Sluggish Nissano Terrano

Hi chaps
I have a 5yr old Terrano II which has 90,000 miles on the clock.
In the past year it has become increasingly sluggish in 5th,4th and
recently 3rd. ie.. the gradual motorway gradients that it used to hold
comfortably in 5th are now requiring a change down to 4th-and even
that does not produce a surge.Indeed, 4th seems,in that situation, no
better!
Ist and 2nd are fine but I have detected in 2nd a feeling of slight
shuddering, and whilst 3rd gets me up to 'speed' it is not brilliant
and quite modest in output.
I have not had issues with starting, and reasonably regularly put in
fuel injector cleaners.
My son-in-law suggests that the injector pump is not functioning
correctly- and added that the injectors themselves may be clogged up.
I have the vehicle booked in at my local garage at the end of next
week and they are going to look at the issue. But I thought I would
pop in to this newsgroup to see if anyone has experienced this.

And whilst I am asking,my driver window steadfastly refuses to lower
in hot weather and here the culprit seems to be the rubber
surround-various people have suggested I should renew the surround.
The other windows are fine

Thanks Robin

"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> schreef in
bericht news:[email protected]...
> Hi chaps
> I have a 5yr old Terrano II which has 90,000 miles on the clock.
> In the past year it has become increasingly sluggish in 5th,4th and
> recently 3rd. ie.. the gradual motorway gradients that it used to hold
> comfortably in 5th are now requiring a change down to 4th-and even
> that does not produce a surge.Indeed, 4th seems,in that situation, no
> better!
> Ist and 2nd are fine but I have detected in 2nd a feeling of slight
> shuddering, and whilst 3rd gets me up to 'speed' it is not brilliant
> and quite modest in output.
> I have not had issues with starting, and reasonably regularly put in
> fuel injector cleaners.
> My son-in-law suggests that the injector pump is not functioning
> correctly- and added that the injectors themselves may be clogged up.
> I have the vehicle booked in at my local garage at the end of next
> week and they are going to look at the issue. But I thought I would
> pop in to this newsgroup to see if anyone has experienced this.
>
> And whilst I am asking,my driver window steadfastly refuses to lower
> in hot weather and here the culprit seems to be the rubber
> surround-various people have suggested I should renew the surround.
> The other windows are fine
>
> Thanks Robin

Yep, your son-in-law might be correct. I'd try some injector cleaner first.
If the motor has a distribution belt, it might be a tooth off position. Or
some new spark plugs maybe.

Have you tried some chaulk for the rubber?

Frank

"Painless" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> schreef in
> bericht news:[email protected]...
>> Hi chaps
>> I have a 5yr old Terrano II which has 90,000 miles on the clock.
>> In the past year it has become increasingly sluggish in 5th,4th and
>> recently 3rd. ie.. the gradual motorway gradients that it used to hold
>> comfortably in 5th are now requiring a change down to 4th-and even
>> that does not produce a surge.Indeed, 4th seems,in that situation, no
>> better!
>> Ist and 2nd are fine but I have detected in 2nd a feeling of slight
>> shuddering, and whilst 3rd gets me up to 'speed' it is not brilliant
>> and quite modest in output.
>> I have not had issues with starting, and reasonably regularly put in
>> fuel injector cleaners.
>> My son-in-law suggests that the injector pump is not functioning
>> correctly- and added that the injectors themselves may be clogged up.
>> I have the vehicle booked in at my local garage at the end of next
>> week and they are going to look at the issue. But I thought I would
>> pop in to this newsgroup to see if anyone has experienced this.
>>
>> And whilst I am asking,my driver window steadfastly refuses to lower
>> in hot weather and here the culprit seems to be the rubber
>> surround-various people have suggested I should renew the surround.
>> The other windows are fine
>>
>> Thanks Robin
>
> Yep, your son-in-law might be correct. I'd try some injector cleaner
> first.
> If the motor has a distribution belt, it might be a tooth off position. Or
> some new spark plugs maybe.
>


Although he is not specific, the OP mentions an injector pump so it is
fairly safe to assume a diesel engine and since it is five years old it is
probably the 2.7 indirect injection unit. This engine does not have a timing
belt so it is safe to assume the timing has remained within specification.
It is probable that there is either an air restriction of some kind or an
exhaust restriction. This could be due to a component of the exhaust gas
recirculation system being faulty. It will have a big throttle valve at the
inlet manifold and another on the exhaust side with a steel pipe leading to
the inlet side. In my experience the easiest and cheapest remedy is to
remove and block the small capillary tubes which control all the valves in
the system while checking that the exhaust valve is closed and inlet valve
is open. It can operate like this to advantage on a permanent basis. The
only disadvantage is a slight rise in NOx emission which is not tested for
at MOT. The main advantage is a significant increase in engine life all
other things being equal.

