Diesel P38 UNDER-heating

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dogsbody

dogsbody

Very senior member
Posts
10,685
Location
Bristol
2000 P38 2.5 Diesel

I've owned this for just under a year and the temperature gauge has only ever got out of the cold section when pulling up a long hill. It's not the gauge or the sender because the heater doesn't put out much heat either.

I'd always assumed that it was either a faulty or missing stat and, with all the posts on here about overheating and cracked heads I was in no hurry to sort it out.

Today I've gone for it and got the stat out. It's stamped 'Made in Germany' and, using the boiling water test, it's working pefectly!!

However on my way through I found that the viscous fan wasn't turning easily. I've never played with a viscous fan before. So, three questions.
When it's cold how easily should it spin?
Could a permanently turning fan hold the engine temperature right down?
Whilst I'm that far in is there anything else worth checking?
 
Fan should spin fairly easily when cold, and yes it will hold the temperature down if the viscous coupler has seized. Bin it and fit a stat to the aircon fans.
 
Datatek said:
Fan should spin fairly easily when cold, and yes it will hold the temperature down if the viscous coupler has seized. Bin it and fit a stat to the aircon fans.
Click to expand...


Sorry to come back again but it's this 'spins easily' that I'm trying to get the bottom of. I've got the fan out,I hold the nut in the middle and I can turn the fan but with a fair bit of resistance. Fu**ed?
 
Datatek said:
Fan should spin fairly easily when cold, and yes it will hold the temperature down if the viscous coupler has seized. Bin it and fit a stat to the aircon fans.
Click to expand...


And another slight problem. The air con fans are in the garage along with the knackered air con condensor. That job was definitely waiting for some better weather.
:D
 
dogsbody said:
Sorry to come back again but it's this 'spins easily' that I'm trying to get the bottom of. I've got the fan out,I hold the nut in the middle and I can turn the fan but with a fair bit of resistance. Fu**ed?
Click to expand...
They vary, there will be some resistance which lessens after the engine is started and stirs the thing up, the drive then stiffens up as the temperature rises. Go for a short run without the fan fitted (don't get stuck in traffic or snow) and watch the temperature guage, if it gets up to normal, the fan is the problem, if it does not, it's the stat or the temp sensor.
 
Datatek said:
They vary, there will be some resistance which lessens after the engine is started and stirs the thing up, the drive then stiffens up as the temperature rises. Go for a short run without the fan fitted (don't get stuck in traffic or snow) and watch the temperature guage, if it gets up to normal, the fan is the problem, if it does not, it's the stat or the temp sensor.
Click to expand...

Thanks very much, and I do mean that, having got this far, in four inches of snow, it's great to be able to come into the warm and talk to somebody.

However, that's the one answer I didn't want to hear. On my 2000 Rangie they've fitted a one piece fan cowl so I had to remove the rad, and the oil cooler, and the intercooler to get to the fan!

Anyway, as usual, you're talking sense so I'll have try something like a run. The horrible decision I've got now is, do I re-fit the original stat (with a new O ring or fit the replacement that I'd bought for the job. I've just taken it out the box and it's a Britpart!
:doh:
 
dogsbody said:
Thanks very much, and I do mean that, having got this far, in four inches of snow, it's great to be able to come into the warm and talk to somebody.

However, that's the one answer I didn't want to hear. On my 2000 Rangie they've fitted a one piece fan cowl so I had to remove the rad, and the oil cooler, and the intercooler to get to the fan!

Anyway, as usual, you're talking sense so I'll have try something like a run. The horrible decision I've got now is, do I re-fit the original stat (with a new O ring or fit the replacement that I'd bought for the job. I've just taken it out the box and it's a Britpart!
:doh:
Click to expand...


****part Arghhh. Test it first, pop it in a pan of boiling water, it should open fairly quickly, when its fully open, hook it out of the boiling water, put under the running cold tap and watch that it closes completely without taking too long.
 
dogsbody said:
Thanks very much, and I do mean that, having got this far, in four inches of snow, it's great to be able to come into the warm and talk to somebody.

However, that's the one answer I didn't want to hear. On my 2000 Rangie they've fitted a one piece fan cowl so I had to remove the rad, and the oil cooler, and the intercooler to get to the fan!

Anyway, as usual, you're talking sense so I'll have try something like a run. The horrible decision I've got now is, do I re-fit the original stat (with a new O ring or fit the replacement that I'd bought for the job. I've just taken it out the box and it's a Britpart!
:doh:
Click to expand...

The fan is removed without doing any of that. You need to remove the fan to remove the fan cowl. But just lift cowl up to remove fan. Fan can be checked for free movement in situe without removing anything. With engine cold just hold fan with finger pressure whilst someone starts engine. If you can hold it easily it's ok. If it breaks your fingers or pulls your arm off it's not. Just joking, but it can be held by hand IF you know what your doing. Fit the new stat it will be fine, don't believe everything you read on here.
 
wammers said:
The fan is removed without doing any of that. You need to remove the fan to remove the fan cowl. But just lift cowl up to remove fan. Fan can be checked for free movement in situe without removing anything. With engine cold just hold fan with finger pressure whilst someone starts engine. If you can hold it easily it's ok. If it breaks your fingers or pulls your arm off it's not. Just joking, but it can be held by hand IF you know what your doing. Fit the new stat it will be fine, don't believe everything you read on here.
Click to expand...


