When is the US going to get "real" Land Rovers?

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R

R. David Steele

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Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?

Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?

And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?

 
I thought that bigger was better over there orelse why do they use the
HumVee, its as big as a tank, there's a yellow one up here in the north of
the UK, it make my disco look like a dinky toy.

Peter.

"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
>



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"Peter Seddon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I thought that bigger was better over there orelse why do they use the
> HumVee, its as big as a tank, there's a yellow one up here in the north of
> the UK, it make my disco look like a dinky toy.
>
> Peter.
>

you've hit the nail on the head it's as big as a tank
or more to the point as wide as a tank
they were designed to run in tank tracks

Andy
--
SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
It's big it's mean it's really really green


 


Because the average US motorist wouldn't be caught dead driving a diesel of
any kind, therefore most automakers don't bother trying to sell them. VW
and MB being execptions, but even they don't sell too many.

Also, the US government isn't going to spend US taxpayer's money to keep
British autoworkers employed, when they have their own workers to "keep
employed".




"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
>



 
Peter wrote:

>
>
> Because the average US motorist wouldn't be caught dead driving a diesel
> of
> any kind, therefore most automakers don't bother trying to sell them. VW
> and MB being execptions, but even they don't sell too many.
>
> Also, the US government isn't going to spend US taxpayer's money to keep
> British autoworkers employed, when they have their own workers to "keep
> employed".
>
>
>


MB? Milton Bradley? Diesel powered KerPlunk!?

And the argument about which country stays employed becomes a little more
academic when it's Ford who own LR.

However, I think that if .mil.us were to look for a smaller offroader then
the chances are they'd talk to Chrysler and ask for a revamp on the Jeep
rather than buy landies.

P.
 
On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 14:46:07 GMT, R. David Steele
<[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote:

>And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
>cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?


The US army does use a few Defenders: http://tinyurl.com/yt5pt
--
Charlie...
 
On Saturday, in article
<[email protected]>
[email protected]/OMEGA "R. David Steele" wrote:

> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?


I've seen comments on the web about them using "civilian" versions of
the Hummer. Something about them not having "armor".

The way things are going, I'm not sure I'd want Land Rover to be
associated with the US military.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."
 
Big diesel pickup trucks are very popular in North America these days. SUVs
and sedans are another story.

"Peter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> Because the average US motorist wouldn't be caught dead driving a diesel

of
> any kind, therefore most automakers don't bother trying to sell them. VW
> and MB being execptions, but even they don't sell too many.
>
> Also, the US government isn't going to spend US taxpayer's money to keep
> British autoworkers employed, when they have their own workers to "keep
> employed".
>
>
>
>
> "R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
> >
> > Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
> >
> > And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> > cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
> >

>
>



 
"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?


Isn't it something to do with us building vehicles which aren't up to US
safety specs? Initially I thought emissions, but then I thought perhaps not
:)


 
R. David Steele wrote:
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?


The main problem is that LR and Ford's marketing dept have trouble seeing
where they wouls fit in to the US market. They would be smaller than many US
pick-ups but would be more expensive to buy. They do not have the comfort
and luxury of a typical US pick-up and most of the market demands this. The
sheer utility of a Defender and the off-road ability would of course be
superior to most pick-ups but perhaps still not create a large enough market
to make them viable. LR continually say the no longer sell Defenders in the
US because of emmissions and passenger airbag issues - this of course is
nonsense as they sell thousands of Discoverys with exactly the same engine
and emmissions and fitting a passenger airbag is not beyond the engineering
wit of Lode Lane either. On the upside, the US will definitely get the new
Defender based on the T5 chassis in a few years, so you'll have to hang on.
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>

The two biggest problems are that US diesel is very porr quality with a high
sulfur content and modern high-tech turbo-diesels won't swallow it. The
other problem is that petrol is cheap and there in very little diesel-car
culture in the states yet. It would however be great to drive a 30mpg TD5 in
the states so you can tell all the tree-huggers who think you drive a
gas-guzzling SUV to **** off! :)

> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?


