TD4 Gearbox

Hi all

I have a 2003 TD4 with 49.000 miles on the clock and i think my gearbox is on the way out it makes a loud grindind noise in first and second gear at low speeds when you take your foot of accelarator. The grinding noise also happens when you put full lock on at low speed in first or second gear like when turning into my drive. any advise or input would be gratefully recieved. thanks to all paulhed. p.s if it helps i dont think any of the fluids have ever been checked or topped up since the car was brand new . Cheers all

check yo VCU - it mite be yo IRD

Please could you tell me what a VCU is please and what is an IRD please

VCU,is the viscouis coupling unit..it sits in the middle of your propshaft and is designed to spin freely until you need 4 wheel drive, its a little bit like an automatic gearbox. when the prop spins past a certain point it locks up and puts drive to your rear wheeels.( it looks like a big black drum in the middle of the propshaft)
The IRD is the intermediate reduction drive..this is what drives the propshaft as the freelander is predominately front wheel drive...its a crown and pinion setup that takes the drive from the transmission through 90 degrees.( a liitle bit like part of the gearbox)
I think i got it all right....also if you do a search on the forum all these have been covered, there is also a way of checking the VCU, if you do a search it will explain it all.
D

Sorry chap, but it sounds very much like yer IRD. I have literaly just got in and sat down having replaced mine. Took me all day non stop!!!
Your best bet is to get your prop shaft off ASAP. If the VCU is seized it'll be winding up your IRD and the rear diff. With the shaft off you may be able to drive around for a bit longer while you save up and shop around.
Don't know what your like with the spanners. Taking the prop shaft off is a doddle. The IRD really ain't that bad but it's a bit fiddly.
Post back here if you need any advice.

Cheers for the advise mate if i take of the prop shaft will that stop the grinding noise so i will know that it is the ird. I am not bad with spanners so is it worth trying to change it out myself (will it keep the cost down)

cheers mate

will that stop the grinding noise

Possibly not as its very likely be the differential that is housed in the IRD. as you hear it on tight cornering. The fact it's grinding means there's something wrong now.
If the VCU has been seized it will put heavy loads on your rear diff and the IRD causing tremendous wear and excessive pressure on the gears and bearings.
If left it could shear a tooth on the gears and when that happened on mine it actually gracked the casing near the prop flange
By removing the shaft you could be limiting the damage and extending your chances of staying mobile a bit longer and having more options.
To be honest mine hadn't given too many clues before going. We'd done a long and fast journey the week previously (80 miles on fast straight road) which is when I suspect the oilseall for the driveshaft pushed out and unfortunately I hadn't noticed any oil leak before my wife went to the local shop to which there are several tight junctions. She'd noticed the grinding and braking effect on tight lock and when de-accelerating.
She tried to get it home slowly but at the last bend there was a loud crack and sickening grating noises. She came and got me and when I looked underneath I noticed the streak of oil from front to back underneath obviously blown along the week before. When I tried to move it it went forward okay in first but then when I lifted my right foot it ground to a halt akin to the HDC effect. It didn't like going backwards at all and complained bitterly when trying to turn. I managed to get it into our drive and removed the prop shaft so I could carefully drive it to the marina where I work so I could replace it.
I ended up buying a new IRD £720 and a new VCU £340. .Plus I replaced the support bearings at the same time, plus shipping to Greece. I wouldn't trust anyone here to work on my car and I've always done repairs myself anyway. So YES doing it yourself will keep the cost down!!!

We've had the car 9 years. We've been all over Europe. We love the thing. Having spent this money on it I hope to have it for another 9 years. It is ideal for our location and needs.

Anyway I'm not saying that this is whats wrong with yours and I accept no liabilty for what you do or don't choose to do.

But if it were me, I'd get that sump guard off PDQ and get in there to look for oil leaks. Check the oil levels. Test the VCU before you remove the shafts. Feel for excessive play between the drive shaft and the propshaft. Rotate them by hand in different directions to feel for tight spots or jamming.

Feel free to ask if you have any probs.

Hello chips

Is there a way to check if the vcu has seized up and dont worry the only ony who is liable is the garage who sold me the car 2 years ago.

Cheers

Do a search for testing vcu..i think it involves putting a white mark...with chalk or tipex..and driving a couple of meters..if the lines dont move the vcu is fooked
D

Yeh yeh, "tout le monde" say do the search, and yes you'll eventually find the answers on this fabulous forum. A pity this thread is titled "Gearbox problem" as any Freelander owner will most likely need to be aware of this issue.
I answer in detail as a fellow "Junior Member" who having stumbled across this forum, and realised the wealth of information and expertise available, can apreciate the sometimes tiresome efforts to extract relevant details.
So to you, Paulhed, I offer following as my understanding of the set up, and reitterate testing methods which are not necessarily of my design and claim no credit.