Accident & Emergency
Bristol Royal Infirmary
Bristol BS1​

Dear Wammers,

Thank you for your suggestion on how to test my viscous fan. I think that it's fairly safe to that that it's buggered. Well if it wasn't before it is now!

The ambulance crew said that the hospital might be able to sew some of my fingers back on but even following the trail of blood spatter over the hedge into my neighbours garden we were unable to find them. My neighbour does have a dog and when we entered the garden I'd swear that it was licking it's lips and was very interested in sniffing what's left of my arm.

As you've already been so kind in showing me how to test for this fault I hate to bother you further but would you, by any chance, know where I can buy one of those spinner handles that can be fitted onto steering wheels. I have a feeling that I might need one.

Again, thank you very much for your help.

Dogsbody.
 
dogsbody said:
Accident & Emergency

Bristol Royal Infirmary
Bristol BS1​

Dear Wammers,

Thank you for your suggestion on how to test my viscous fan. I think that it's fairly safe to that that it's buggered. Well if it wasn't before it is now!

The ambulance crew said that the hospital might be able to sew some of my fingers back on but even following the trail of blood spatter over the hedge into my neighbours garden we were unable to find them. My neighbour does have a dog and when we entered the garden I'd swear that it was licking it's lips and was very interested in sniffing what's left of my arm.

As you've already been so kind in showing me how to test for this fault I hate to bother you further but would you, by any chance, know where I can buy one of those spinner handles that can be fitted onto steering wheels. I have a feeling that I might need one.

Again, thank you very much for your help.

Dogsbody.
Click to expand...

Ha Ha nice one. But i kid you not, that is how i test them. If you hold fan correctly and it is seized it will throw your fingers off out of harms way. Trying to stop one with your fingers is the really skillful bit but it can be done. Not for the inexperienced though.:):):)
 
ave read some crappy advice on here over the years but holding onto the fan and having the engine turned over wins the stupid advise of the decade award by a long long way

someone of your apparent experience should be ashamed of yourself for making that suggestion wammers
 
wammers said:
The fan is removed without doing any of that. You need to remove the fan to remove the fan cowl. But just lift cowl up to remove fan. Fan can be checked for free movement in situe without removing anything. With engine cold just hold fan with finger pressure whilst someone starts engine. If you can hold it easily it's ok. If it breaks your fingers or pulls your arm off it's not. Just joking, but it can be held by hand IF you know what your doing. Fit the new stat it will be fine, don't believe everything you read on here.
Click to expand...

When you say the fan and cowl can be removed "without doing any of that" are you talking about pre 99MY or post 99MY? On my 2000 you need to remove rad hoses and EGR pipe at the very least to get the one piece cowl out. The old 96 is much easier.
As for your suggestion on testing the fan, I can only hope you are ****ed out of your skull. No one sober could possibly suggest such a stupid dangerous way of checking the fan. No wonder the UK needs a Health and Safety Executive:eek:
 
Datatek said:
As for your suggestion on testing the fan, I can only hope you are ****ed out of your skull. No one sober could possibly suggest such a stupid dangerous way of checking the fan. No wonder the UK needs a Health and Safety Executive:eek:
Click to expand...

don't worry he's armless
 
'scuse me, if any-one's making the jokes on here it's me.

I can still type with only one arm working you know.
 
Datatek said:
When you say the fan and cowl can be removed "without doing any of that" are you talking about pre 99MY or post 99MY? On my 2000 you need to remove rad hoses and EGR pipe at the very least to get the one piece cowl out. The old 96 is much easier.
As for your suggestion on testing the fan, I can only hope you are ****ed out of your skull. No one sober could possibly suggest such a stupid dangerous way of checking the fan. No wonder the UK needs a Health and Safety Executive:eek:
Click to expand...

Just depends how long youv'e been at it Data. It is very straight forward but only if you know what your doing. You know your job i know mine. The fan can be remove without taking the rad and cowl out. That is what i said. There maybe a few incidental things, but you dont need to remove the rad to get the fan out you don't need to remove the cowl either. This guy has stripped the radiator, intercooler, cowl to get at fan.
 
when i changed the stat,waterpump on mine i cheated and cut a 4 inch chunk out of the bottom of the fan cowling so now all i have to do is take the top hose off and the clips what hold the cowl in place and i can just twist it out with ease and still leave the viscous fan in place
 
Last edited:
wammers said:
Just depends how long youv'e been at it Data. It is very straight forward but only if you know what your doing. You know your job i know mine. The fan can be remove without taking the rad and cowl out. That is what i said. There maybe a few incidental things, but you dont need to remove the rad to get the fan out you don't need to remove the cowl either. This guy has stripped the radiator, intercooler, cowl to get at fan.
Click to expand...

Sorry WAMMERS but I've been out this morning to see if I've made a balls-up of this but I stand by my saying that you cannot get the fan out without taking the cowl off and on my Rangie it's a one piece cowl that's clipped under the bottom of the rad so there is no way to lift it.

So, the only choice I had was to move the rad forward to clear the fan so the oil cooler had to be moved.

Before I rebuild I think that I'll be taking 'P38on22s' advice and modifying the bottom of the cowl.
 
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