first responder (medical) climbing into the back of the vehicle, after having first forced the drivers seat forward (3 door with the driver still sat in the seat) so that she could get in the back to provide c spine support
Click to expand...
I thought the role of community first responders was to hold De-fib equipment and administer treatment to heart attack victims, although they may have other first aid/medical training it's not a pre-requisit for the role.
 
Sean said:
we get to see a fair few of these responders in action, and it's quite scary how little (if any) training and/or experience they have - i guess they mean well BUT some of their actions are simply dangerous

2 examples

- small car rolled down a 20 foot embankment, landed on it's roof with the passenger suspended by the belt, complaining of neck pain - no SRS deployment

the very local 4x4 "rescue" bods were on scene within minutes and had stropped through the A posts and had started to drag the vehicle back up the slope - with the casualty still inside !

- 2 vehicle off sided on a 40 limit road, lots of frontal damage to both vehicles - 1 driver managed to get out, second driver was trapped by the pedals, slight bleed from both ears and very quiet

we arrive on scene to find a community first responder (medical) climbing into the back of the vehicle, after having first forced the drivers seat forward (3 door with the driver still sat in the seat) so that she could get in the back to provide c spine support

I'm all for these groups being used to ferry kit and people around but something has to be done to clip their wings as they are becoming more and more involved in activities they clearly are not qualified for
Click to expand...

The worst thing is training or not some of the things these idiots did it's common-sense not to do.
 
With reference to post #127

Thats a bit of a sad attitude. Just because some people don't get involved because they can't be arsed with the PC aspects that we live in, doesn't mean we all have to live that way. People are that way as I found out from clearing the snow in February (See earlier post). Can't be arsed to do the job and can't be arsed to say thank you. They can break their necks when they fall next time cus I'm not helping them again. However, that doesn't mean I stop helping anybody.

I also can't see what is to be proved. These organisations are not supposed to be front line. You're right, leave it to the professionals but give those professionals help when they need it. Is there anything wrong with that?

If and I say 'If' I decide to join up in the future then its not so I can strut about looking important. I am not that kind of person and I'd prefer to do my bit and get the hell out. If the conditions mean that Hi Vi's are a must then I would wear one, but a cock master I am not.
 
redhand said:
community transport scheme.
Click to expand...

so I'd suggest it was called 4x4 community transport response scheme.

But I'm guessing people wouldn't join at the thought of ferrying OAP's round.

post 127- that would be me, I'm not specifically calling anyone a cock, but you have to agree it attracts the numpties.
I've been there,done recovery work and am of the opinion that.
1)unless specifically sanctioned to do it-you could legally be up **** creek if it goes wrong.
2)without the correct gear and insurance-up **** creek
3) way the schemes portrayed attracts wrong individuals- community volunteering would be better description.
4) nothing wrong with community volunteering
 
Last edited:
Sean said:
we get to see a fair few of these responders in action, and it's quite scary how little (if any) training and/or experience they have - i guess they mean well BUT some of their actions are simply dangerous

2 examples

- small car rolled down a 20 foot embankment, landed on it's roof with the passenger suspended by the belt, complaining of neck pain - no SRS deployment

the very local 4x4 "rescue" bods were on scene within minutes and had stropped through the A posts and had started to drag the vehicle back up the slope - with the casualty still inside !

- 2 vehicle off sided on a 40 limit road, lots of frontal damage to both vehicles - 1 driver managed to get out, second driver was trapped by the pedals, slight bleed from both ears and very quiet

we arrive on scene to find a community first responder (medical) climbing into the back of the vehicle, after having first forced the drivers seat forward (3 door with the driver still sat in the seat) so that she could get in the back to provide c spine support

I'm all for these groups being used to ferry kit and people around but something has to be done to clip their wings as they are becoming more and more involved in activities they clearly are not qualified for
Click to expand...


Thats a bloody frightening read :eek: why the fook didnt they leave it to the pro's like yourself in both instences.
ffs dragging a car on its roof with someone who is complaining of neck pain they must have been numpty.

also bleeding from ears and quiet that sounds VERY major to me:eek:
 
fanatic said:
so I'd suggest it was called 4x4 community transport response scheme.

But I'm guessing people wouldn't join at the thought of ferrying OAP's round.

funnily enough that is what our group is called, if ya check the web site www.cotag.net you will see that we have a slightly different approach to other groups.

and the main thing is helping the community in times of need.
Click to expand...
 
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