Testing the VCU. Viscous Coupling Unit.

It's best to understand what the VCU actually does and why it's required.

The engine provides drive via the gearbox and IRD (intermediate reduction drive) to the front wheels. Drive is also delivered to the rear wheels from the IRD. But, by design of gear ratios, at a slightly lower ratio. Result = Predominant front wheel drive with rear wheels chasing (eg. 60/40) which produces better road handling over pure equal ratio (50/50) as opposed to no drive to rear wheels i.e. 2WD. Rear wheels trailing. . (100/0)
The VCU acts as a slipping clutch and relieves "wind up" experienced on normal traction surfaces. (A tarmac road).
With me so far? In a straight line the wheels want to turn at the same speed, but they're connected to the gearbox at different ratios.

The VCU can be considered as two sides (shafts) connected via a number of plates in close proximity surrounded by a viscous liquid. The plates can rotate past each other at slow speed but if the speed increases the viscosity of the fluid binds the plates. (move your arm through water slowly is easy. try doing it fast).

SO - If your front wheels spin on a muddy surface, the front of the propshaft tries to rotate faster then the back, and the viscous effect delivers more drive to the rear. You'll only ever spin the back wheels if the fronts are locked. (and then your getting into traction control system-which is not mechanical)

VCUs "apparently" fail in two ways.
They free spin = No chance of 4wd
They seize = Wind up the transmission. (different ratio between fwd and rear axles)

To test:
1) Lift one wheel off the ground, and try to rotate it with a big lever on the wheel or a heavy bar through the propshaft UJ. ( obviously on the same side of the VCU as the wheel in the air) There should be rotation but quite difficult to move.

2) Paint a mark on the drum and the front shaft. (if in doubt mark both shafts and drum). Go for a drive on a slippery surface ("like a golf course" copyright Ming 2007) See if the marks have moved. If not, the VCU is seized.
N.B. more than "a few metres". More like, a mile or two.

Now I know why people say "do the search"

Dude, I've got no problem explaining stuff if you need help. I've been there too! Don't lose hope yet. everything is fixable at a price and only you can determine that.
I say "better the devil you know" and I've got to know a fair bit about my Freelander.
Don't be a stranger. This is a worthwhile Forum

P.S. Do the search!

Hello chips

Today i put a mark along the propshaft and the vcu took the car out for a spin for about 5 miles and today not a grind not even a noise i took it on some grass and the lines i put on the prop and vcu have not moved. Its got me stumped as it did not make one noise even on tight turns.Have you any ideas please

cheers paulhed

did you put the mark on the correct end of the VCU (front)?

I don't know if I should be pleased or concerned for you

How unfortunate trying to investigate the source of a worrying noise when it simply disappears.

Think hard and honestly back to when you first noticed it and how long it has lasted. Did it gradualy get worse or just appear one day? Is it still there really and you don't want to hear it? The symptoms you described really cried out to one thing. But on line diagnosis is never 100% as it could have just been a mud flap catching for all we can tell.

Maybe the grinding noise has gone, but you should be corncerned about your VCU. As The Mad Hat Man says did you mark it correctly.

You should see two drums under the car. (boom boom) The one at the back with bolt heads is the damper which rotates in unison with the actual VCU body at the front. it is the front shaft that should be able to rotate in the VCU. The rear shaft turns with the drums. So its the front you should focus on. There is a slim chance the marks lined up again when you checked so keep an eye on them.

The sure fire way is to get one rear wheel lifted and try to turn it with a big bar, or get a long lever that will fit into a Univeral Joint on the rear prop and see if you can turn it.

It will take the will power of not spending £300 to get it to move (if it's going to).

Like I said before, check the IRD oil level. Its a real pig to do but you'll regret it if the oil level has dropped.

Do you have any repair manuals. You can download the LR one from this forum ( search for RAVE) but I think it only covers Freelanders up to 2001 but that doesn't matter for the IRD checks.

Let us know how you get on

I hope I'm not too late!!!
Make sure the wheels are securely chocked and can't move before you start swinging on the propshaft!!!
The handbrake needs to be off

Fink you earthlings is gettin the hang er the gaylander vcu ird problems . . . .I'm startin to get impressed . . . . .

Hail Ming
Master of the Universe.
Ruler of all he surveys.
Conqueror of the Freeland ers.









Followed by scattered showers with sunny intervals.

Chips said:

Hail Ming
Master of the Universe.
Ruler of all he surveys.
Conqueror of the Freeland ers.









Followed by scattered showers with sunny intervals.

Click to expand...

ER . . . .steady now

'scuse me. Don't know what came over me.
Feeling a bit light headed when I noticed I've lost my "junior" status.
Normal service will be resumed
once I've found out what this bits for.

fool proof way of testing VCU using markings is to mark the prop shafts on either side of it. A line on the bottom of each shaft, go for a few mile drive and check if they are still inline.