Politically, it is very difficult for the US to procure non-domestic
military kit. Even when the US military decided they must have British
Harriers, the top brass had to lie to congress and leap through all sorts of
hoops to make them look American before they could purchase them. Same thing
with the British Chobham armour used on all abrams tanks. The US Rangers
bought some special Defenders called RSOV but I doubt they will ever figure
very highly.

--
Julian
---------
= Pretentious Sig required =


 
R. David Steele <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote:

> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?


A question that has been asked by many US servicemen as well. Despite
our troops in the Gulf being known as "The Borrowers" by the US Army,
when it comes to 4x4s the US tries to borrow Defenders on a regular
basis since the Defender seems far better suited to desert warfare than
the Hummer. (This according to some of my friends who are currently "out
there" in the Gulf states>)

A better solution might be the new Discovery III, which apparently is a
much, much better off-roader than the Defender. I'm wondering, since one
option is to get a Disco III with a 4.4L Jaguar engine, how long it will
be before someone bolts on the supercharger from the Jag XJR/XKR to the
Disco?

--
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friendly advice in a flame-free environment.
 

"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
>



Because they do not meet their minimum crash and rollover standards.
Apparently they are good enough for us in the UK :-(
This will change with the new utility range which is only a year to
eighteen months from launch. Yippee!

Huw


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"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?


don't meet US crash regs , don't have airbags ....
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>

all the engines have been too small for the US market i nthe past, also
large cap V8s sell well enough

no doubt there is some technicla hitch as well

> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
>

and admit defeat, it's rear USS forces don't use domestic products, and
when they do they keep it specialised - however a lot of the non domestic
kit used by US forces is British in origin and / or design



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On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 16:47:46 GMT, "Exit" <[email protected]> wrote:

|R. David Steele wrote:
|> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
|
|The main problem is that LR and Ford's marketing dept have trouble seeing
|where they wouls fit in to the US market. They would be smaller than many US
|pick-ups but would be more expensive to buy. They do not have the comfort
|and luxury of a typical US pick-up and most of the market demands this. The
|sheer utility of a Defender and the off-road ability would of course be
|superior to most pick-ups but perhaps still not create a large enough market
|to make them viable. LR continually say the no longer sell Defenders in the
|US because of emmissions and passenger airbag issues - this of course is
|nonsense as they sell thousands of Discoverys with exactly the same engine
|and emmissions and fitting a passenger airbag is not beyond the engineering
|wit of Lode Lane either. On the upside, the US will definitely get the new
|Defender based on the T5 chassis in a few years, so you'll have to hang on.

Word was that we were going to get the TD6, not the TD5. And you
forget that we have a midsize and compact size pickup market.
All most all the big trucks have smaller brothers.

|>
|> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
|>
|The two biggest problems are that US diesel is very porr quality with a high
|sulfur content and modern high-tech turbo-diesels won't swallow it. The
|other problem is that petrol is cheap and there in very little diesel-car
|culture in the states yet. It would however be great to drive a 30mpg TD5 in
|the states so you can tell all the tree-huggers who think you drive a
|gas-guzzling SUV to **** off! :)

We have low sulfur diesel now. I have a VW Jette TDI back in the
states. In fact the US environmental laws are far more harsh
than anything in Europe.

BTW, Jeep is suppose to sell the Liberty with the Mercedes Common
Rail Diesel but that not yet happened.

|> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
|> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
|
|Politically, it is very difficult for the US to procure non-domestic
|military kit. Even when the US military decided they must have British
|Harriers, the top brass had to lie to congress and leap through all sorts of
|hoops to make them look American before they could purchase them. Same thing
|with the British Chobham armour used on all abrams tanks. The US Rangers
|bought some special Defenders called RSOV but I doubt they will ever figure
|very highly.