OTOH it could be something else entirely. Let us know what you find.

Huw

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 16:52:04 +0100, "Huw"
<hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

>OTOH it could be something else entirely. Let us know what you find.
>
>Huw
>
Huw-it turned out to need an new Air Flow meter, also known as an Air
mass Meter I believe. The difference is amazing-I roared along a dual
carriageway incline easily in 5th whereas I was struggling a bit in
4th!
Thanks for your suggestions
Robin

"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 16:52:04 +0100, "Huw"
> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>OTOH it could be something else entirely. Let us know what you find.
>>
>>Huw
>>
> Huw-it turned out to need an new Air Flow meter, also known as an Air
> mass Meter I believe. The difference is amazing-I roared along a dual
> carriageway incline easily in 5th whereas I was struggling a bit in
> 4th!
> Thanks for your suggestions
> Robin

So it is a petrol engine then? It does help to give a little basic detail
when asking a question if you expect a helpful answer. Nevertheless, thank
you for the feedback. The main weak point on most electronic petrol
injection engines is the air flow measuring device. Maybe one day someone
will build a reliable meter.

Huw

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 21:10:44 +0100, "Huw"
<hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:


>So it is a petrol engine then? It does help to give a little basic detail
>when asking a question if you expect a helpful answer. Nevertheless, thank
>you for the feedback.

Sorry- yes I did forget to mention 'diesel', which it is. I was shown
the offending item, which took 3 mins to re-fit. I could see a metal
strip inside the cylindrical object - looked very innocent.The Nissan
parts chap said to my local garage that he guessed it was that! The
difference is staggering.

However, whilst my issues have been sorted out my nieghbour's son's
Fiat has not.I think I described the issues here- his Fiat dealer was
told to fit a new turbo charger (at massive cost) which' might' sort
the issue. He declined to follow this route..
Cheers Robin

"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 21:10:44 +0100, "Huw"
> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>>So it is a petrol engine then? It does help to give a little basic detail
>>when asking a question if you expect a helpful answer. Nevertheless, thank
>>you for the feedback.
>
> Sorry- yes I did forget to mention 'diesel', which it is. I was shown
> the offending item, which took 3 mins to re-fit. I could see a metal
> strip inside the cylindrical object - looked very innocent.The Nissan
> parts chap said to my local garage that he guessed it was that! The
> difference is staggering.
>

Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the best of
my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an air
flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?

Huw

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
<hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the best of
>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an air
>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
>
>Huw

2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
cleaner.
Robin

"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the best
>>of
>>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an air
>>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
>>
>>Huw
>
> 2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
> cleaner.
> Robin

The 2.7 is a mechanically controlled engine which has exhaust gas
recirculation, a turbo and an intercooler. To my knowledge it does not have
an air flow meter which is a sensing device used with computer controlled
and electronically managed systems, principally in conjunction with
electronically managed higher pressure fuel injection. The 3.0 now
optionally fitted is of this type.

There are a number of possibilities here. Either the engine changed to
electronically controlled [fly by wire] at a late stage and I am not up with
the latest mods, or you have the definition of what was changed mixed up in
some way. It is also possible that you have been fed bull**** by someone to
satisfy your curiosity. The symptoms you described are certainly consistent
with an air flow meter failure, it is just that I do not believe such a
device is fitted to the 2.7.

Huw

On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 23:01:45 +0100, "Huw"
<hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

>
>"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
>message news:[email protected]...
>> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
>> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the best
>>>of
>>>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an air
>>>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
>>>
>>>Huw
>>
>> 2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
>> cleaner.
>> Robin
>
>The 2.7 is a mechanically controlled engine which has exhaust gas
>recirculation, a turbo and an intercooler. To my knowledge it does not have
>an air flow meter which is a sensing device used with computer controlled
>and electronically managed systems, principally in conjunction with
>electronically managed higher pressure fuel injection. The 3.0 now
>optionally fitted is of this type.
>

From another ng, Huw:
>All Terrano II's- that is from ~S reg onwards use fly by wire throttle and
>EDC using a bosch VP pump.
--
R
o
o
n
e
y

"I always knew the entire Green party were nutters" - Ken Livingstone

"Paul Rooney" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 23:01:45 +0100, "Huw"
> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
>>message news:[email protected]...
>>> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
>>> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the
>>>>best
>>>>of
>>>>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an air
>>>>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
>>>>
>>>>Huw
>>>
>>> 2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
>>> cleaner.
>>> Robin
>>
>>The 2.7 is a mechanically controlled engine which has exhaust gas
>>recirculation, a turbo and an intercooler. To my knowledge it does not
>>have
>>an air flow meter which is a sensing device used with computer controlled
>>and electronically managed systems, principally in conjunction with
>>electronically managed higher pressure fuel injection. The 3.0 now
>>optionally fitted is of this type.
>>
>
> From another ng, Huw:
>>All Terrano II's- that is from ~S reg onwards use fly by wire throttle and
>>EDC using a bosch VP pump.

If this is true then it is extremely unusual for an indirect injection
engine. Having said that, I have no other reason to doubt it because I have
not examined one that 'young'.

Huw

"Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Paul Rooney" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 23:01:45 +0100, "Huw"
> > <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
> >>message news:[email protected]...
> >>> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
> >>> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the
> >>>>best
> >>>>of
> >>>>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an
air
> >>>>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
> >>>>
> >>>>Huw
> >>>
> >>> 2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
> >>> cleaner.
> >>> Robin
> >>
> >>The 2.7 is a mechanically controlled engine which has exhaust gas
> >>recirculation, a turbo and an intercooler. To my knowledge it does not
> >>have
> >>an air flow meter which is a sensing device used with computer
controlled
> >>and electronically managed systems, principally in conjunction with
> >>electronically managed higher pressure fuel injection. The 3.0 now
> >>optionally fitted is of this type.
> >>
> >
> > From another ng, Huw:
> >>All Terrano II's- that is from ~S reg onwards use fly by wire throttle
and
> >>EDC using a bosch VP pump.
>
> If this is true then it is extremely unusual for an indirect injection
> engine. Having said that, I have no other reason to doubt it because I
have
> not examined one that 'young'.

Yes, but its not. All Teranno II's badged TDi's are exactly that- direct
injection. And they are electronically managed.

Tim..

"Tim.." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Huw" <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> "Paul Rooney" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>> > On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 23:01:45 +0100, "Huw"
>> > <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>"Robin Nicholson" <[email protected]> wrote in
>> >>message news:[email protected]...
>> >>> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:34:48 +0100, "Huw"
>> >>> <hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>>Unless it is the 'new' 3.0 direct injection 158hp engine then to the
>> >>>>best
>> >>>>of
>> >>>>my knowledge the 2.7 indirect injection engine just does not have an
> air
>> >>>>flow meter. Basic details are essential. Is it a three litre?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Huw
>> >>>
>> >>> 2664cc. The new part was fitted just to the engine side of the air
>> >>> cleaner.
>> >>> Robin
>> >>
>> >>The 2.7 is a mechanically controlled engine which has exhaust gas
>> >>recirculation, a turbo and an intercooler. To my knowledge it does not
>> >>have
>> >>an air flow meter which is a sensing device used with computer
> controlled
>> >>and electronically managed systems, principally in conjunction with
>> >>electronically managed higher pressure fuel injection. The 3.0 now
>> >>optionally fitted is of this type.
>> >>
>> >
>> > From another ng, Huw:
>> >>All Terrano II's- that is from ~S reg onwards use fly by wire throttle
> and
>> >>EDC using a bosch VP pump.
>>
>> If this is true then it is extremely unusual for an indirect injection
>> engine. Having said that, I have no other reason to doubt it because I
> have
>> not examined one that 'young'.
>
> Yes, but its not. All Teranno II's badged TDi's are exactly that- direct
> injection. And they are electronically managed.
>

TDi in Nissan speak does not mean 'direct injection'. It means, if indeed it
has a meaning, 'turbocharged diesel injection'. It is just creative
marketing. The only direct injection engine fitted to the Nissan Terrano in
the UK is the 3.0.

The main difference between the early 100hp and the later 125hp unit is the
fitting of an intercooler and a heavy duty gearbox, not a difference in fuel
injection design. The 3.0 is essentially the same unit as that fitted to the
Patrol which has a computer controlled version of the VP30 mechanical rotary
injection pump, similar to that fitted to my six cylinder Land Cruiser and
another engine I own.

Huw

"Tim.." <[email protected]> wrote

>
> Yes, but its not. All Teranno II's badged TDi's are exactly that- direct
> injection. And they are electronically managed.
>
> Tim..
>
>


Just for confirmation, from http://www.whatvan.co.uk/roadtest.asp?id=3967
The 3.0-litre isn't the only engine available. You can opt for a 125 bhp
2.7-litre indirect injection turbodiesel instead. Choose that power option
and you can specify either SE or standard trim END.

The 2.7 has never been produced or sold in the UK as a direct injection
engine. Since you cannot get this basic fact correct you will forgive me if
I doubt your second sentence.

Huw

Tim.. ([email protected]) gurgled happily, sounding much like
they were saying :

> All Teranno II's badged TDi's are exactly that- direct injection.

The D in TDi isn't always "Direct" - it's normally plain ol' "Diesel".

I don't think many people would argue that TDi Terranos are normally
diesels.

"Adrian" wrote
> I don't think many people would argue that TDi Terranos are normally
> diesels.
I would.....