LD is now part of Ford Motor Company, just as Jeep is now part of
Mercedes.


 
..
|> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
|
|don't meet US crash regs , don't have airbags ....
|>
|> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
|>
|all the engines have been too small for the US market i nthe past, also
|large cap V8s sell well enough
|
|no doubt there is some technicla hitch as well

US gas prices are now going over $2 per gallon. That is making
the diesel look better.

|> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
|> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
|>
|and admit defeat, it's rear USS forces don't use domestic products, and
|when they do they keep it specialised - however a lot of the non domestic
|kit used by US forces is British in origin and / or design

The LD is now owned by Ford.

Just as Jeep is owned by Mercedes.


 

|> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
|> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
|
|A question that has been asked by many US servicemen as well. Despite
|our troops in the Gulf being known as "The Borrowers" by the US Army,
|when it comes to 4x4s the US tries to borrow Defenders on a regular
|basis since the Defender seems far better suited to desert warfare than
|the Hummer. (This according to some of my friends who are currently "out
|there" in the Gulf states>)
|
|A better solution might be the new Discovery III, which apparently is a
|much, much better off-roader than the Defender. I'm wondering, since one
|option is to get a Disco III with a 4.4L Jaguar engine, how long it will
|be before someone bolts on the supercharger from the Jag XJR/XKR to the
|Disco?

Any info on this??


 

|> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
|>
|> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
|>
|> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
|> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
|>
|
|
|Because they do not meet their minimum crash and rollover standards.
|Apparently they are good enough for us in the UK :-(
|This will change with the new utility range which is only a year to
|eighteen months from launch. Yippee!

Neither does the Hummer. Yet it is sold to the public.

and, btw, US gas prices are now climbing over $2 per gallon, or
so my wife recently told me. It may even reach $3 by summer.

 
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected]/OMEGA says...
>
> |> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
> |>
> |> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
> |>
> |> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> |> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
> |>
> |
> |
> |Because they do not meet their minimum crash and rollover standards.
> |Apparently they are good enough for us in the UK :-(
> |This will change with the new utility range which is only a year to
> |eighteen months from launch. Yippee!
>
> Neither does the Hummer. Yet it is sold to the public.
>
> and, btw, US gas prices are now climbing over $2 per gallon, or
> so my wife recently told me. It may even reach $3 by summer.
>
>


Can I come down there and get in on those bargin prices? :)
--
____________________
Remove "X" from email address to reply.
 
The hummer is sold but it is classified by the authorities as a truck (due
to weight mainly) and therefore does not have to comply to passenger car
standards.

As for the US military, it does use Land Rovers. IIRC US Marines and some
other special forces use them.

Take care
Pantelis (not living in the USA, just happens to know the above)


"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected]/OMEGA says...
> >
> > |> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
> > |>
> > |> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
> > |>
> > |> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> > |> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
> > |>
> > |
> > |
> > |Because they do not meet their minimum crash and rollover standards.
> > |Apparently they are good enough for us in the UK :-(
> > |This will change with the new utility range which is only a year to
> > |eighteen months from launch. Yippee!
> >
> > Neither does the Hummer. Yet it is sold to the public.
> >
> > and, btw, US gas prices are now climbing over $2 per gallon, or
> > so my wife recently told me. It may even reach $3 by summer.
> >
> >

>
> Can I come down there and get in on those bargin prices? :)
> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.



 
I thought that bigger was better over there orelse why do they use the
HumVee, its as big as a tank, there's a yellow one up here in the north of
the UK, it make my disco look like a dinky toy.

Peter.

"R. David Steele" <[email protected]/OMEGA> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Why can't the US get Defender 90s, 110s and 130s?
>
> Why can't we have diesel powered Landies?
>
> And why doesn't the US military use the Defender as a basic, and
> cheaper, vehicle for the average troops?
>



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Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.659 / Virus Database: 423 - Release Date: 15/04/2004


 
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